Black Ice hit - car a write off - Insurance experts please
Discussion
R1 Loon said:
Liquid Knight said:
70 in icy conditions? Lucky you can make a claim.
Why? There's nothing saying you can't claim if you drive like a tool in any policy, in fact few exclude drink driving (those that do are fairly recent exclusions too).Oh, and it was 75mph pre edit!
s3fella said:
R1 Loon said:
Liquid Knight said:
70 in icy conditions? Lucky you can make a claim.
Why? There's nothing saying you can't claim if you drive like a tool in any policy, in fact few exclude drink driving (those that do are fairly recent exclusions too).Oh, and it was 35mph pre edit!
Given the advice to change his post that's putting the boot in a bit in't it?
Edited by Fastra on Thursday 16th December 16:13
Fastra said:
s3fella said:
R1 Loon said:
Liquid Knight said:
70 in icy conditions? Lucky you can make a claim.
Why? There's nothing saying you can't claim if you drive like a tool in any policy, in fact few exclude drink driving (those that do are fairly recent exclusions too).Oh, and it was 7000mph pre edit!
Given the advice to change his post that's putting the boot in a bit in't it?
HowMuchLonger said:
Fastra said:
s3fella said:
R1 Loon said:
Liquid Knight said:
70 in icy conditions? Lucky you can make a claim.
Why? There's nothing saying you can't claim if you drive like a tool in any policy, in fact few exclude drink driving (those that do are fairly recent exclusions too).Oh, and it was 7000mph pre edit!
Given the advice to change his post that's putting the boot in a bit in't it?
CD10 at least if the
s were involved. Liquid Knight said:
Obviously lucky nobody was hurt but I wouldn't feel sorry for the OP if he was. Single vehicle accident because the driver was incapable of driving to the conditions of the road. Hopefully the sting of loosing the "no claims" will be enough to teach the driver a lesson.
CD10 at least if the s were involved.
Why's that?CD10 at least if the
s were involved. The conditions might have been looked perfectly acceptable. Thats the thing about black ice you dont know it's there until the back comes around.
If you knew it was there surely youd take account of it?
saaby93 said:
R1 Loon said:
A.J.M said:
Be careful with them. Sly b
ds will try and get out off anything!
BTW, what happened to the name & shame policy on this forum, or does that only apply to advertisers?ds will try and get out off anything!At least I edited out that bit in my post so it doesnt
[/quoteWas my own policy what was 7 weeks old. I had only done 1500 miles in the car and it was smashed by a lorry skidding on black ice. I had glasses guide, the 17 td4 SE hardback manual freelanders listed on autotrader with prices, mileages and colours. She claimed she could buy my car for £4400 hense the original offer. Which was bulls
t! She wouldnt up the offer and as i had my insurance suspended while they were throwing stupid low offers, i just took it to get insurance sorted and the cash to buy a replacement. Had to borrow cash from my folks though to pay for the new one as the payout wasnt enough and my excess took a couple of months to come through. The biggest irony is that the freelander i bought was, £6500. Was the same shape, year, colour, spec and from the same dealer as the first but with 20k less on the clock! But on the plus side, dispite them saying my premiums wouldnt go up, but did..
when i spoke to them about it, i spoke to a nice american guy who talked me through several options and got my increase down from £170 to £8. Im still with them for my insurance as they are the cheapest with the best add ons. Also the non fault smash i had at the start of the year was handled very well with them. Maybe its down to the person you speak on the phone...Liquid Knight said:
R1 Loon said:
Liquid Knight said:
70 in icy conditions? Lucky you can make a claim.
Why? There's nothing saying you can't claim if you drive like a tool in any policy, in fact few exclude drink driving (those that do are fairly recent exclusions too).With modern cars and road safety features, chances are that you'll walk away from a crash nowadays without a scratch (or at least no more than whiplash if you weren't at fault)
A.J.M said:
Was my own policy what was 7 weeks old. I had only done 1500 miles in the car and it was smashed by a lorry skidding on black ice. I had glasses guide, the 17 td4 SE hardback manual freelanders listed on autotrader with prices, mileages and colours. She claimed she could buy my car for £4400 hense the original offer. Which was bullst! She wouldnt up the offer and as i had my insurance suspended while they were throwing stupid low offers, i just took it to get insurance sorted and the cash to buy a replacement. Had to borrow cash from my folks though to pay for the new one as the payout wasnt enough and my excess took a couple of months to come through.
Has anyone ever said that you shouldn't use your own insurance for a third party claim? You'd have negotiated with the TPs insurer, sorted it to your satisfaction and not had any trouble with your own insurer about NCB, loss of the rest of the year's premium etc.t! She wouldnt up the offer and as i had my insurance suspended while they were throwing stupid low offers, i just took it to get insurance sorted and the cash to buy a replacement. Had to borrow cash from my folks though to pay for the new one as the payout wasnt enough and my excess took a couple of months to come through. Unless someone from insurance posts something different
Still no point harking back to what could have been
saaby93 said:
Has anyone ever said that you shouldn't use your own insurance for a third party claim? You'd have negotiated with the TPs insurer, sorted it to your satisfaction and not had any trouble with your own insurer about NCB, loss of the rest of the year's premium etc.
Unless someone from insurance posts something different
Still no point harking back to what could have been
What? Silly advice, IMHO.Unless someone from insurance posts something different
Still no point harking back to what could have been
Assuming repairable, then:-
Cons of using your own insurer:-
- You have to pay your NCB up front. It could take 1-2 months (maybe more if you've a crap insurer) to get it back.
Pro's
- They have a duty of care to you (3P insurer doesn't), meaning if there's any problems with the repairs (even if your choice of bodyshop), THEY will go into bat for you. (3P insurer will just pay bodyshop and say "your problem mate, we've fulfilled our responsibilities")
If it's a total-loss claim, then the point about having to pay your premium in full is (I think) null-and-void, as you'd have to do that anyway, whoever you claim from.
Either way, if it's an obvious non-fault claim then your NCB shouldn't be affected. If the 3P is disputing then you can't use their insurer anyway...
havoc said:
Pro's
- They have a duty of care to you (3P insurer doesn't), meaning if there's any problems with the repairs (even if your choice of bodyshop), THEY will go into bat for you. (3P insurer will just pay bodyshop and say "your problem mate, we've fulfilled our responsibilities")
nah - if theres any problem they'll usually defend their approved repairer and you end up arguing with your own insurer. Its not a very happy position to be in You're in a much stronger position when the TP is paying for the repairer you've agreed.- They have a duty of care to you (3P insurer doesn't), meaning if there's any problems with the repairs (even if your choice of bodyshop), THEY will go into bat for you. (3P insurer will just pay bodyshop and say "your problem mate, we've fulfilled our responsibilities")
havoc said:
If it's a total-loss claim, then the point about having to pay your premium in full is (I think) null-and-void, as you'd have to do that anyway, whoever you claim from.
Are you sure? If you buy a replacement car can't you do a normal mid term transfer of cover?havoc said:
Either way, if it's an obvious non-fault claim then your NCB shouldn't be affected.
Just as your cars in for repair your insurance needs renewal. Your NCD has been removed due to the claim going through. How easy to find reasonable insurance? Now run the same thing where the TP is repairing your car and your own insurance is unaffected. You can renew with any insurer you likehavoc said:
If the 3P is disputing then you can't use their insurer anyway...
Well you can argue a bit more forcefully or get help If it's 50:50 or your fault you either repair yourself or put it through your own insurance.
Anyway I thought the post showed why not to do it
R1 Loon said:
It costs £350, if we've acted reasonably, offered in line with policy and the customer has chosen to go through the three tier complaints process, as stipulated by the FSA, then we've no fear of the FOS.
You need to train your staff better if they panic at the mere mention of the FOS. They should explain the complaints process fully and deal with it accordingly. There is nothing to fear if you treat customers fairly. "Fairly" does NOT mean, giving them everything they want if their demands are unreasonable.
As has been proven on this thread, everybody thinks their car is the best one in the UK and worth more than any other, when in reality it rarely is.
It's not that they panic, they just make a sensible (albeit infuriating) decision that it's better to give the angry customer £100 so that they become a non-angry customer (regardless of whether we did anything wrong) rather than shell out the larger sum of money to have the Ombudsman look at it and deem that we are in the right.You need to train your staff better if they panic at the mere mention of the FOS. They should explain the complaints process fully and deal with it accordingly. There is nothing to fear if you treat customers fairly. "Fairly" does NOT mean, giving them everything they want if their demands are unreasonable.
As has been proven on this thread, everybody thinks their car is the best one in the UK and worth more than any other, when in reality it rarely is.
To let the complaint go to Ombudsman and ultimately cost more than just to give some goodwill is called "cutting your nose off to spite your face" I believe!
saaby93 said:
havoc said:
Pro's
- They have a duty of care to you (3P insurer doesn't), meaning if there's any problems with the repairs (even if your choice of bodyshop), THEY will go into bat for you. (3P insurer will just pay bodyshop and say "your problem mate, we've fulfilled our responsibilities")
nah - if theres any problem they'll usually defend their approved repairer and you end up arguing with your own insurer. Its not a very happy position to be in You're in a much stronger position when the TP is paying for the repairer you've agreed.- They have a duty of care to you (3P insurer doesn't), meaning if there's any problems with the repairs (even if your choice of bodyshop), THEY will go into bat for you. (3P insurer will just pay bodyshop and say "your problem mate, we've fulfilled our responsibilities")
(a) How many PH'ers will use an approved bodyshop?
(b) Once the TP insurer has received the invoice from the (non-approved) bodyshop they'll just pay it. So if you're in the unfortunate position of taking delivery of your repaired car in less-than-ideal conditions (e.g. rain), then you can't check it until you've signed for it, and then it becomes too late* to use them as leverage.
(c) My point about duty-of-care stands, particularly re: (b) above.
(d) If you're really bothered, use an accident-management company who'll do the arguing for you.
* Go on, ask em how I know this!
saaby93 said:
nah - if theres any problem they'll usually defend their approved repairer and you end up arguing with your own insurer. Its not a very happy position to be in You're in a much stronger position when the TP is paying for the repairer you've agreed.
What if there's not a problem? What if liability is disputed, you end up waiting to get your own car repaired? Of course none of this happens in the world according to saaby.
saaby93 said:
Are you sure? If you buy a replacement car can't you do a normal mid term transfer of cover?
FFS, this has already been discussed on this thread.saaby93 said:
Just as your cars in for repair your insurance needs renewal. Your NCD has been removed due to the claim going through. How easy to find reasonable insurance? Now run the same thing where the TP is repairing your car and your own insurance is unaffected. You can renew with any insurer you like
Would you advise that new or your current of your accident, or would you recommend they keep schtum and break a fundamental T&C of their insurance?saaby93 said:
Well you can argue a bit more forcefully or get help
If it's 50:50 or your fault you either repair yourself or put it through your own insurance.
Anyway I thought the post showed why not to do it
And we're back to the miracle of your preferred AMC who can always get liability agreed in your favour, even when it's not physically possible.If it's 50:50 or your fault you either repair yourself or put it through your own insurance.
Anyway I thought the post showed why not to do it
At what point do you wake up and smell the roses?
havoc said:
Won't argue with the bottom 3 points as they're probably valid. Not sure about this one though, as:-
(a) How many PH'ers will use an approved bodyshop?
(b) Once the TP insurer has received the invoice from the (non-approved) bodyshop they'll just pay it. So if you're in the unfortunate position of taking delivery of your repaired car in less-than-ideal conditions (e.g. rain), then you can't check it until you've signed for it, and then it becomes too late* to use them as leverage.
(c) My point about duty-of-care stands, particularly re: (b) above.
(d) If you're really bothered, use an accident-management company who'll do the arguing for you.
Sounds like it works ( or not) both ways.(a) How many PH'ers will use an approved bodyshop?
(b) Once the TP insurer has received the invoice from the (non-approved) bodyshop they'll just pay it. So if you're in the unfortunate position of taking delivery of your repaired car in less-than-ideal conditions (e.g. rain), then you can't check it until you've signed for it, and then it becomes too late* to use them as leverage.
(c) My point about duty-of-care stands, particularly re: (b) above.
(d) If you're really bothered, use an accident-management company who'll do the arguing for you.
Moral is dont collect it in the rain and don't sign it off until you've had a good look at it. Agreed about (d) provided it's not part of the same group as either insurer or you stand the chance of being back in the same boat
havoc said:
Won't argue with the bottom 3 points as they're probably valid. Not sure about this one though, as:-
(a) How many PH'ers will use an approved bodyshop?
(b) Once the TP insurer has received the invoice from the (non-approved) bodyshop they'll just pay it. So if you're in the unfortunate position of taking delivery of your repaired car in less-than-ideal conditions (e.g. rain), then you can't check it until you've signed for it, and then it becomes too late* to use them as leverage.
(c) My point about duty-of-care stands, particularly re: (b) above.
(d) If you're really bothered, use an accident-management company who'll do the arguing for you.
* Go on, ask em how I know this!
I've decided to give up with saaby. There's no point attempting to educate those who do not wish to be educated.(a) How many PH'ers will use an approved bodyshop?
(b) Once the TP insurer has received the invoice from the (non-approved) bodyshop they'll just pay it. So if you're in the unfortunate position of taking delivery of your repaired car in less-than-ideal conditions (e.g. rain), then you can't check it until you've signed for it, and then it becomes too late* to use them as leverage.
(c) My point about duty-of-care stands, particularly re: (b) above.
(d) If you're really bothered, use an accident-management company who'll do the arguing for you.
* Go on, ask em how I know this!
I truly wish there was an ignore function in this forum software, but please don't become the new me and fall into the trap of trying to educate him. Let him live his fantasies.
Gassing Station | General Gassing | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff