RE: Lancia Thema 8.32: Spotted

[cramorra]

My absolute dream sleeper when I was young - pre cat version please
Sadly rare as unobtanium and not affordable
Poltrona Frau leather
Air con
The seats I never forget best I ever had
Got the next best a bit - later Thema v6 lx similar interior ( not the lovely yellow flicker veglia dials though ) and a busso V6
Almost as fast and different but also great sound ... which I would have had that pop up spoiler though
In every respect a worse car than the c63 or gs f I have now which are probably the modern equivalent then and now however felt so much more special back then and you wouldn’t t have little golfs trying to race you all the time as they couldn’t ????

Edited by cramorra on Friday 16th November 10:26

[irish boy]

I can’t believe there is only 8 on the road. I know of 3 locally, customer of mine has one which he uses daily, including an annual drive to Italy. Never lets him down.
There is also one that attends local car shows here, and finally there is the one at Deane motors, currently south of the border but will still be on uk plates until it sells, as it may come back up north.

http://deanemotors.ie/vehicle/lancia-thema-832/

[s m]

Sidney Smut said:

Now this is rare but I almost bought a metallic blue Thema Integrale, it was for sale in Sunderland in the early 90s... Wonder which is rarer?

Thema Integrale?


Informationalise us please!

[MattOz]

kellydk said:

That car is on eBay for £25K or offers. It is also being sold by a trader in Leamington Spa. I saw the car about a year ago in a sorry state. The guy said he bought it on a whim and was going to sell it on once the work was complete. Obviously, it looks very good but £25-£27K is the high end for one of these and service history, caring owners etc are critical to the value. I would be very cautious about it knowing how it looked.

And to add to that, knowing where the car is and who has done the work on it, you need eyes well and truly open. Never has caveat emptor been more apt.

[Turbobanana]

Sidney Smut said:

Now this is rare but I almost bought a metallic blue Thema Integrale, it was for sale in Sunderland in the early 90s... Wonder which is rarer?

Never knew they did one.

I almost got the man-maths to work on a Thema Wagon years back, before these had any "classic" connotations. LHD of course, but looked quite tidy and was up, IIRC, for only £1650!

Saw the car a few years ago at the NEC, on the Lancia Owners' Club stand or similar.

[BFleming]

Lancia Thesis is the next big thing; there are loads for sale in Germany (probably Italy too, but I speak German & not Italian!). It'll tick many boxes, namely:
- cheap to buy
- run with reasonable reliability
- look astounding (in a good way (in my tired eyes))
- proven mechanicals
- fall to bits over time as the build quality just wasn't there
- ultimately become a labour of love



On the mention of a Thema Integrale... there wasn't one. There was a Thema Turbo, there were some hot Delta's, even a hot Dedra, but the 8.32 was as hot as the Thema got.

[BFleming]

Hub said:

Turbobanana said:

Thanks BF - good homework there.

In my mind I would have ranked their survival rates in that order, but not necessarily to that magnitude: 60 times as many 9000s as Cromas? Wow...

The 9000 was sold until the late 90s, whereas the Croma probably petered out in the early 90s, and FIAT's big cars are never that popular anyway.

Three of the four 'Tipo 4' cars launched in 1985, with the Alfa 164 coming 2 years later. I remember Alfa re-engineering their version substantially, hence few people remember it as a Tipo 4 car.
I would have said the Croma died first in 1993/4, but wikipedia tells me they continued making them until 1996. I don't think they sold them in the UK after 93/94 though.
The Thema was end-of-lifed when the Kappa appeared, so 1994 (the Kappa not being sold in the UK as this was the time of Lancia's withdrawal from RHD markets).
The 9000 continued being built up to early 1998 (it was sold alongside the 9-5 for a year or so), and had 2 body styles for a while (hatch & saloon).
The 164 began (as mentioned above) in 1987, and continued until 1998 when the 166 replaced it.

The 9000 was definitely the sales hit of the bunch by a country mile. Saab built high end cars very successfully, and their marketing of the 9000 was also well funded. They cleaned up, and continued doing so until GM came in (like Vikings, ironically) and plundered Saab for everything it had.

I had a Saturday job in a Fiat garage as a 16 year old, and the Croma was a lovely place to be - especially when you got out of a Ritmo (Strada) Mk3 or a Regata & into one. The Croma Turbo was pretty rare back in the day, but they certainly moved well - especially compared to the Argenta they replaced!

[s m]

BFleming said:

L

On the mention of a Thema Integrale... there wasn't one. There was a Thema Turbo, there were some hot Delta's, even a hot Dedra, but the 8.32 was as hot as the Thema got.

Ah that's what I suspected but was keen to hear about a 'one-off'

I suspect if there had been the Lancia management would have been driven round the RAC rally route in them in the late 80s rather than Italian plate 8.32s and Turbos

[mrbarnett]

Surprised nobody's mentioned the previous gen Maserati Quattroporte. That was surely a similar match to the Thema than the aforementioned Alfa Romeo Giulia Quadrifoglio; Ferrari donates V8 and - in earlier models - its gearbox, crank changed to burbly cross plane, all fitted to large saloon and off it goes.

Difference is the Quattroporte was rear wheel drive and sold pretty well (lots of money around pre-2008).

No idea what the current Quattroporte has under the bonnet...probably a V6 hybrid diesel

[westernlancia]

Resist the temptation - they're ste. I am a retired Lancia restorer so I should know. This is a car with sub-Fiat build quality and Ferrari parts prices, plus a bodyshell terribly lacking in rigidity (like all the Type 4s).

I once read an article in Auto Italia that described the Thema as 'a collection of spare parts travelling in loose formation', and that's spot on. I have owned and driven 5 Themas and restored an 8.32 for a customer, and if you pay beans for them and run them as 'beaters' you won't be disappointed - I got 3 of mine free of charge, and as with Ryanair tickets they were worth what I paid for them.

FWIW I'd rather have one with a Lampredi twincam, because those are unburstable and brilliant. The Thema Dedra Consortium have a shed full of them because they are so reliable that no-one ever needs any parts.

But the thought of paying £10K plus for a Thema and expecting it to be a poor man's Ferrari will leave you sadly deluded - you will end up a poor man but you won't have a Ferrari.

P.S. The leather covering on the dash shrinks, and the only way to fix it is to get it redone totally - ££££££...

[otolith]

westernlancia said:

But the thought of paying £10K plus for a Thema and expecting it to be a poor man's Ferrari will leave you sadly deluded - you will end up a poor man but you won't have a Ferrari.

You know that old quote attributed to Enzo Ferrari about "When you buy a Ferrari, you pay for the engine, and I will give the rest of the car free"?

[viggyp]

Hub said:

An interesting car, but you'd have to really want one. I imagine the running costs are a little high for the performance on offer. IIRC the Thema Turbo was very similar performance wise.

Yeah. The Turbo was quicker to about 80/90mph then the 8.32 would pull away.

Here’s my old one which I got rid of this time of year in 2007. It had an uprated Turbo and at lower than standard boost (0.9bar compared to 1.1bar standard) it was up 15bhp to 220. Really wish I kept it and dropped either a Coupe 20VT/Alfa 3.2 GTA lump into it.

[defonsecca]

Fantastic leftfield choice. Only Lancia would be crazy enough to launch such a car, and it's it's a big reason why I love Lancia so much. Now they only produce the mini Ypsilon specifically for Italian women - what a terrible way for such a fabulous marque with all that history to end-up. Shame on Fiat.

Hopefully when they kill it off someone like Automobili Amos will buy the badge & start making more proper Lancias like their stunning Delta Futurista - though more affordable.

[viggyp]

defonsecca said:

Fantastic leftfield choice. Only Lancia would be crazy enough to launch such a car, and it's it's a big reason why I love Lancia so much. Now they only produce the mini Ypsilon specifically for Italian women - what a terrible way for such a fabulous marque with all that history to end-up. Shame on Fiat.

Hopefully when they kill it off someone like Automobili Amos will buy the badge & start making more proper Lancias like their stunning Delta Futurista - though more affordable.

Agree with all the above mate. A company which templated a lot of what we see on everyday cars also being reduced to rebadged Chryslers. Fiat really do need to save Lancia and make a new Stratos and Integrale.

[kilarney]

I had the 164 3.0 V6. It remains to this day the most unreliable car I have ever owned and with the most torque steer, it was the most attractive of the 4 imo and the engine is up there with the 8.32 for music.

At the time the Croma and Thema were as crap as the name, in reality nothing has changed, totally unremarkable. I was a keen lancia man at the time having owned turbo deltas.

[defonsecca]

viggyp said:

Agree with all the above mate. A company which templated a lot of what we see on everyday cars also being reduced to rebadged Chryslers. Fiat really do need to save Lancia and make a new Stratos and Integrale.

..... yep, though they've now stopped making re-badged Chryslers thankfully. At least that's one less humiliation for Lancia to put up with.

Agree about the Stratos & integrale - and with the number of platforms available in the Fiat Group (in particular Ferrari & Maserati) I wouldn't have thought it would cost too much to just bolt-on a stunning body, call it a Stratos or integrale (or Fulvia or Flaminia or Aurelia - their list of magnificent cars just goes on & on) and charge a pretty hefty price. It might not sell in huge numbers but would be good profit. And for us mere mortals they missed a massive opportunity to re-launch the Lancia brand by not producing the stunning Fulvia concept shown at Frankfurt Salon in the early 2000's, could've easily fitted on eg) the Alfa 147 chassis:

.




.... you're not telling me that wouldn't have sold well...??? If only they had the balls

[aaron_2000]

Yes please

https://www.carthrottle.com/post/a-unique-lancia-t...

[LuS1fer]

You can get a newer 300hp dodgy V8 taxi from Cadillac, post 1998, the Seville, sold in RHD too IIRC.

[viggyp]

defonsecca said:

viggyp said:

Agree with all the above mate. A company which templated a lot of what we see on everyday cars also being reduced to rebadged Chryslers. Fiat really do need to save Lancia and make a new Stratos and Integrale.

..... yep, though they've now stopped making re-badged Chryslers thankfully. At least that's one less humiliation for Lancia to put up with.

Agree about the Stratos & integrale - and with the number of platforms available in the Fiat Group (in particular Ferrari & Maserati) I wouldn't have thought it would cost too much to just bolt-on a stunning body, call it a Stratos or integrale (or Fulvia or Flaminia or Aurelia - their list of magnificent cars just goes on & on) and charge a pretty hefty price. It might not sell in huge numbers but would be good profit. And for us mere mortals they missed a massive opportunity to re-launch the Lancia brand by not producing the stunning Fulvia concept shown at Frankfurt Salon in the early 2000's, could've easily fitted on eg) the Alfa 147 chassis:

.




.... you're not telling me that wouldn't have sold well...??? If only they had the balls

The Italians are great at making concept cars and either wait so long to put them into production (Brera & 500) or not making them at all.

I love that concept Fulvia and I’m sure it was based on the Fiat Barchetta. That would’ve sold big time.

[LewisR]

Dale487 said:

What more could you want - a Ferrari engined Lancia super saloon? The want is very big.

(I've have to find the correct gear knob & fast - its upsetting my originality freak.)

RWD longitudinal and more than 215bhp would have been better.
The E28 M5 from the same age had 286bhp.