Car insurance for 21yo on a GT-R?
Discussion
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I certainly am not misunderstanding anything, I understand what you are saying, but it just isn't right. Trust me, we have an amazing sense of humour, the best ones are people saying that if he can handle a 2.7 Boxster, he can handle a GTR, that would have an uproar in the office and we would then all leave early and go to the pub and laugh at how we rip everyone off 
.BUT if you are right he can handle it, if he has Boxster & Elise experience, why aren't you offering this facility? If I am wrong about this, why isn't anyone really in this business? Or is it simply, something that you don't fully understand, again, not a veiled attempt at a dig, as I would have no idea about structural engineering.
Why is no-one in this massive business with the same mindset as you? I'm calling you out here, if you are right why aren't you doing this? If insurance is a billion pound industry why wont you do it? I'll pay for all of your qualifications if you can provide a profitable book for a Syndicate to back.
What I do know is that you are flippantly suggesting is that everyone jumping from 220hp to 550 is going to die.
I agree, a 911 Turbo S/Turbo will be more challenging to drive than a GTR in certain circumstances, but without question this is perfectly acceptable direct experience, I'd have no problem.
BUT a Elise/Boxster, with much greater margins for error, isn't in the same league unfortunately.
JasperT said:
Why does no one (including insurance companies) seem to understand that if you drive like a cock in any car, you WILL crash it when you find (exceed) the limit. The limit in a Vauxhall Corsa being much lower than in a GTR...
when being driven by a sensible individual in a sensible manner, I would argue the risk of an accident is MUCH lower in the GTR...
You don't seem to understand that insurance companies don't price risk according to 'what they reckon' having put a finger in the air, they price it based on huge amounts of claims data and if they consistently get it wrong they'll go out of business. This will include claims from people who drive sensibly and those who drive like cocks, and if a car tends to driven in a more cockish manner resulting in more crashes then that will be reflected in the premium charged. If it were the case that every single GTR was always driven in an ultra-cautious manner then that would indeed lower the premiums, but then you also have to take into account that if you do prang a GTR it's likely to cost a lot more to fix than a Corsa. when being driven by a sensible individual in a sensible manner, I would argue the risk of an accident is MUCH lower in the GTR...
There is the question of what will happen if the driver makes an ill advised throttle change mid-corner on a wet country road.
There is also the question of how fast it will be going when the driver hits the bus queue having floored it on Kensington High Street.
The problem with young drivers is less car control than impulse control.
There is also the question of how fast it will be going when the driver hits the bus queue having floored it on Kensington High Street.
The problem with young drivers is less car control than impulse control.
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And this is why there really is two demographics of people and you really are the second.I've offered to pay for your way to offer your services to people seeking this very thing out, which you believe is correct, provided you can provide proof of a profitable book of business, which in turn should make you a multi millionaire, but you are not interested? You have no doubt whatsoever, just not interested in being a multi millionaire(/Billionaire) within 4 years? Right.......
The thing is, for a 21 y/o experience is everything hence the request for proof.
You have driven them hard and fast daily, in all sorts of weather in towns cities, or hard an fast in a suitable environment? Because again, your getting confused with track days sporting events etc, 0-60 is more relevant than going around a corner at 100, 90, 80, 70 mph. What happens more frequently?
Statistics and facts which are easily available online are there for you to see, but you 'cant be bothered' but yet, you insist you are right and the world is wrong based on your experiences, never mind the evidence readily available to you. Ignorance.
But hey ho, you can take a horse to water and all that.
Oooh, controversial!
They let me have an MR2 Turbo when I was 19. I span it a couple of times. Then I did 160 in it. I didn't die, as far as i'm aware.
A 21 year old could be really mature about driving such a powerful car, or he could attempt to do 180 down a high street to impress some teenagers at a bus stop. Without knowing him, we can't really pass judgement.
They let me have an MR2 Turbo when I was 19. I span it a couple of times. Then I did 160 in it. I didn't die, as far as i'm aware.
A 21 year old could be really mature about driving such a powerful car, or he could attempt to do 180 down a high street to impress some teenagers at a bus stop. Without knowing him, we can't really pass judgement.
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I think that is wrong.Aside from the obvious price differential and weight differential (both of which would imply a higher COST to an average crash) the ability to get into trouble from the sheer power/weight difference is huge.
Take for example "flooring it". It is something ALL of us usually try to do in any car we drive (I imagine).
It's easy and fun and requires just one input: a heavy right foot.
Doing that in any Boxster or Elise going 50mph+ will be fun and it is fairly hard to get into much trouble. You run out of puff quite rapidly.
Not so in a 500bhp+ GTR. It just keeps accelerating - and the turbo effect takes a little getting used to as well.
And don't even get me started on the suspension.
I think the MY-16 is a lot more sorted but even Clarkson noticed that the GTR has a strong tendency to attempt to throw you into oncoming traffic owing to very slight road imperfections (although the Lotus is similar, it is no way near as scary IMHO).
Getting to know a car takes time and IMHO for the GTR it is a while, whereas I think all of us would be driving at 9/10ths in a Boxster or Lotus reasonably quickly.
The electronics do help keep you on the road but you can turn it off!
When I insured my 320bhp Impreza they asked for my car history! I'd never been over 200bhp before but seeing as though all but one of my previous cars were 'hot hatches' they said that was satisfactory enough lol. I suppose going from my 55bhp Corsa could have been a recipe for disaster 
walm said:
Getting to know a car takes time and IMHO for the GTR it is a while, whereas I think all of us would be driving at 9/10ths in a Boxster or Lotus reasonably quickly.
The electronics do help keep you on the road but you can turn it off!
I dont think 99% of people on here could drive a Boxter or Elise anywhere near 9/10th let alone in a short space of time. Most people cant even drive a gokart that hard. The electronics do help keep you on the road but you can turn it off!
In a straight line/ off the lights maybe but not through the whole spectrum. There have been plenty of "I crashed my VX220 / elise / mr2 just coming off a roundabout at 30mph" comments on PH over the years.
I'm agreeing with Nanook. A GTR may have a lot of easily deployable power but it doesnt mean it is going to kill any younger drivers.
My first car had 75bhp on a good day yet I was able to switch to a modified Impreza, Elises/Exiges and 500bhp AMG Mercs at 18-20 years old with no crashing.
I certainly had more moments driving Elises and a Boxter in my late teens than I did in any of the 300+bhp awd cars or 500bhp rwd Mercs
A friend is very fortunate and had an Astra VXR, then jumped to a modded GTR at 22, also borrowed his dads 997 Turbo, then he had a new M3 and now has an R8 he just turned 25 and despite being particularly boy racery and not that hot a driver has managed not to crash any of them.
I dont see why a drivers age means they wont be able to handle something.
21 year old lived and breathed performance cars for 4 years probably learnt a thing or two driving hot hatches maybe. plenty of experience of being in his dads GTR so understands its a bit rapid. Quote on GTR - Sorry no you cant possibly handle it with your experience.
40 year old driven a miserable diesel saloon all his life, had a few crashes gets a new job, treats himself to a GTR cos people on telly say they are mega fast and easy to drive. Quote on GTR - £500 thanks.
Surely the millions of born again bikers that buy something quick and fall off it hints that its not just younguns that show too much exuberance with new things?
And before you bother to type it R-Type Im not interested in starting an insurance company or taking anyones risk.
I understand insurance is based on broad statistics and not individual scenarios. So I understand why an insurance company would be reluctant to take on an inexperienced driver in any car.
All I'm arguing is that it is perfectly possible for someone to be used to slower cars and jump into something as mental as a GTR without killing the world. And agreeing with Nanook in that if someone is competent with something like a supercharged Elise that is quite flighty and approx 220bhp/t then they can probably handle the jump to a roughly 280bhp/t GTR. Its not that big a jump.
My first car was roughly 62bhp/t yet I had no problem jumping to an Impreza with approx 230bhp/t and I'm sure many other people on here have made similar jumps.
RB Will said:
I dont think 99% of people on here could drive a Boxter or Elise anywhere near 9/10th let alone in a short space of time. Most people cant even drive a gokart that hard.
I'm agreeing with Nanook. A GTR may have a lot of easily deployable power but it doesnt mean it is going to kill any younger drivers.
I dont see why a drivers age means they wont be able to handle something.
Some really good points in that.I'm agreeing with Nanook. A GTR may have a lot of easily deployable power but it doesnt mean it is going to kill any younger drivers.
I dont see why a drivers age means they wont be able to handle something.
I think I wrote the 9/10ths thing wrong, sorry.
I meant 9/10ths of THEIR ability not the abilities of the car - so I totally agree with you!
We all know that feeling of getting into a familiar car, feeling it is like a second skin and being able to push it close to our own comfort levels and perhaps a little beyond.
I just think you get to that point relatively quickly in the Elise and Boxster, whereas it takes longer with the perhaps less "chuckable" GTR.
However, I disagree slightly on the age thing.
It is obvious from the stats that younger people crash more.
And not only that but they tend to have less powerful cars too.
So while obviously some guys will be perfectly competent (latest F1 winner!) the AVERAGE will be less able to handle it.
That is a simple matter of statistics.
Call Quantum plc and ask for a Chubb policy. Ask for Liesel.
It allows anyone to drive fully comp with your permission, and you to drive any other car fully comp with the owner's permission.
I had this on my 911 a few years back.
It won't be cheap, and the excess will be eye watering, but they will do it.
It allows anyone to drive fully comp with your permission, and you to drive any other car fully comp with the owner's permission.
I had this on my 911 a few years back.
It won't be cheap, and the excess will be eye watering, but they will do it.
Soov535 said:
Call Quantum plc and ask for a Chubb policy. Ask for Liesel.
It allows anyone to drive fully comp with your permission, and you to drive any other car fully comp with the owner's permission.
I had this on my 911 a few years back.
It won't be cheap, and the excess will be eye watering, but they will do it.
Amazing policy but a) expensive, b) probably won't cover the car. Worth a shot though.It allows anyone to drive fully comp with your permission, and you to drive any other car fully comp with the owner's permission.
I had this on my 911 a few years back.
It won't be cheap, and the excess will be eye watering, but they will do it.
Nanook said:
walm said:
I think R-type is just saying that your experience doesn't fit with the statistics.
If your experience were the norm then insurance would be cheaper on a Boxster than on a GTR, wouldn't it?
Well, a GTR is significantly more expensive, insurance prices aren't solely based on which cars are crashed more often, or Corsa's would likely be the most expensive car in the world to insure! If your experience were the norm then insurance would be cheaper on a Boxster than on a GTR, wouldn't it?
Even taking that into account they are more, though aren't they?
Mr Trophy said:
Sump said:
Nothing to do with experience. It's just a question of maturity and whether your son is a moron or not.
Someone get this man a pint!I've been lucky enough to drive some cracking cars at a young age. It has everything to do with the above and nothing to do with your NCB.
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It really is amusing how that post is littered with all of the things that you say are within my posts.You really are ignorant, rude & typical of the demographic we often come across. But that's fine, it happens all the time and its often this group, that point the finger elsewhere when the s
t hits the fan.RB Will & Walm both make decent points, without being the stereotypical PH director prick that you are coming across as. I fully agree with RB regarding a young lad who has grown up around the vehicles and make that argument regularly. Christ, Straw-man argument
we are scraping the barrel, its an insurance thread, hence the question, not a RWD vs 4WD thread.Yes, RWD cars are more challenging to drive on the limit (which these would need to be), but, a Boxster or a Elise isn't more difficult to drive than a GTR and certainly in any slip on a day to day driving basis, the GTR is far more likely to bite you in comparison to these vehicles.
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