RE: 911 Turbo vs 911 GT3
RE: 911 Turbo vs 911 GT3
Thursday 29th August 2013

911 Turbo vs 911 GT3

The biggest fight the extreme 911s face? It's against each other



In reality, the 911 Turbo versus GT3 discussion should be a short one. Their characters are so different and their appeal so disparate that Turbo or GT3 just isn't a thought that tends to cross the minds of genuine buyers; they're not even the same people. Besides, the UK's initial allocation of GT3s is already accounted for and its lack of rear seats immediately rules it out for some. For those of us who can only discuss these cars in fantastical terms, however, Turbo or GT3 is a point of pressing concern.

Numbers and chassis tech more similar than ever
Numbers and chassis tech more similar than ever
A person's preference either way says a lot about the qualities he or she values in a performance car. The Turbo has clearly become the day-to-day go-faster 911, whereas the GT3 is the much less compromising, more hardcore variant.

Now in its sixth generation the 911 Turbo is even more mind-alteringly rapid than ever, if a little unrewarding with it , while the latest GT3 is the third in a bloodline that's not yet 15 years old. At some point during that decade and a half a paradigm shift has occurred; the Turbo has been usurped by the GT3 as the poster boy of the 911 range.

Porsche has had to work hard to define separate identities for the two models, but with a PDK gearbox and more daily usability than ever , is the GT3 beginning to encroach on the Turbo's territory?

"Independent characters," says Porsche's Achleitner
"Independent characters," says Porsche's Achleitner
"No. They still have independent characters," reckons August Achleitner, head of the 911 model-line. "We did some comparison test drives together with the guys from the Motorsport department. We took some GT3s and some Turbos and we're quietly satisfied with their different characters. One has a normally aspirated engine, which needs revs, and the other one is just standing above all!"

Whether sticking to the corporate PR line or simply telling the truth, Achleitner insists there is no rivalry between the Turbo and GT3 engineering teams and is quick to highlight shared intel that has improved both cars. "The main development work for the rear-wheel steering had been made on the Turbo and the guys from the Motorsport department made a special application for the GT3," he says. "The hardware is the same and the software architecture is also the same, but of the course the data is a little bit different.

"The steering calibration is also similar. There is a difference to the regular Carrera, which has been possible because of the rear-wheel steering. It's a little bit more direct. It wouldn't make sense to take the same data to the Carrera because it works with the rear-wheel steering."

Would the GT3 be 'allowed' a faster 'ring lap?
Would the GT3 be 'allowed' a faster 'ring lap?
In the raw figures alone the Turbo has the a clear edge on the GT3, particularly in S guise. 560hp plays 475hp, while 553lb ft is in a different ballpark to the GT3's 325lb ft. Four-wheel drive helps the Turbo S hit 62mph in 3.1 seconds compared to 3.5 for the GT3. The Turbo S goes 2mph harder at the top end with a maximum speed of 198mph. You'll pay for it, though; at £140,852 the Turbo S is more expensive than a GT3 and a Cayman 2.7 combined.

Has the Nurburgring lap time soap opera reached the point where a single second - Porsche quotes 7min 24secs for the Turbo S, versus 7min 25secs for the GT3 on the same tyres - counts for something? Achleitner isn't concerned. "The 'ring times are almost the same. If you look at the past these cars have always been quite similar in terms of lap time, but the character of course is completely different."

Neutral Achleitner may be, but when asked about the Turbo's rivals from outside of Porsche he can't help but blow its trumpet. "The Turbo has no enemy on the road, it is faster than everything. The acceleration comes so easy. Just by the torque it is easy to drive and so fast."

Different paths but ultimately similar destinations
Different paths but ultimately similar destinations
And compared to the Ferrari 458 and McLaren 12C? "These supercars are very good, but the Turbo is easier to drive fast. We did some comparison tests with some competitors and everyone has been really surprised how easy it is to drive fast."

That's central to the Turbo's appeal, reckons Achleitner, but GT3 customers surely want more of a challenge. Perhaps it's the level of input required to extract the full performance from each that separates and defines these cars. That begs two questions: how many of us would take the GT3 over the Turbo as an only car, and would any of us choose the Turbo over the GT3 as a weekend car?

Inspired? Search Porsche 911 Turbo & 911 GT3s for sale

Author
Discussion

hornbaek

Original Poster:

3,838 posts

265 months

Thursday 29th August 2013
quotequote all
They are too similar with shared gearboxes and rear suspension. Whereas the Turbo has just continued on its trajectory of being an everyday supercar the GT3 has deviated more from its path by getting more accessible and hence less extreme.

keiran

39 posts

224 months

Thursday 29th August 2013
quotequote all
Veering slightly off topic..
I wonder if they would have ever thought about putting a manual in the GT3, and then sticking the PDK in the GT3 RS when it comes out, considering the former is mostly used on the road (where I would think it would be mostly missed) - and the latter on the track - where you wouldn't miss it so much...

Just a thought, but I guess its mostly boils down to trying to get the most amount of sales (from people who cant drive manual but want to have a gt3).

Edited by keiran on Thursday 29th August 09:45

Lowtimer

4,293 posts

198 months

Thursday 29th August 2013
quotequote all
It would be the Turbo for me in both cases, just for the greater compliance and vastly better traction. Sometimes I'm putting the power down on lumpy bumpy country roads, often with mud and big puddles, and sometimes I'm going long distances for actual travel down the trunk road and motorway network. Either way the Turbo would suit be better. I'm not greatly interested in track use, and obviously expect dedicated track fiends to have a different perspective.

Fire99

9,868 posts

259 months

Thursday 29th August 2013
quotequote all
keiran said:
I wonder if they would have ever thought about putting a manual in the GT3, and then sticking the PDK in the GT3 RS when it comes out, considering the former is mostly used on the road (where I would think it would be mostly missed) - and the latter on the track - where you wouldn't miss it so much...
Personally, I'd have it the other way around. PDK for a 'strictly' road car (lazy commuting etc) and Manual for the car I'd use for Road/Track work.

I like to get the most of my track time and having a manual gearbox adds to that..

matpilch

246 posts

170 months

Thursday 29th August 2013
quotequote all
if only the gt3 wasn't pdk only no such stories would exist.

shame on you, porsche. real shame

Nick644

241 posts

297 months

Thursday 29th August 2013
quotequote all
I hear they have used a clever software algorithm to enable the next GT3 RS to drive itself on any track worldwide, taking data from Marc Lieb, (porsche factory racer), so the driver only needs to start the engine and enjoy the ride, matching the lap records at any given track, lap after lap. Incredible progress and Porsche are proud of this engineering feet which has enabled the Chinese and Russian markets to now simulate the same skill set as a professional driver. They do admit however to disappointment that the driver still needs to go through the aggravation of having to manually start the engine.

jason61c

5,978 posts

204 months

Thursday 29th August 2013
quotequote all
Did they do back to back tests with the GTR?

epom

14,989 posts

191 months

Thursday 29th August 2013
quotequote all
The GT3 for me please and thanks, not that I'll be choosing anytime soon!!

s m

24,492 posts

233 months

Thursday 29th August 2013
quotequote all
When's the GT2 RS due out?

framerateuk

2,951 posts

214 months

Thursday 29th August 2013
quotequote all
I'd take the Turbo as my everyday car, no trouble. Cabriolet please so I can hear the soundtrack!

Weekend car? I'd rather something small and light. Same goes for trackdays, I'm sure the GT3 would be epic, but it's not what I'd want to be flying around a track in. Caterham or Atom please.

arkenphel

484 posts

235 months

Thursday 29th August 2013
quotequote all
U'd like to say I'm a GT3 kinda guy, but in reality I don't think I have the skill to drive these cars at their full potential, and therefore need all the help I can get, hence my slightly disappointing decision to go with the Turbo...

Fire99

9,868 posts

259 months

Thursday 29th August 2013
quotequote all
Nick644 said:
I hear they have used a clever software algorithm to enable the next GT3 RS to drive itself on any track worldwide, taking data from Marc Lieb, (porsche factory racer), so the driver only needs to start the engine and enjoy the ride, matching the lap records at any given track, lap after lap. Incredible progress and Porsche are proud of this engineering feet which has enabled the Chinese and Russian markets to now simulate the same skill set as a professional driver. They do admit however to disappointment that the driver still needs to go through the aggravation of having to manually start the engine.
Funny but also a little sad, since it's actually not THAT far from the truth.

Rawwr

22,722 posts

264 months

Thursday 29th August 2013
quotequote all
If I wanted to get from A to B as quickly as possibly with the least fuss, I'd take the Turbo.

If I wanted to get from A to B grinning like a moron, I'd take the GT3.

keiran

39 posts

224 months

Thursday 29th August 2013
quotequote all
Fire99 said:
keiran said:
I wonder if they would have ever thought about putting a manual in the GT3, and then sticking the PDK in the GT3 RS when it comes out, considering the former is mostly used on the road (where I would think it would be mostly missed) - and the latter on the track - where you wouldn't miss it so much...
Personally, I'd have it the other way around. PDK for a 'strictly' road car (lazy commuting etc) and Manual for the car I'd use for Road/Track work.

I like to get the most of my track time and having a manual gearbox adds to that..
Yeah True, Could work either way, I doubt it would happen though...

tejr

3,502 posts

194 months

Thursday 29th August 2013
quotequote all
GT3.. not a fan of the Turbo for the same reason I'm not a fan of a Veyron.. They appeal to different people, but it seems that becoming more due to marketing than actual differences in the cars. Its now more a case of "would you like a turbo on your 911 or not, sir?"

Mr Whippy

32,453 posts

271 months

Thursday 29th August 2013
quotequote all
Next GT3 will be a turbo, because that is what is fastest/best and who really cares that much about NA response/sound any more?

hehe

Kronstein

294 posts

159 months

Thursday 29th August 2013
quotequote all
In some ways the convergence of the 3 and Turbo mean the Turbo is the more obvious choice now together with either an earlier RS/3 or something more harcore/interactive.

STiG911

1,210 posts

197 months

Thursday 29th August 2013
quotequote all
GT3 - Everyday of the week and 9k rpm on Sundays cloud9

GRBF430F1

4,843 posts

200 months

Thursday 29th August 2013
quotequote all
GT3 for me if you want to enjoy driving and thats not all about outright speed.

I also think the turbo/s looks are no where near as kind to the eye.

Front bumper and rear wheel arches look absolutely dreadful IMHO. Looks like its carrying saddlebags. Reminds me of an old Renault 5 turbo.

I've never thought Porsches were pretty cars, more function than form, but I think the new 981 boxster is spot on but it looks like someone has been trying too hard with the 991 turbo/s

f1ten

2,165 posts

183 months

Thursday 29th August 2013
quotequote all
lots of people like to play top trumps on numbers (not saying Im one of them) and purely on this the Turbo blows away the gt3. Of course rarity, engine noise, depreciation are all better for the gt3. Im actually now really liking the look of the gt3 car, something that really only the previous gt3 rs versions were able to evoke in my view.