Driving Position Ergonomics - Anyone ever noticed??
Discussion
Not only are some cars badly designed for ergonomics, but a lot of people don't really have a clue how to set themselves up to have a decent posture for comfort and control, especially over long distances.
The best couple of cars I've ever done distance in were the EP3 Civic and the Accord that followed. Both had excellent long distance seats, good support where you needed it, perfect adjustability and reach for the controls and no annoying niggles (for me).
The best couple of cars I've ever done distance in were the EP3 Civic and the Accord that followed. Both had excellent long distance seats, good support where you needed it, perfect adjustability and reach for the controls and no annoying niggles (for me).
I think the Elise is good for the 90th percentile that it was designed for, but the lack of adjustment means it's pretty terrible for everyone else. For me, the relative position of the pedals and steering wheel is just wrong, if I put the seat somewhere I can comfortably reach the steering wheel, my knees are around my ears, if I put the seat in the right place for comfortable use of the pedals, I can't reach the steering wheel. Ideally I'd have the wheel a good four inches closer to me than the standard setup.
I'm working on the bits to sort it out - I need new indicator stalks that lean forwards far enough that I can reach them with a four inch wheel spacer and I need to modify the gear stick to bring it closer to the new steering wheel position. The gear stick I think I can just bend to shape, the indicator stalks are proving more troublesome.
The whole chassis narrows towards the front of the car so you do sit slightly pointing towards the centre of the car, but I've never found that a problem.
The Punto is absolutely terrible in just about all respects.
I'm working on the bits to sort it out - I need new indicator stalks that lean forwards far enough that I can reach them with a four inch wheel spacer and I need to modify the gear stick to bring it closer to the new steering wheel position. The gear stick I think I can just bend to shape, the indicator stalks are proving more troublesome.
The whole chassis narrows towards the front of the car so you do sit slightly pointing towards the centre of the car, but I've never found that a problem.
The Punto is absolutely terrible in just about all respects.
Edited by kambites on Wednesday 20th October 10:12
ShadownINja said:
cptsideways said:
If you can name the either of the two worst cars above you win a *
Mercedes CLK63 AMG. Sat in one and thought it was a ridiculous offset that put me off owning one.Edited by ShadownINja on Wednesday 20th October 01:18
Current C Class is one of the worst, notice how you never see an overhead view of the cabin in any of the brochures 
Amazing that people have the quoted the other worst car as one they consider comfy, it is of German origin btw.
Interestingly the best by a long way are typically Japanese cars, deisgned as RHD & the nips have a thing about the body being comfy.
Kateg28 said:
acf8181 said:
Best i've ever experienced is my old mk2 mr2.....perfection
And the MK1 MR2. Again it is Japanese so built RHD first so that may be the reason.kambites said:
cptsideways said:
Interestingly the best by a long way are typically Japanese cars, deisgned as RHD & the nips have a thing about the body being comfy.
They also tend to be short. As someone who is 6ft 1" I find most jap stuff has a comfier position for long legs, most euro cars the pedals are too close to the steering wheel, especially the French stuff. Volvo's would appear to be the exception, with great driving positions.Well.
My E36 actually has the pedals slightly offset to the right so you sit looking ever so slightly over your left shoulder. It's hardly noticeable until someone points it out to you.
Offsets the 355 which requires you to have your feet in the passenger footwell. Oddly though, you get used to driving it very quickly. Or maybe yo don't notice because all you're focussed on is finding the next tunnel?
My E36 actually has the pedals slightly offset to the right so you sit looking ever so slightly over your left shoulder. It's hardly noticeable until someone points it out to you.
Offsets the 355 which requires you to have your feet in the passenger footwell. Oddly though, you get used to driving it very quickly. Or maybe yo don't notice because all you're focussed on is finding the next tunnel?
cptsideways said:
But they predominantly design their cars for export As someone who is 6ft 1" I find most jap stuff has a comfier position for long legs, most euro cars the pedals are too close to the steering wheel, especially the French stuff. Volvo's would appear to be the exception, with great driving positions.
I think cars have generally got worse in this regard over the years. Manufacturers seem to believe that we're evolving back into monkeys. As someone who is 6ft 1" I find most jap stuff has a comfier position for long legs, most euro cars the pedals are too close to the steering wheel, especially the French stuff. Volvo's would appear to be the exception, with great driving positions.10 Pence Short said:
Not only are some cars badly designed for ergonomics, but a lot of people don't really have a clue how to set themselves up to have a decent posture for comfort and control, especially over long distances.
The best couple of cars I've ever done distance in were the EP3 Civic and the Accord that followed. Both had excellent long distance seats, good support where you needed it, perfect adjustability and reach for the controls and no annoying niggles (for me).
Completely agree with your point.The best couple of cars I've ever done distance in were the EP3 Civic and the Accord that followed. Both had excellent long distance seats, good support where you needed it, perfect adjustability and reach for the controls and no annoying niggles (for me).
I bought my EP3 in February and utterly hated the driving position and was getting a sore back after more than an hour of driving. The problem was that i had came from a car with a fixed position bucket seat in the drivers side, which surprisingly to many people made for the most comfortable driving i've ever experienced; which again says a lot about the company (Bride) and paying the extra money for a seat that has received some proper R&D.
However i looked into ergonomics and such like as at 22 i should not be getting a sore back from driving a car; and once i'd figured out a comfortable driving position my EP comes a very close second to my old civic.
kambites said:
And whilst we're on the subject of ergonomics, does anyone still make cars for the UK market with the indicator stalk on the right side?
I don't think I've ever had a car like that?
I also think I must be a completely different shape/proportions to Zod, as my Brera is spot on for me and over long distances is very comfortable (for me).
Zod said:
I hired an Alfa Brera. With the seat set so that my leg still had a slight bend with the clutch fully depressed, it was impossible to bring the steering wheel close enough to rest my wrist on the top with my shoulders touching the seat back. I have long arms. It has a crap driving position.
Cactussed said:
Offsets the 355 which requires you to have your feet in the passenger footwell. Oddly though, you get used to driving it very quickly. Or maybe yo don't notice because all you're focussed on is finding the next tunnel?
I'd have to ask the passenger to find the next tunnel, because in a 355 my knees are in front of my eyes 
I really have no idea why car manufacturers don't do more to address ergonomics. Is it simply decided on a profit and loss basis? i.e. If it costs £500,000 to design, engineer and test a telescoping steering column, and 80% of buyers don't need one, and the profit for the remaining 20% of buyers is less than £500,000, they don't bother?
RicksAlfas said:
kambites said:
And whilst we're on the subject of ergonomics, does anyone still make cars for the UK market with the indicator stalk on the right side?
I don't think I've ever had a car like that?Almost all left to right hand drive conversions seem to be horrible bodges, ergonomically.
Edited by kambites on Wednesday 20th October 11:03
robsco said:
kambites said:
And whilst we're on the subject of ergonomics, does anyone still make cars for the UK market with the indicator stalk on the right side?
Is the Hyundai Coupe still in production? I'm sure they did.Spot-on ergonomics & comfort too.
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