Are these Vloggers just a scam? SOL or Shmee etc???????

[JoeMarano]

Stupeo said:

Fair point - just not my cup of tea.

Annoys me too. Shmee is probably the best of all of them but I'd like to hear about cars now and then if that's what the channel is about.

[cgt2]

I think Shmee responds really well here and presents himself far better than on camera. He also uses a wider vocabulary in his posts than ''awwwwwwwwwwww-sum'' which seems to be the only word he knows on camera.

[15HN]

Shmee said:

15HN said:

The buying spree of latest special editions seems to be a total abuse of journalistic power imo. There are numerous people on this board who are genuine enthusiasts who aren't in it for the money and never have been but cannot get a car. I read years ago that Clarkson had to refuse a discount when he bought his SL to retain his credibility.

If you're going to be a journalist then be one. If you want to be a guy that buys and sells cars and makes videos then great but let's not confuse the two when you present yourself to manufacturers.

I'm not a journalist and I try to repeatedly say so, I'm a guy that likes cars and enjoys sharing them through a platform a lot of people have decided to follow. I'm fully aware that I don't have enough experience or qualifications to be a "journalist" so it would be stupid for me to claim otherwise.

Every car I've ordered is because I've seen and read about them online (the GT8 on PH as it happens) and ordered off the back of that. There are no incentives or discounts on any of the cars in my garage from manufacturers so I'm not sure how I'm abusing any power here.

Hello Shmee. Nice to hear from you.

I agree you lack the capability or skills of a professional journalist. No disrespect, just agreeing with you. You do however provide car news and reviews whilst having access to press events as well as extensive access to press vehicles to provide automotive content. That amounts to journalism irrespective of the quality of it and I expect that no manufacturer would give you such Press privileges/status if you made it clear or you were just a guy who likes cars and is making videos of them. Most guys like that won't even get into the showroom with a camera.

You may well have ordered cars off the back of online articles however I suspect that your status and access to marketeers and their knowledge of your audience is probably getting you preferential treatment. What have you had/getting.. 675LT, 675LT Spider, GT8, GTR, GT4, Ford GT - is that correct? All specials that command a substantial premium which I am sure you're quite happy to acquire, use and then profit from. Would you be buying the Aston if it depreciated like £200k Astons did pre bubble? I expect not.

I take it this is your profession and if it is, don't you think you should act accordingly and only acquire the cars you really want and would like to own, margin or not? If you were an online reality TV bod that was just showing the world what you drive then fair enough but you're not.

[Shmee]

I think it's a much bigger and more complicated world than most people realise, trying to fit this into existing boxes of marketing or PR where in reality it's a new take on journalism that didn't exist before. It's a world of social media and we're all still learning what it means. For me it was a passion for cars that has organically grown and developed into something I could never have foreseen.

I can however categorically state that the cars I acquire are the ones I am interested in owning and using, as you can see I do. In the current economic climate these things could go down as quickly as they go up! Each of the cars listed (I don't have a Ford GT by the way) could have been bought by anybody who would have read the same sites I did and thought ahead to order one. Being honest, when I ordered the 675LT, that was at a time when McLarens went down £100k in a year, not up. Just because I got lucky (or made a calculated risk depending how you look at it), I refuse to accept that I should be made to feel guilty about that. A man going solely after money would be foolish in my mind to order a new AMG GT R too! It is however one I would love to use for various trips and perhaps as a daily hardcore-supercar.

I think by way of an example, buying a classic Mini was a perfect demonstration of getting a car that I want. Just as I'm really enjoying have cars from a variety of manufacturers so I can evenly see how the experiences compare. I don't get discounts, or anything desperately preferential, in fact through the customer channels it's absolutely no different.

[SEE YA]

Keep doing what makes you happy.
We all on here,share a passion for cars.
You have found a market, making a buck or two with the car bits.

There is plenty of room, for all types of car programmes.
People always have a choice turn on or off.
The feedback here could help you shape your next idea etc.

At least you came on here to add your point as well.

Goodluck.

Edited by SEE YA on Saturday 2nd July 08:11

[15HN]

Shmee said:

Each of the cars listed (I don't have a Ford GT by the way) could have been bought by anybody who would have read the same sites

No but I understand you applied for the GT so will be interesting to see if you get it.

Sorry don't agree with your theory that anyone could get what you've got. I have around 20 supercars in my car CV inc a F50 and could not get close to getting what you have acquired. Most supercars owners on this board couldn't. We both know how it works - on relationships not on punctuality. Go look on the 675LT thread where Flemke who owned what a F1? and he could not get access to the vehicles you got.

I am sure you're not saying you're not using your relationship via press status to get these vehicles (all of which happen to be highly appreciating assets) and thats the point. If any of your peers did what you were doing there would be total outrage but you get away with it by labelling yourself as a non-journalist youtuber when you want to be and a member of the press as and when it suits you.

I call it being greedy. If I am wrong lets test your theory. I will keep in touch with you and let you know what I try and buy next. If we have some commonality lets see if we both succeed.

Edited by 15HN on Saturday 2nd July 08:08

[cgt2]

This is brilliant. I just cannot see any of the usual suspects approaching this kind of rapport with any interviewee, let alone an F1 driver.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jYw6_KiP3Cs

[JoeMarano]

That's because he's a normal car guy (or just guy period) that loves what he does and it shows!

He's great!

(Of course it helps he has a massive brand and support behind him)

[Butter Face]

cgt2 said:

This is brilliant. I just cannot see any of the usual suspects approaching this kind of rapport with any interviewee, let alone an F1 driver.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jYw6_KiP3Cs

That chap is great, he's batst crazy but brilliant. He did a great salesman parody a bit back which was great!

[Shmee]

15HN, we will have to agree to disagree. I'm not for a second saying it's not impossible that a manufacturer might one day offer me a car; but you don't see me with an F12tdf or a 911R - I'd jump at either! Would you really prefer that a car was bought by a collector and stored under a cover than used out on the roads to the extent I do? My current or cars on order:

675LT I was an early depositor as a 12C owner when I heard about it on McLaren Life.

675LT Spider was offered first to 675LT Coupe owners.

GT8 I saw first on a thread on PH itself before it was sold out.

GT4 I had expressed interest way, way back and only got one because Porsche doubled the build run.

AMG GT R isn't a limited run, but I ordered it when I read about it in Autocar last month.

Ford GT they have announced an interest in getting cars into the hands of social folks, that's their choice and if I were to have one you can bet I'll be using it how they want the cars to be used; track days, road trips, daily driving, public events, and shared online.

I'm surprised with your collection and presumably your friends with similar that you don't know about these things sooner, the high VIP customers tend to get the info before it even hits the internet from my understanding.

[ferrisbueller]

Shmee said:

Every car I've ordered is because I've seen and read about them online (the GT8 on PH as it happens) and ordered off the back of that. There are no incentives or discounts on any of the cars in my garage from manufacturers so I'm not sure how I'm abusing any power here.

Have you never had an incentive? There was something written somewhere about McLaren giving you a particularly "good deal" on a car.

I'm not saying it's abuse but you appear to have been improbably lucky in obtaining limited run cars (upon which you've possibly made a profit). The Ford GT looks like it's going to be next. You may not be getting a discount but being allowed to have a car has a huge amount of value in itself.

[ferrisbueller]

Shmee said:

List of cars etc

I'm surprised with your collection and presumably your friends with similar that you don't know about these things sooner, the high VIP customers tend to get the info before it even hits the internet from my understanding.

Apologies, you posted whilst I was typing my post.

Several of the cars on the list have proven very difficult to obtain by those in a position to do so, regardless of timing. Manufacturers can apply all kinds of discretion when allocating cars. From what I've heard, Ferrari are, unsurprisingly, the worst.

If media exposure of a vehicle becomes a selection criteria then it's a bit worrying. If I had a Ford GT, I wouldn't be posting films of it on YouTube etc. Looking at someone like Flemke's posts, I think quite a few potential owners shun any kind of exposure.

[Shmee]

ferrisbueller said:

Have you never had an incentive? There was something written somewhere about McLaren giving you a particularly "good deal" on a car.

I'm not saying it's abuse but you appear to have been improbably lucky in obtaining limited run cars (upon which you've possibly made a profit). The Ford GT looks like it's going to be next. You may not be getting a discount but being allowed to have a car has a huge amount of value in itself.

Pistonheads rumours I'm afraid, absolutely no arrangement between McLaren and myself in any way, shape or form. I pay full list price like the next person and have never had any commercial deal with the company.

Ford will decide who they would like to buy the new GT and I presume a distribution of allocations will go between the 8 different categories they listed on their application form including; collectors, racing drivers, company owners who run Ford fleets, social media folks etc. I went to the launch event in Detroit, went to the race car launch in Le Mans last year, and went to Le Mans again this year (as their guest of course) - that's some pretty major dedication to the car and one that probably hasn't been done by many who aren't internal to Ford. Are you specifically saying I should not be allowed one, in which case on what basis? What would have stopped somebody else doing all of the same things and making contact with the team to grow a relationship?

ferrisbueller said:

Apologies, you posted whilst I was typing my post.

Several of the cars on the list have proven very difficult to obtain by those in a position to do so, regardless of timing. Manufacturers can apply all kinds of discretion when allocating cars. From what I've heard, Ferrari are, unsurprisingly, the worst.

If media exposure of a vehicle becomes a selection criteria then it's a bit worrying. If I had a Ford GT, I wouldn't be posting films of it on YouTube etc. Looking at someone like Flemke's posts, I think quite a few potential owners shun any kind of exposure.

Honestly I don't think a single one of the cars in my above list could not have been obtained by anybody else reading this post, it's a phone call to a dealer and in every case it's been first come, first served. Unless you can pick one in particular for us to discuss and hear why you somebody else could not have got one and we can work out why?

The GT is the only difference (although I did make a request to Ford directly on the day it was revealed last year so again, started this 19 months ago, and have continued to do my best to keep in touch with those involved since that day), but it wouldn't be appropriate to continue discussing that car because Ford have not yet made their allocations.

[ferrisbueller]

Shmee said:

ferrisbueller said:

Have you never had an incentive? There was something written somewhere about McLaren giving you a particularly "good deal" on a car.

I'm not saying it's abuse but you appear to have been improbably lucky in obtaining limited run cars (upon which you've possibly made a profit). The Ford GT looks like it's going to be next. You may not be getting a discount but being allowed to have a car has a huge amount of value in itself.

Pistonheads rumours I'm afraid, absolutely no arrangement between McLaren and myself in any way, shape or form. I pay full list price like the next person and have never had any commercial deal with the company.

Ford will decide who they would like to buy the new GT and I presume a distribution of allocations will go between the 8 different categories they listed on their application form including; collectors, racing drivers, company owners who run Ford fleets, social media folks etc. I went to the launch event in Detroit, went to the race car launch in Le Mans last year, and went to Le Mans again this year (as their guest of course) - that's some pretty major dedication to the car and one that probably hasn't been done by many who aren't internal to Ford. Are you specifically saying I should not be allowed one, in which case on what basis? What would have stopped somebody else doing all of the same things and making contact with the team to grow a relationship?

I don't think anyone has said you shouldn't be allowed to have whatever you want. What myself and others have said is that your position gets you access. A few pages ago you acknowledged it was a perk.

As others have explained in this thread, you are a cog in a complex marketing machine and can offer a great deal of exposure. If that means manufacturers let you have cars then that's how it is.

The above only really become an issue if they're at the expense of others who "should" be getting a car (but how is should defined and by whom?). Plenty of people are expressing frustration with flippers, too.

Was Ford's invite to LM this year based on your order for the car?

Shmee said:

ferrisbueller said:

Apologies, you posted whilst I was typing my post.

Several of the cars on the list have proven very difficult to obtain by those in a position to do so, regardless of timing. Manufacturers can apply all kinds of discretion when allocating cars. From what I've heard, Ferrari are, unsurprisingly, the worst.

If media exposure of a vehicle becomes a selection criteria then it's a bit worrying. If I had a Ford GT, I wouldn't be posting films of it on YouTube etc. Looking at someone like Flemke's posts, I think quite a few potential owners shun any kind of exposure.

Honestly I don't think a single one of the cars in my above list could not have been obtained by anybody else reading this post, it's a phone call to a dealer and in every case it's been first come, first served. Unless you can pick one in particular for us to discuss and hear why you somebody else could not have got one and we can work out why?

The GT is the only difference (although I did make a request to Ford directly on the day it was revealed last year so again, started this 19 months ago, and have continued to do my best to keep in touch with those involved since that day), but it wouldn't be appropriate to continue discussing that car because Ford have not yet made their allocations.

Several of the cars on your list. You could find threads on here with a few examples I think.

[cgt2]

A friend who has owned Porsches for 30+ years including several 911s purchased new did not get a GT4 despite him trying very hard.

[Shmee]

ferrisbueller said:

Was Ford's invite to LM this year based on your order for the car?

The invite to LM was via the success of my videos shot in Detroit and with the car at other events since its unveiling like LM the previous year. At the time I was invited we didn't yet have the details of the application process too so this was before much was known really.

cgt2 said:

A friend who has owned Porsches for 30+ years including several 911s purchased new did not get a GT4 despite him trying very hard.

There are something like 500-600 GT4s in the UK, in reality everyone who wanted one, had a deposit down, and was persistent with their individual dealer has now got one (hence the market price dropping back down). You see more than enough threads too about Porsche's overproduction of the car contrary to initial expectation.

My slot was also based on the factory shortage of bucket seat cars and many people were only happy to have the car with these - I had no option.

[red_slr]

Thing you have to remember its always been this way.

30 years ago it was stock brokers and bankers.
20 years ago it was the car mags boys, TV personalities.
10 years ago it was footballers and rappers.
Now its the turn of the social media crew and "Instagram" types as they drive PR like nothing else.

I mean if you said to me 20 years ago when I left school that people would make a good living from making 7 second videos of their dog riding a robotic vacuum cleaner I would have thought you had been smoking something funny.. let alone driving the best cars on the planet with nothing more than a few portable cameras and a laptop. More to it I know, but I don't think anyone in the motoring industry saw this coming more than 5 years ago.

I think we (people >35 years old) often forget that teenagers / younger people have never known a world without social media.

[ferrisbueller]

Shmee said:

ferrisbueller said:

Was Ford's invite to LM this year based on your order for the car?

The invite to LM was via the success of my videos shot in Detroit and with the car at other events since its unveiling like LM the previous year. At the time I was invited we didn't yet have the details of the application process too so this was before much was known really.

Underlines what has been said above then.

Shmee said:

cgt2 said:

A friend who has owned Porsches for 30+ years including several 911s purchased new did not get a GT4 despite him trying very hard.

There are something like 500-600 GT4s in the UK, in reality everyone who wanted one, had a deposit down, and was persistent with their individual dealer has now got one (hence the market price dropping back down). You see more than enough threads too about Porsche's overproduction of the car contrary to initial expectation.

My slot was also based on the factory shortage of bucket seat cars and many people were only happy to have the car with these - I had no option.

I'm not sure that's the case. This thread suggests as much, anyway.

http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...

[Shmee]

ferrisbueller said:

I'm not sure that's the case. This thread suggests as much, anyway.

http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...

I know a lot of people in the real world who now have a car that ordered far later than I did; there are far too many conspiracy theories about GT4s and this isn't really the thread for it but you can't have it both ways; threads about everybody getting one and threads about nobody getting one. It's clearly somewhere in the middle and those that were persistent, managed.

[ferrisbueller]

Shmee said:

ferrisbueller said:

I'm not sure that's the case. This thread suggests as much, anyway.

http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...

I know a lot of people in the real world who now have a car that ordered far later than I did; there are far too many conspiracy theories about GT4s and this isn't really the thread for it but you can't have it both ways; threads about everybody getting one and threads about nobody getting one. It's clearly somewhere in the middle and those that were persistent, managed.

I thought people were still paying £100k for them.