RE: Mercedes-Benz S600 (W220) | The Brave Pill

RE: Mercedes-Benz S600 (W220) | The Brave Pill

Saturday 12th September 2020

Mercedes-Benz S600 (W220) | The Brave Pill

A car so scary that all our other Pills are frightened of it



Last week's BMW Z3 M Coupe was well liked by the PH massive, but was short on the sort of searing spice that makes automotive life truly adventurous. We promised you something braver this time, and here it is - a Pill that doesn't so much reset the balance as accidentally pay Apple's quarterly profits into your overdrawn current account. Behold, the £3,995 Mercedes S600.

Merc's cheaper 12-cylinder models have been a very happy hunting ground for this column since its inception. This week's W220 S-Class is the fourth of the genre to make the grade (and then likely overheat at the top.) It follows on from a twin-turbo W221 S600, a C140 S600 Coupe and a C215 CL600, all of which look like green salads next to this week's chunk of bloody red meat.

The CL600 we featured back in February was being offered for just £7,500, which looked like a bargain at the time. But this saloon version of the same mechanical package is up for not much more than half that. It's the cheapest 12-cylinder car currently in the classifieds - by nearly ten grand. As you might expect, it's not in tip-top condition, but that's definitely reflected in the price.


The 1990s were not a particularly happy time for Mercedes. The brand was in flux. Or, less kindly, crisis. The famed solidity of the company's products had earned it a loyal and devoted following among those who didn't mind paying for quality, from Stuttgart's taxi drivers to the middle-class buyers who would happily fork out more for a four-cylinder E-Class with keep-fit windows than a fully loaded V6 Granada.

But while sales had grown, Merc's leadership wanted more, especially as bitter rival BMW's volumes began to take off. So Mercedes decided to ape those now banned gym pill adverts and Get Big Fast. Cars would look bolder, be packed with exciting new technology and much less concern would be given to how well they would last over ten years. Or, in many cases, even three.

As the brand's flagship, the S-Class led this new strategy. The previous W140 generation car hadn't been a poster child for trouble-free motoring, but the W220 would take the moneypit reputation to a whole new level.


Launched in 1998, the "S-Class for the 21st century" as Merc pitched it was styled by Steve Mattin, the designer who would later lead Volvo through its pig snout period. It was much more curvaceous than its predecessor, the then-catchphrase being "organic design". The W203 C-Class that followed in 2000 would offer a downsized take on similar themes, but the S-Class was pretty radical when it was launched. It wasn't just the exterior - the cabin also gained a multitude of swoops and circular forms where its predecessors were straight and slabby.

The S was also to be a technical showcase. Air suspension was standard, with posher versions getting the much more complex Active Body Control which used hydropnuematic suspension struts charged by an on-board pump to fight roll and mitigate bumps. All versions got stability control, also the novel Brake Assist, this delivering maximum retardation in response to a stamped left pedal even if the driver's foot wasn't creating enough hydraulic pressure. Other innovations included a COMAND infotainment system with colour sat-nav, curtain airbags, keyless go, xenon headlights and the pioneering option of radar cruise control.

Buyers of the W220 had no shortage of engines to choose from, most of which are much too boring to detain us more than briefly: two V6s, two V8s, a CDI diesel V6 and - in some LHD markets - a brawny V8 oiler. At the top of the range Mercedes offered two powerplants with very different characters but almost identical power outputs: a 5.5-litre 355hp AMG V8 and a 5.8-litre 362hp V12 that powered the range-topping S600. Both engines had the same 391 lb ft torque peaks.


The V12's main purpose was to appeal to those buyers who regarded more cylinders as better, but also those who wanted a quieter life than the sometimes snarly AMG 55 could offer. Because despite the triple-valve engine's size and number of moving parts, its muscle was barely flexed in everyday use - only under hard progress did it have any noticeable note at all. Progress in a fresh and well-maintained S600 is about as serene as it gets; endurance on longer journeys is limited only by fuel range - only the gentlest-footed use would get more than 350 miles from a brimmed 88 litre tank - and occupants' bladder capacity.

While the S600 was popular in some places, with close to half of early production going to the former Soviet Bloc, most markets preferred the cheaper and more characterful AMG version. But not the first buyer of our Pill.

Bringing us to some of the reasons for that low, low price. The first and most obvious is the fact the car has covered 179,000 miles. The second is the fact it carries a Cat D marker, although one it earned as long ago as 2010. The third, and most significant, has to be the most comprehensive (and honest) advert description in Brave Pill history. Edited highlights include an SRS airbag warning light, an occasional appearance for the scarier one that indicates the ABC system is about to get spendy, brake pad warnings, non-functioning indicator repeaters on the mirrors, rust on doors and rear wings plus a dinged back bumper. The vendor also reports "a slight notchy feeling when turning right only."


Obscured number plates deny us a forensic look at the car's MOT history, but such frank disclosures in the text suggest it won't be all green. Or even mostly. On the plus side, we're assured that the tyres are good and that it has recently had £1,600-worth of coil packs, one of the other well-known areas of pricey borkage. The previous owner also had it for ten years - which counts as a very good innings for something so expensive to run; we're also told that the air-con still works and the hot-and-cold seats are both still heated and ventilated.

The advert also bears the proviso "Trade sale only, no warranty given or implied, spares or repairs" - one that is almost certain to excite some barrack room lawyers in the comments, but actually looks like a fairly candid admission of the state the car is in. What would be a fair price for a comprehensive warranty on something like this? £5,000 a year? £10,000? Apple's quarterly profits?

So, in short, it's about as brave as any car can be without actually being on fire - although one that must be close to being worth more in parts than it is in one piece. But if anyone with sufficiently clanky trousers is contemplating a banger rally, or even a high-speed escape from a bank robbery, it could be perfect. V12 motoring doesn't come cheaper than this.

See the original advert here.





Author
Discussion

Martingt4

Original Poster:

10 posts

110 months

Saturday 12th September 2020
quotequote all
This is nuts, I think I love it
Also the reg is clearly visible in photo 7.
Mot history isn't as scary as you might expect with only a couple of failures and hardly any advisories.
Last failure was in 2015 for incorrect indicator colour.
Although the fact there is only three days left on the current test surely makes this the bravest brave pill ever lol

Hamo86

40 posts

57 months

Saturday 12th September 2020
quotequote all
If I could get one of these in Australia for this price I’ll buy one in a heart beat and drive it until the wheels fall off. Absolutely love em, so ridiculous in 2020 makes em even more appealing

FlukePlay

1,093 posts

158 months

Saturday 12th September 2020
quotequote all
It's not illegal to offer a car for sale without a warranty and this trader has offered a pretty clear description of any faults the car has. The 'trade only' and 'spares or repair' indicates that the expectation is that it will go 'pop' in the near future. Can it offer a 2,500 mile euro road trip before that happens? This comes with humongous risk.

alorotom

12,346 posts

200 months

Saturday 12th September 2020
quotequote all
looks like a overly tired dog ... I dont think this is a brave pill, more a mentally deficient pill.

A Winner Is You

25,438 posts

240 months

Saturday 12th September 2020
quotequote all
They forgot to cover the front plate.....MOT runs out Tuesday, but the history isn't too bad

anonymous-user

67 months

Saturday 12th September 2020
quotequote all
I think this one needs to be shipped out to Albania.


Mr E

22,368 posts

272 months

Saturday 12th September 2020
quotequote all
Sporadic ABC light?
Bravery trousers to maximum!

(Although, if you already owned one, a rolling parts store for 3-4k might be half sensible?)

anonymous-user

67 months

Saturday 12th September 2020
quotequote all
That's a £1,500 shed that's had a polish. Mercedes made some utter st through the 90s and 00s but at the very top of that very long list is the W220 and a little bit below it, maybe one below the W210, is this hopeless V12 engine.

I think I said on another thread that this must be the only V12 engine designed on a "cost reduced" basis with it's cheapskate 3 valve single cam heads replacing the quad cam four valve heads in their masterpiece M120. The V8 in the W220 was also a reduced cost version of the previous quad cam engine, with both engines making less power and torque than their predecessors.

A short list of common but very expensive issues with this turd of an engine:

Coil packs go (£700 per side for the part)
Oil cooler in the middle of the V leaks, requiring the removement of both heads to replace it
Bores go out of round, losing compression and burning oil
Burned oil poisons the SIX catalytic converters
Sensors. All of them.

And in return you get 360bhp and 530NM. Utterly pathetic.

They managed to redeem the engine with the later twin turbo version (imagine if they'd twin turbo'd the quad cam though...) and by all accounts the W221 seems to be a return to S-Class form, but for the good of dreamers and shed men everywhere all the W220s should be rounded up and crushed with the naturally aspirated V12s going first.


AC43

12,468 posts

221 months

Saturday 12th September 2020
quotequote all
Seriously mental.

There's been a soot-chucker version of that's been sitting in my local indy for 7 months now.

Water got in the boot & fried some of the ECU stuff which has been on back order ever since.

There was a W plate one running about with major rust on every panel and fist-sized holes. Haven't seen it in a while. Presumably the rust/electrics/gearbox/ABC/any-one-of-another-million-things cried enough.


anonymous-user

67 months

Saturday 12th September 2020
quotequote all
stickleback123 said:
A short list of common but very expensive issues with this turd of an engine.....
TBF, this has done nearly 180k...it can't be that bad an engine.

anonymous-user

67 months

Saturday 12th September 2020
quotequote all
Argleton said:
stickleback123 said:
A short list of common but very expensive issues with this turd of an engine.....
TBF, this has done nearly 180k...it can't be that bad an engine.
I'd love to see the bills it's had in that time though. It'll have had at least two coil packs, I understand that the oil cooler failure rate is 100% too.

Mercedes always had this reputation as lasting forever, but that was in no small part because private buyers absolutely throw money at them in a way that Sierra or Mondeo owners don't. For example a couple of years ago the previous owner of my then 10 year old S-Class spent £3,500 to get his DAB radio working again, a couple of years earlier he spent the same fixing his massaging passenger seat. He'd have throw similar amounts at the engine if that needed it too, no doubt.

Any engine can do 180k miles if the owner is willing to spend £10k over 20 years repairing it.

Sandpit Steve

12,294 posts

87 months

Saturday 12th September 2020
quotequote all
The cheapest V12 in the classifieds, what could possibly go wrong - apart from absolutely everything! A very brave pill for someone who’s going to be very handy with a spanner if they don’t quickly want to be bankrupt.

anonymous-user

67 months

Saturday 12th September 2020
quotequote all
stickleback123 said:
Argleton said:
stickleback123 said:
A short list of common but very expensive issues with this turd of an engine.....
TBF, this has done nearly 180k...it can't be that bad an engine.
I'd love to see the bills it's had in that time though. It'll have had at least two coil packs, I understand that the oil cooler failure rate is 100% too.

Mercedes always had this reputation as lasting forever, but that was in no small part because private buyers absolutely throw money at them in a way that Sierra or Mondeo owners don't. For example a couple of years ago the previous owner of my then 10 year old S-Class spent £3,500 to get his DAB radio working again, a couple of years earlier he spent the same fixing his massaging passenger seat. He'd have throw similar amounts at the engine if that needed it too, no doubt.

Any engine can do 180k miles if the owner is willing to spend £10k over 20 years repairing it.
But we're talking about a near 6.0 litre 12 cylinder car that was once over 100 grand! Of course it's going to cost a bit to run. It's not a 1.0 3 cyl hatch.

Don't get me wrong, I do not like this Chrysler generation of Mercedes and agree with the cost cutting aspect. But you'll find any large luxury car would cost similar amounts to run. You'll spend the same on a V12 BMW, W12 Audi and even more eye watering Bentley or Rolls.

Is this worth it? Depends, but I would say not in this case, unless you owned the car from new and happy with it. But taking on someone else's clearly abused car for a few thousand is not worth it here.

anonymous-user

67 months

Saturday 12th September 2020
quotequote all
Argleton said:
But we're talking about a near 6.0 litre 12 cylinder car that was once over 100 grand! Of course it's going to cost a bit to run. It's not a 1.0 3 cyl hatch.

Don't get me wrong, I do not like this Chrysler generation of Mercedes and agree with the cost cutting aspect. But you'll find any large luxury car would cost similar amounts to run. You'll spend the same on a V12 BMW, W12 Audi and even more eye watering Bentley or Rolls.

Is this worth it? Depends, but I would say not in this case, unless you owned the car from new and happy with it. But taking on someone else's clearly abused car for a few thousand is not worth it here.
I get what you're saying and any formerly £100k+ car is going to have bigger running costs than a Focus (I've run loads of them, I think I've owned nearly every V12 from a mainstream manufacturer now - Toyota V12 is on the to do list!), but these engines totally fail in a way that nobody elses engines did anymore by the late 90s, much less high end manufacturers. The earlier quad cam engine would run forever with nothing but oil changes, make more power, and run smoother. This is a post from a US based Merc specialist in 2006:

"Do your self a favor and avoid any 600 with the M137 V-12 engine.
2000-2002 CL and S's. They are notorious for out of round cylinder walls
and oil fouling. I have replaced at least 10 of those engine's myself in the
last couple years for local clients. 2 of them, I had to replace the replacment
engine. A CL or S55 is a much better choice. Even the 500 is fine.
The 55 only gives up 18 hp to the V-12.
Extended warranty contract companies won't issue policies on v-12's.
We wholesale them out if they have no original warrany coverage when they come in on trade. That is why they are so damn cheap.
The only client I have that has had no issues with his 01 S600, drives the
snot out of it. 110k so far. The car has been great. All the low mile garage
queens with 20k die a expensive death.
(example : the excessive blow-by oil fouls out the 8 downstream o2 sensors
at $1600 total. The cats if damaged by oil cost $8,000 to replace all 6.
The engine can run over $34,000. parts only!....and on and on.)
The 2003's are a diffenent story. They have been virtually flawless."

Higher repair costs are one things, total engine replacement is another.

Sparky137

915 posts

194 months

Saturday 12th September 2020
quotequote all
stickleback123 said:
The only client I have that has had no issues with his 01 S600, drives the
snot out of it. 110k so far. The car has been great.
With 179k on it this car could fall into that category.

I tend to think that a vehicle of some 20 years old and a high mileage has had most if not all of the common major issues rectified and prevented from re occurance with improvement/modification/maintenance over the cars life. To get to 20 years old and 179k on an engine that reputedly is made of cheese suggests that it was either very well looked after or never had the common problems in the first place.

Bearing in mind the age of the car and its massive depreciation over time that has allowed it to fall into the financial reach of those that would otherwise buy a 10 year old Focus I'll bet its not had a proper maintenance regime for the last 5 to 10 years, in which case its either a ticking time bomb or bomb proof!!

ZX10R NIN

28,985 posts

138 months

Saturday 12th September 2020
quotequote all
Sparky137 said:
With 179k on it this car could fall into that category.

I tend to think that a vehicle of some 20 years old and a high mileage has had most if not all of the common major issues rectified and prevented from re occurance with improvement/modification/maintenance over the cars life. To get to 20 years old and 179k on an engine that reputedly is made of cheese suggests that it was either very well looked after or never had the common problems in the first place.

Bearing in mind the age of the car and its massive depreciation over time that has allowed it to fall into the financial reach of those that would otherwise buy a 10 year old Focus I'll bet its not had a proper maintenance regime for the last 5 to 10 years, in which case its either a ticking time bomb or bomb proof!!
It's had the same owner for the last 10 Years so I'd wager that it's actually been well looked after but I'd also be having a good look for rust.

The Vambo

7,121 posts

154 months

Saturday 12th September 2020
quotequote all
alorotom said:
looks like a overly tired dog ... I dont think this is a brave pill, more a mentally deficient pill.
laugh

Decky_Q

1,773 posts

190 months

Saturday 12th September 2020
quotequote all
I had a w220 s500 for a good while and took it to about 220k miles so I know these cars pretty well.
They drive extremely well.
If you go for genuine new parts yes they will be bloody expensive to run but there are good quality spurious parts for them that are similar money to any other car and I found a Mercedes only breaker beside me for the really expensive stuff done cheap. I budgeted about a grand a year for maintenance and didn't blow that budget.

I think alot of the fear is the hype that they are so advanced they need 17 computers on board, it uses fibre optics and pneumatic suspension/doors etc etc when really its just a car.

MissChief

7,423 posts

181 months

Saturday 12th September 2020
quotequote all
Stick a private plate on it and your neighbours would think you’ve won the lottery.

can't remember

1,096 posts

141 months

Saturday 12th September 2020
quotequote all
MissChief said:
Stick a private plate on it and your neighbours would think you’ve won the lottery.
Private plates aren't that expensive Quentin.