Are modern performance cars irrelevant?
Discussion
I think one of the main points missed in the thread is the car in question i.e. the new M5 - the first forced induction M car. OP, try the N/A c63 amg and I'm pretty sure you will love it. Power delivery is the issue i reckon and this is why previous M cars were such a hoot to drive,
I disagree that 400-500bhp is unusable on UK roads, there are plenty of nice roads where it can be exploited,
I disagree that 400-500bhp is unusable on UK roads, there are plenty of nice roads where it can be exploited,
Speed_Demon said:
RYH64E said:
You did realise that I was being ironic?
Yeah I'm pretty sure he did.
I was hoping you were being ironic. I highlighted because if I could get just one more person thinking along those lines (i.e. legal and safe not being mutually inclusive), I would have made the world a better place.In defence of modern performance cars, at least if you do decide to go for a hoon, you have some confidence that the car will start and not require a flatbed to get it home again.
Edited by RenesisEvo on Sunday 4th March 15:17
I maintain that its the road that you are on which decides how much fun you are having. I have occasion to drive into mid wales in my S max and have an absolute hoot. I'm going pretty quickly but I'm not going as quick as in my kit car. If I take the kit car out on local roads that are quite busy they are no where near as fun, yes I can get around traffic like a motor bike but its just rather tiresome at time, despit the huge acceleration which is nice.
There has been a lot of sense talked in this thread. It is undoubted todays cars are more capable and safer, but in the main less involving than older cars.
Olders cars are less safe, but you will probably be going slower when things go wrong, but cos of the inherent lack of safety features, conversely more likely to be injured.
Bigger cars also are safer.
I suppose you pays your money and takes your choice,
For me its not about outright speed, I've been on run outs where there has been Caterfields that have slaughtered me in the twisties, but on faster sections they struggle to keep up. Does that make them safer, probably not, cos if they get it wrong on a bend they will be going faster.
Just don't push the envolope on roads, save 10/10ths for the track
Olders cars are less safe, but you will probably be going slower when things go wrong, but cos of the inherent lack of safety features, conversely more likely to be injured.
Bigger cars also are safer.
I suppose you pays your money and takes your choice,
For me its not about outright speed, I've been on run outs where there has been Caterfields that have slaughtered me in the twisties, but on faster sections they struggle to keep up. Does that make them safer, probably not, cos if they get it wrong on a bend they will be going faster.
Just don't push the envolope on roads, save 10/10ths for the track
anonymous said:
[redacted]
On the twistiest, most undulating roads (think mountain/moorland minor roads) 60mph is quite quick around the bends, but you would/do have to be quite restrained to stay beneath the speed limit (too frequently 50mph around here for my liking) when the bends open out.Obviously, discretion comes into play...
In answer to the OP question " are modern performance cars irrelevant " Well yes they are relevant, in fact they are fantastic . Take a modern Porsche to France or Scotland and revel in the joy of motoring. Some cars are more relevant than others 
Must admit in most parts of the UK the roads are total s
t, we have a road we use locally that over the years has become not fit for purpose for ANY CAR 
Must admit in most parts of the UK the roads are total s
t, we have a road we use locally that over the years has become not fit for purpose for ANY CAR anonymous said:
[redacted]
The fun is in the twisty bits, where 60 is usually enough, there's no real fun in going fast in a straight line, for me at least.Driving a modern high performance car on a twisty B road is like running a Formula 1 car round the Top Gear test track. I'm not saying that there isn't a place for them, but I don't know anywhere near me where I could drive a modern, high performance sports car at anything near it's limit without ending up in prison (or hospital).
Chris Stott said:
.
Agree completely.
Too much performance to use any more than a fraction of the time on the road, and too refined to reward at sensible speeds.
.
Precisely.Agree completely.
Too much performance to use any more than a fraction of the time on the road, and too refined to reward at sensible speeds.
.
Driving a performance car on UK roads is on the whole a very frustrating experience now 24/7/365.
With that in mind, UK point to point journeys times in any 'supercar' would not be all that much better than I obtain in my aged 2 Litre turbo. So high profile are some of these cars, that their drivers often hold up those of us with lesser means of getting about.
..
It seems we are all really quick drivers until we get 6 points on our licence,as I did a few years ago,i've had 4 TVRs in a row and just sold the last one.I've moved to Hampshire for a couple of years from living around the Peaks,Herefordshire and Gloucestershire and find the traffic is grim,no point in a fast car,no where to go.I wasn't going to buy another fun car but I id stupidly,a Smart Roadster Brabus,its like a old Frogeye on steroilds with much more kit.60 feels like 120 so i'm not having to do silly speeds
The roads are still crap though
P
The roads are still crap though
P
anonymous said:
[redacted]
I'm no fan of speed limits, and no great respector of them either, but the way you write makes you sound like a boy racer. If you're driving fast enough, in a modern performance car, to have to 'go on and off the throttle and brakes, balancing the car, managing its weight and velocity and inertias into, through and out of the corner' then you're an accident waiting to happen. You do the cause no good.edited to add: ...or a driving god.
Edited by RYH64E on Sunday 4th March 20:07
anonymous said:
[redacted]
The boy racer thing is more about ending up on your roof in a farmers field because you've either run out of talent or hit a patch of mud or a pothole that you weren't expecting.The op asked 'Are modern performance cars irrelevant?', I think that driving anywhere near their limits, and certainly in the manner that you suggest, just isn't possible on today's roads. The cars are too fast to use to the full, and the roads too poor.
Spirited driving is good, and to be honest I don't give a stuff about speed limits, it's just that by the time you get anywhere near the limits of a modern sports car then you are way past what is appropriate for any road that I can think of (regardless of limits), certainly any roads near me.
I think the OP is in my bracket, I can't sit in an M5 and enjoy it either, it's too refined and too controlled. We (capable or not) like the idea that the car can bite back and also the raw feel of power shoving you down the road...that's why I drive a V8 Chevy engined Cobra Rep in my spare time.
Does it get out of control? Yes
Does it go like stink? Yes
Is it sensible or fuel economical? No
Do I enjoy the moment that it steps out and threatens to put me in the ditch? Oooooohhhh Yes!!
Do I break speed limits? Yes
Do I break suburban speed limits (i.e. round schools, built up areas) NO!
Common sense can't be legalised because everyone is different, hey ho
W
Does it get out of control? Yes
Does it go like stink? Yes
Is it sensible or fuel economical? No
Do I enjoy the moment that it steps out and threatens to put me in the ditch? Oooooohhhh Yes!!
Do I break speed limits? Yes
Do I break suburban speed limits (i.e. round schools, built up areas) NO!
Common sense can't be legalised because everyone is different, hey ho
W
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