RE: Blow out! The modern tyre dilemma
Discussion
V8RX7 said:
Why do some consider it essential to carry a large spare wheel / jack etc when we don't carry hoses / relays etc ?
Never had a hose* or a battery fail on me. Had coils and clutches go, but never a hose or a battery while away from home.OK, that's not strictly true - the battery retainer and the negative terminal on the NSX both worked loose after crossing the Bealach na Ba - the car was dead as a dodo until I discovered the problem and dug out a 10mm spanner.
* Tempting fate here...that's one of the next big jobs on the old girl...
i don't have a spare wheel but have the puncture string.
Never had to use it but I bought it after seeing good reviews from users
https://www.tyrebaydirect.com/wp-content/uploads/n...
Never had to use it but I bought it after seeing good reviews from users
https://www.tyrebaydirect.com/wp-content/uploads/n...
A timely thread for me! Just got home after spending 40 minutes on the roadside changing the wheel on my Discovery (huge chunk of metal sticking out of the middle of the tread so way beyond tyre weld).
About twenty minutes of that time was spent watching a Youtube video of how to winch down the spare wheel. Then a further ten minutes working out that the jack handle is formed using the wheel brace. Add to that the not insignificant amount of physical effort involved, the brake dust engrained in your hands and the crawling around on wet tarmac in the freezing cold and I can see why most people call the AA. Or why the slightly adventurous might try out the tyre weld!
About twenty minutes of that time was spent watching a Youtube video of how to winch down the spare wheel. Then a further ten minutes working out that the jack handle is formed using the wheel brace. Add to that the not insignificant amount of physical effort involved, the brake dust engrained in your hands and the crawling around on wet tarmac in the freezing cold and I can see why most people call the AA. Or why the slightly adventurous might try out the tyre weld!
One puncture in 25 years of motoring. It was on a “smart” motorway, so I was out of the car and phoning the AA as fast as my legs could carry me. Worse, it was on an elevated section somewhere near Birmingham, so no verge to climb.
Even I’m not daft enough to change an offside wheel at night on a smart motorway, so a spare would not have done me any good. AA man and Highways agency arrived, recovered me to a services, and about an hour later, a nice man in a mobile tyre fitting van arrived and replaced the tyre.
IMO you have about as much justication carrying a spare battery, cooling hoses and probably a clutch as a spare wheel.
Even I’m not daft enough to change an offside wheel at night on a smart motorway, so a spare would not have done me any good. AA man and Highways agency arrived, recovered me to a services, and about an hour later, a nice man in a mobile tyre fitting van arrived and replaced the tyre.
IMO you have about as much justication carrying a spare battery, cooling hoses and probably a clutch as a spare wheel.
IT’S NOT A FOAM ITS A LIQUID RUBBER SEALANT THATS SUPPOSED TO SEAL A SMALL HOLE NOT A HUGE GASH.
No spare is a bad idea but has been done for a few reasons.
A fair few cars now have a flat boot and no where to put a spare due to silly exhausts.
Twin exit exhausts I’m looking at you or vxr with central exit.
In the green world we live in no spare means less weight so less weight more mpg.
Maybe extra 10 yards to gallon but over the life of the car it adds up
As has been discussed many times on PistonHeads some folk will just hurt themselves or others as they don’t have a clue how to change a wheel or want to learn how.
But mostly it’s not a can of expanding foam in the boot
No spare is a bad idea but has been done for a few reasons.
A fair few cars now have a flat boot and no where to put a spare due to silly exhausts.
Twin exit exhausts I’m looking at you or vxr with central exit.
In the green world we live in no spare means less weight so less weight more mpg.
Maybe extra 10 yards to gallon but over the life of the car it adds up
As has been discussed many times on PistonHeads some folk will just hurt themselves or others as they don’t have a clue how to change a wheel or want to learn how.
But mostly it’s not a can of expanding foam in the boot
rxe said:
IMO you have about as much justification carrying a spare battery, cooling hoses and probably a clutch as a spare wheel.
Each to their own - I prefer not to rely on anybody else if I can avoid it: survival instinct, I guess. I have a basic level of recovery through my bank, but have called on it twice in 33 years of driving.I must be in the minority here - I've removed the spare tyre from my last two cars and stick them in the garage.
This isn't because I can't change a tyre, far from it. It's partly to save weight, but mainly because I can then use the well to put a can of tyre foam, winter coat, hat, gloves, scarf, tow rope, spare bulbs, torch, jump leads, granola bars, water, high vis and lord-knows-what-else in case I break down.
Like alot of people I have a packaged bank account that includes breakdown cover, so if I get a puncture (none in 17 years of driving so far) and the foam fails, I'd just use the service I pay for to recover me.
Perhaps it's the fact I've not had one yet - my plan may well let me down when theory turns into practice!
Luke
This isn't because I can't change a tyre, far from it. It's partly to save weight, but mainly because I can then use the well to put a can of tyre foam, winter coat, hat, gloves, scarf, tow rope, spare bulbs, torch, jump leads, granola bars, water, high vis and lord-knows-what-else in case I break down.
Like alot of people I have a packaged bank account that includes breakdown cover, so if I get a puncture (none in 17 years of driving so far) and the foam fails, I'd just use the service I pay for to recover me.
Perhaps it's the fact I've not had one yet - my plan may well let me down when theory turns into practice!
Luke
LukeyC said:
I must be in the minority here - I've removed the spare tyre from my last two cars and stick them in the garage.
This isn't because I can't change a tyre, far from it. It's partly to save weight, but mainly because I can then use the well to put a can of tyre foam, winter coat, hat, gloves, scarf, tow rope, spare bulbs, torch, jump leads, granola bars, water, high vis and lord-knows-what-else in case I break down.
Like alot of people I have a packaged bank account that includes breakdown cover, so if I get a puncture (none in 17 years of driving so far) and the foam fails, I'd just use the service I pay for to recover me.
Perhaps it's the fact I've not had one yet - my plan may well let me down when theory turns into practice!
Luke
I got this breakdown service with my insurance. My subaru legacy came with only a can of spray. It gives me the sThis isn't because I can't change a tyre, far from it. It's partly to save weight, but mainly because I can then use the well to put a can of tyre foam, winter coat, hat, gloves, scarf, tow rope, spare bulbs, torch, jump leads, granola bars, water, high vis and lord-knows-what-else in case I break down.
Like alot of people I have a packaged bank account that includes breakdown cover, so if I get a puncture (none in 17 years of driving so far) and the foam fails, I'd just use the service I pay for to recover me.
Perhaps it's the fact I've not had one yet - my plan may well let me down when theory turns into practice!
Luke
ts just thinking about getting stuck on a mountain road in the winter snow with no spare. and then i remember the immortal words of my uncle who was caught in a similar situation nearly 40 years ago with no spare: 'f
k it we'll rim it!!!'kambites said:
I think car manufacturers are fully aware that the huge majority of drivers aren't capable of changing a wheel anyway (or aren't willing to attempt it, which has much the same effect), which makes lugging around 30kg of stuff for the purpose a bit pointless.
:
The "huge majority" of drivers are perfectly capable of changing a wheel. What has become of men? I take pride in the fact of being able to change a wheel on my car by myself if needed. You can be back on the road in 15 mins instead of waiting 1 hour + for the breakdown service to arrive.:
It’s a moot point whether anyone unqualified should be encouraged to faf around with something as fundamental to safety as a wheel.
Back in the day all cars had a spare full size matching wheel. You were also encouraged to rotate wheels to different positions on the car to max-out tyre life. This process often included the spare. Despite what’s written here tyres have changed a lot as in we now have ultra low profile on even modest cars, asymmetrical tread, and are sensitive to direction of rotation and fitment. Like grease nipples and draining the radiator on a cold night perhaps unqualified roadside wheel changing is heading for the history books. Better this than getting flattened on the hard shoulder whilst trying to find the jacking point or fit the special bolts supplied for your space saver spare. It’s run flats (harsh ride) or the RAC for me.
Back in the day all cars had a spare full size matching wheel. You were also encouraged to rotate wheels to different positions on the car to max-out tyre life. This process often included the spare. Despite what’s written here tyres have changed a lot as in we now have ultra low profile on even modest cars, asymmetrical tread, and are sensitive to direction of rotation and fitment. Like grease nipples and draining the radiator on a cold night perhaps unqualified roadside wheel changing is heading for the history books. Better this than getting flattened on the hard shoulder whilst trying to find the jacking point or fit the special bolts supplied for your space saver spare. It’s run flats (harsh ride) or the RAC for me.
hardworker said:
kambites said:
I think car manufacturers are fully aware that the huge majority of drivers aren't capable of changing a wheel anyway (or aren't willing to attempt it, which has much the same effect), which makes lugging around 30kg of stuff for the purpose a bit pointless.
:
The "huge majority" of drivers are perfectly capable of changing a wheel. What has become of men? I take pride in the fact of being able to change a wheel on my car by myself if needed. You can be back on the road in 15 mins instead of waiting 1 hour + for the breakdown service to arrive.:
Most people (not just men) SHOULD BE capable of changing a wheel.
But they've never had to, never been taught how to, and because it relates to the car (which is for most people a 'black box' now - they've no idea how it actually works), they're afraid of it and/or not interested in it - "somebody else's problem".
This is compounded by the motor industry actually making it more DIFFICULT to change than it used to be:-
- Space-savers which only fit on one axle...
- ...or need different bolts;
- Ultra-big (and ultra-heavy) alloys on even mundane saloons / small SUVs*, which are a b
h to lift and manhandle into position even for an average sized bloke;- Use of bolts by most manufacturers, rather than studs and nuts, makes it more difficult to locate a wheel on the hub;
- ...and that's before you need to try doing it in the dark.
hardworker said:
The "huge majority" of drivers are perfectly capable of changing a wheel. What has become of men? I take pride in the fact of being able to change a wheel on my car by myself if needed. You can be back on the road in 15 mins instead of waiting 1 hour + for the breakdown service to arrive.
It should be part of the Driving Test, at least to have an idea of what to do (actually it might be, but nobody seems to pay any attention). I accept that not everybody will be physically capable of it, but where they are, they should know. My 10 year old recently completed his BikeAbility course (oldies like me will remember the Cycling Proficiency Scheme), where basic bike maintenance is discussed at length.Earl of Petrol said:
It’s a moot point whether anyone unqualified should be encouraged to faf around with something as fundamental to safety as a wheel.
Back in the day all cars had a spare full size matching wheel. You were also encouraged to rotate wheels to different positions on the car to max-out tyre life. This process often included the spare. Despite what’s written here tyres have changed a lot as in we now have ultra low profile on even modest cars, asymmetrical tread, and are sensitive to direction of rotation and fitment. Like grease nipples and draining the radiator on a cold night perhaps unqualified roadside wheel changing is heading for the history books. Better this than getting flattened on the hard shoulder whilst trying to find the jacking point or fit the special bolts supplied for your space saver spare. It’s run flats (harsh ride) or the RAC for me.
Absolutely times have changed, technology has moved on and tyres should not be rotated - a neat little bit of planned obsolescence by tyre manufacturers, don't you think? But are we too reliant on external assistance?Back in the day all cars had a spare full size matching wheel. You were also encouraged to rotate wheels to different positions on the car to max-out tyre life. This process often included the spare. Despite what’s written here tyres have changed a lot as in we now have ultra low profile on even modest cars, asymmetrical tread, and are sensitive to direction of rotation and fitment. Like grease nipples and draining the radiator on a cold night perhaps unqualified roadside wheel changing is heading for the history books. Better this than getting flattened on the hard shoulder whilst trying to find the jacking point or fit the special bolts supplied for your space saver spare. It’s run flats (harsh ride) or the RAC for me.
To illustrate a point: a few years ago I was heading south down the M1 taking my son (the now 10 year old mentioned above) to Brands Hatch. A Mazda 323F had stopped in lane 3 (of 4) with a puncture: the driver was out of the car, looking at the nearside rear wheel and scratching his head. He clearly had NO IDEA what to do and were it not 7am would probably have caused untold carnage as cars swerved around him and his hapless passengers. DRIVERS MUST BE AWARE OF WHAT TO DO IN THESE CIRCUMSTANCES, at least appreciating the most basic of needs: safety - whether they choose to carry their own self-fix or rely on others risking their lives to bail them out.
Cars are sold on a mixture of price, weight, fuel economy, speed and CO2.
Carrying a spare wheel negatively impacts every single one of the above.
The number of new car buyers who won't buy a car without a full sized spare is very, very small. Second-hand buyers are irrelevant.
That's why the manufacturers aren't fitting them.
Carrying a spare wheel negatively impacts every single one of the above.
The number of new car buyers who won't buy a car without a full sized spare is very, very small. Second-hand buyers are irrelevant.
That's why the manufacturers aren't fitting them.
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