Mrs bought clio from a trade, with problems and sold as seen
Discussion
As it "drove perfectly on the test drive" it is not unreasonable to assume it drove OK when the seller drove it as well. The fact that they offered a test drive would also imply that the seller expected it to drive OK.
These things happen with old cars - the seller should have been more helpful but if it is sorted now it has ended OK.
These things happen with old cars - the seller should have been more helpful but if it is sorted now it has ended OK.
R500POP said:
Not really, I bought a £1000 snotter, but I was realistic with my expectations.
You're giving me a headache, you bought a car without seeing it what did you expect.We bought a car knowing nothing about mechanics and expected it to be driveable the next day at least. It wasn't and he's now paying to make the car driveable which is what he sold us. We weren't expectiong a new car. If it turns out the windows are faulty I would have been stupid not to have seen it and wouldn't comlplain anyway about such a minor thing.
Edited by amdowney on Tuesday 18th October 13:04
WeirdNeville said:
2) Why should you expect a cheaper car to have some faults? I bought my BMW for £700 18 months ago. It's been reliable for 16,000 miles now. Everything works. This myth that cheap cars have to be deathtraps, unreliable or on their last legs - it's not true.
You appear to have spent double that on service & repair though. I guess £2000 spent on the Clio in the OP would turn it into a decent car.SOGA takes into account the age and price paid for the car - I wouldn't fancy my chances going to court complaining about a £900 car. Bearing in the mind the trader must be making a profit the underlying value in the car means it must be teetering on the brink of being scrap.
Deva Link said:
WeirdNeville said:
2) Why should you expect a cheaper car to have some faults? I bought my BMW for £700 18 months ago. It's been reliable for 16,000 miles now. Everything works. This myth that cheap cars have to be deathtraps, unreliable or on their last legs - it's not true.
You appear to have spent double that on service & repair though. I guess £2000 spent on the Clio in the OP would turn it into a decent car.SOGA takes into account the age and price paid for the car - I wouldn't fancy my chances going to court complaining about a £900 car. Bearing in the mind the trader must be making a profit the underlying value in the car means it must be teetering on the brink of being scrap.
But it also didn't start leaking coolant the first time I drove it, or stall.
If he's selling it as scrap, then fine. But he was selling it as a car, a device for getting you from A-B. If it doesn't do that, then he shouldn't have sold it at any price!
R500POP said:
I expected there may be some issues, as I said, I was realistic with my expectations.
Has I spent £1000 on a car and driven it, I'd still be expecting an issue or two.
The price you paid is entirely irrelevant.Has I spent £1000 on a car and driven it, I'd still be expecting an issue or two.
It would be likely that the Clio could be found from a private seller for less than £1,000 but the OP chose to go with a trader at a higher price since that extra cash is justified owing to the extra rights it entails.
A "realistic" expectation when buying from a trader is that the car will work.
If you don't expect that then you are clearly a push-over or someone to whom £1,000 vs. £800 doesn't make much difference.
300bhp/ton said:
freecar said:
Take it back for a refund, if he gives you any trouble quote SOGA at him, you know he's not allowed to discharge his responsibilities with a blanket statement like that, I'm sure he knows too!
But your advice is also wrong and also b
ks. And as you are saying this, it is perfectly evident you haven't read any of SOGA or you wouldn't be giving out such bad advice.That is all I said, I didn't say what condition the vehicle has to be in for the budget or anything like that. Just the completely correct statement of not being able to duck responsibility.
http://www.oft.gov.uk/shared_oft/reports/676408/of...
Here is a report from the Office of Fair Trading that states exactly what I have said, but of course what I said is b
ks!WeirdNeville said:
If he's selling it as scrap, then fine. But he was selling it as a car, a device for getting you from A-B. If it doesn't do that, then he shouldn't have sold it at any price!
That's what'll happen if the law is brought to bear against trade sellers of such vehicle - it will become impossible for traders to sell them openly, so they'll be sold "underground".300bhp/ton said:
I wish over 18's would take responsibility for their own actions sometimes, instead of trying to palm it off on others.
And how fking lazy do you have to be to only do your research AFTER you've been out and bought a car.
Know you rights, take responsibility for your own actions and don't get in such situations in the first place, or if you do, at least then have the fore knowledge on what to do about it.
You're so incorrect. Research what on every part of the car? Only when bought do the problems arrise pointing out where you do research!And how f
king lazy do you have to be to only do your research AFTER you've been out and bought a car.Know you rights, take responsibility for your own actions and don't get in such situations in the first place, or if you do, at least then have the fore knowledge on what to do about it.
Know your rights, I do thank you very much which is why this cowboy car trader is now taking a hit!
Hopefully you have learnt something in this thread and won't get into such a circumstance as a buyer or seller yourself
Porkie said:
I disagree.
and ultimately I am the one left with the problem as never going to be able to prove it.... and I except that when buying a used car from private seller or small time trader working from home that the car is totally sold as seen. Its up to ME to find any problems and do all the checks I want to do. Always presume the worst!
If you want comebacks and warrenty and piece of mind. Then buy from a dealer...
I do actually think he believed they were working. They werent though. I should have checked. My fault.
Thats the law whether you agree or disagree - the hard thing is to prove it unless its written down - but small claims court the burdon of proof is mush less stringent.and ultimately I am the one left with the problem as never going to be able to prove it.... and I except that when buying a used car from private seller or small time trader working from home that the car is totally sold as seen. Its up to ME to find any problems and do all the checks I want to do. Always presume the worst!
If you want comebacks and warrenty and piece of mind. Then buy from a dealer...
I do actually think he believed they were working. They werent though. I should have checked. My fault.
My brother recently won such a case with a more expensive clio sport, turned out engine was not running well and gave the guy chance to fix it. He bodged it then my brother got it done properly and sent him the bill. It took some doing but the court finally made him pay most of it as he couldn't disprove that the fault was there at the time of sale.
I have been driving old BMWs for the last few years myself and now a 2002 Audi. I am yet to have 1 mechanical issue in all 5/6 years. I had a nightmare with my first car a Rover 200 but the German cars are so much better, probably working out cheaper to run in the longrun! Wish we spent more on a Polo or something now for piece of mind.
I have been driving old BMWs for the last few years myself and now a 2002 Audi. I am yet to have 1 mechanical issue in all 5/6 years. I had a nightmare with my first car a Rover 200 but the German cars are so much better, probably working out cheaper to run in the longrun! Wish we spent more on a Polo or something now for piece of mind.
Edited by amdowney on Tuesday 18th October 13:40
Its a pain for the OP but if your going to buy cars off traders you really should have someone handy with you to give it a once over. We've had a few Renaults which all lasted 3 years then just as the warranty lapsed started getting problematic. Any car for a £1,000 is likely to give you some headaches. Hope you get something sorted.
TOENHEEL said:
Its a pain for the OP but if your going to buy cars off traders you really should have someone handy with you to give it a once over. We've had a few Renaults which all lasted 3 years then just as the warranty lapsed started getting problematic. Any car for a £1,000 is likely to give you some headaches. Hope you get something sorted.
Well no, that's why traders are bound by laws and private sales aren't.Buying from a trader is generally more expensive but you are paying for a certain amount of peace of mind that the vehicle is sound, something which the SOGA agrees with. Nobody says a twenty years old car bought for pennies should be perfect but it should be suitable for the purpose it was sold for.
Buying privately without mechanical knowledge and nobody helping is crazy, but anybody should be able to buy with confidence from a dealer.
The snobbery of some posters on here is surprising*. Some people are talking like £1000 is the sort of thing you can cobble together from the loose change in your pockets and a good rummage down the back of the sofa! If I paid £1000 for a car that in good condition would be worth £2000, then I'd expect high miles, a chequered past, and some future trips to the spanners. If I paid £1000 for a car which in good condition was worth £1000, of which there are plenty for sale, I'd expect it to last more than a day!
- well, maybe not that surprising, this is MumsNet after all.
Porkie said:
and ultimately I am the one left with the problem as never going to be able to prove it.... and I except that when buying a used car from private seller or small time trader working from home that the car is totally sold as seen. Its up to ME to find any problems and do all the checks I want to do. Always presume the worst!
If you want comebacks and warrenty and piece of mind. Then buy from a dealer...
I do actually think he believed they were working. They werent though. I should have checked. My fault.
I accept you can't prove it, but you haven't said the seller denied saying they worked. It's down to the seller if you asked specific questions and were given assurances. If you want comebacks and warrenty and piece of mind. Then buy from a dealer...
I do actually think he believed they were working. They werent though. I should have checked. My fault.
This doesn't just apply to traders though - if a private seller mis-represents a car then you can sue them too. It's just a whole lot easier with Traders as they're assumed to be experts (no matter how "small time" they are) and private sellers aren't. In practice you probably have to suck it up.
freecar said:
Well no, that's why traders are bound by laws and private sales aren't.
Buying from a trader is generally more expensive but you are paying for a certain amount of peace of mind that the vehicle is sound, something which the SOGA agrees with. Nobody says a twenty years old car bought for pennies should be perfect but it should be suitable for the purpose it was sold for.
Buying privately without mechanical knowledge and nobody helping is crazy, but anybody should be able to buy with confidence from a dealer.
Depends what kind of trader were talking about here? A trader with a small pitch or garage will no doubt try and help the OP in a similar way to a dealer would approach the problem normally selling the car with a warranty or offering some good will. I will be amazed if a bloke trading from home is going to put himself out a great deal without a push. He's probably picked it up from auction like loads of wannabe car traders do and realised its got a problem and wanted shot as quick as possible. How olds this Clio just out of curiosity and how many miles has it done? Buying from a trader is generally more expensive but you are paying for a certain amount of peace of mind that the vehicle is sound, something which the SOGA agrees with. Nobody says a twenty years old car bought for pennies should be perfect but it should be suitable for the purpose it was sold for.
Buying privately without mechanical knowledge and nobody helping is crazy, but anybody should be able to buy with confidence from a dealer.
TOENHEEL said:
freecar said:
Well no, that's why traders are bound by laws and private sales aren't.
Buying from a trader is generally more expensive but you are paying for a certain amount of peace of mind that the vehicle is sound, something which the SOGA agrees with. Nobody says a twenty years old car bought for pennies should be perfect but it should be suitable for the purpose it was sold for.
Buying privately without mechanical knowledge and nobody helping is crazy, but anybody should be able to buy with confidence from a dealer.
Depends what kind of trader were talking about here? A trader with a small pitch or garage will no doubt try and help the OP in a similar way to a dealer would approach the problem normally selling the car with a warranty or offering some good will. I will be amazed if a bloke trading from home is going to put himself out a great deal without a push. He's probably picked it up from auction like loads of wannabe car traders do and realised its got a problem and wanted shot as quick as possible. How olds this Clio just out of curiosity and how many miles has it done? Buying from a trader is generally more expensive but you are paying for a certain amount of peace of mind that the vehicle is sound, something which the SOGA agrees with. Nobody says a twenty years old car bought for pennies should be perfect but it should be suitable for the purpose it was sold for.
Buying privately without mechanical knowledge and nobody helping is crazy, but anybody should be able to buy with confidence from a dealer.
I feel for the guy I really do however the SOGA isn't really written in stone to guarantee your money back as shown below:
fair wear and tear
• accidental damage or misuse of the item
• if you don’t want the item any more, for example it is the wrong size or colour
• if you knew the item was faulty when you bought it
• if you misused the item and caused a fault
• if you tried to repair the item or had someone else try to repair it, which damaged the item
• if it is over six years since you purchased
the item, or for goods purchased in Scotland, if it is over five years since you discovered
the fault.
The car was fine on the test drive so not sure where you can go with this, the coilpacks seem to go on these and Peugeot/Citroen all the time also.
fair wear and tear
• accidental damage or misuse of the item
• if you don’t want the item any more, for example it is the wrong size or colour
• if you knew the item was faulty when you bought it
• if you misused the item and caused a fault
• if you tried to repair the item or had someone else try to repair it, which damaged the item
• if it is over six years since you purchased
the item, or for goods purchased in Scotland, if it is over five years since you discovered
the fault.
The car was fine on the test drive so not sure where you can go with this, the coilpacks seem to go on these and Peugeot/Citroen all the time also.
Edited by TOENHEEL on Tuesday 18th October 14:10
freecar said:
yes but the car is also losing it's coolant therefore not suitable for purpose, it's pretty cut and dry.
Anyway I don't know why this is still being debated, the OP has taken it back and the dealer is sorting it. So he hasn't wriggled out of anything.
Its good reading for others, fore warned and all that....Anyway I don't know why this is still being debated, the OP has taken it back and the dealer is sorting it. So he hasn't wriggled out of anything.
Gassing Station | General Gassing | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff