Discussion
DT398 said:
sagarich said:
In depth EVO video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tRxbgACxlec
"We listened to our customers...." Really? We must have said: "Please could you build this car in such limited quantities that customers that have supported you over many years and bought many cars, will have zero chance of getting one. When you do this, we will become so p*ssed off with the way Porsche repays that loyalty, we will go and buy McLarens instead"throt said:
All 911R's go to the 918 buyers, even across the pond, let alone here in the UK.
P have filled the vacuum of speculation with this edition, last of the NA's, its has a stick!, etc etc, is it really that special?.
If they made 5000, it would be seen as a super GTS.P have filled the vacuum of speculation with this edition, last of the NA's, its has a stick!, etc etc, is it really that special?.
It will be bought by people who already have a GT3/RS/918.
DT398 said:
"We listened to our customers...." Really? We must have said: "Please could you build this car in such limited quantities that customers that have supported you over many years and bought many cars, will have zero chance of getting one. When you do this, we will become so p*ssed off with the way Porsche repays that loyalty, we will go and buy McLarens instead"
Extremely good point.Although the 911R isn't a car fit for my needs, it seems wholly dispraportionate that they'd build a car with a list price of £130k that many people could afford & desire (same applies to the GT3RS & GT3 although the GT3's only what £110k list)? with the expectation to purely fuel the speculator market & see these cars at £250k used when they arrive. Why not build more & sell more so more enthusiasts could actually enjoy the great work Porsche do? The only winners here will be those who've already got a stable full of Supercars who'll make £100k on this car as soon as they collect it.
It does boil my pi$$ somewhat.
Echo all that...
Andreas seems like such a nice bloke and i was really absorbed watching the video, BUT, at the same time i wanted to throw my iPhone at the wall because they haven't 'listened' and made a 'purist's' or 'enthusiast's' car; they've made a little trinket for multi-millionaires to brag about and never use.
Andreas seems like such a nice bloke and i was really absorbed watching the video, BUT, at the same time i wanted to throw my iPhone at the wall because they haven't 'listened' and made a 'purist's' or 'enthusiast's' car; they've made a little trinket for multi-millionaires to brag about and never use.
TheDeadPrussian said:
throt said:
All 911R's go to the 918 buyers, even across the pond, let alone here in the UK.
This isn't actually true. I know at least one person who has been allocated an R (he was called by the Dealer Principle yesterday to confirm this) that doesn't own a 918.TheDeadPrussian said:
This isn't actually true. I know at least one person who has been allocated an R (he was called by the Dealer Principle yesterday to confirm this) that doesn't own a 918.
But i'd be confident it isn't someone who's not on the (bought over £1mil worth of Pork list)?W8PMC said:
But i'd be confident it isn't someone who's not on the (bought over £1mil worth of Pork list)?
He has a large car collection (mostly classics), of which several are Porsches, but I think it comes down to the fact that he was amongst the first to express a serious interest and to maintain that interest. He is also not someone who would be tempted to 'flip' the car.W8PMC said:
The only winners here will be those who've already got a stable full of Supercars who'll make £100k on this car as soon as they collect it.
It does boil my pi$$ somewhat.
That's my main issue. If you only want your select minted few to have it, price it at £250K+ and be done with it. Keep the profit for yourselves rather than deliberately giving your money away to the first buyer. Don't price it reasonably sensibly and then pi$$ off the rest of your customers. None of us are going to go out and buy a 991.2 because we can't get a 991R, you're not going to gain any extra sales from us. And for the general non-petrolhead punter who might buy a 991.2, they won't even have noticed the 991R was even launched and could care less.It does boil my pi$$ somewhat.
TheDeadPrussian said:
He has a large car collection (mostly classics), of which several are Porsches, but I think it comes down to the fact that he was amongst the first to express a serious interest and to maintain that interest. He is also not someone who would be tempted to 'flip' the car.
If they want to stop flippers they just need to charge £250K for it. Job jobbed. While there might be a few people here who'd pay £25K overs for it, an extra £120K would eliminate most people I think.Edited by Mario149 on Wednesday 2nd March 10:57
Mario149 said:
If they want to stop flippers they just need to charge £250K for it. Job jobbed. While there might be a few people here who'd pay £25K overs for it, an extra £120K would eliminate most people I think.
But that would cause an even worse problem. They would be castigated for profiteering and the mags would all say that it was good but not worth it and therefore it wouldn't win ECOTY!Edited by Mario149 on Wednesday 2nd March 10:57
The only answer is to make more. But they wont unless they change strategy.
TheDeadPrussian said:
He has a large car collection (mostly classics), of which several are Porsches, but I think it comes down to the fact that he was amongst the first to express a serious interest and to maintain that interest. He is also not someone who would be tempted to 'flip' the car.
But this raises another question. How can you express a serious interest in a car that up until yesterday wasn't confirmed & up until a few months ago wasn't even rumoured? Makes me think the select few knew well ahead of time these were coming.The 991 GT3/RS was always on the cards to be produced, but the R is more than a little left field so how can someone express an interest in a car that nobody knows about?
W8PMC said:
But this raises another question. How can you express a serious interest in a car that up until yesterday wasn't confirmed & up until a few months ago wasn't even rumoured? Makes me think the select few knew well ahead of time these were coming.
The 991 GT3/RS was always on the cards to be produced, but the R is more than a little left field so how can someone express an interest in a car that nobody knows about?
The "rumours" surrounding future Porsche products are usually quite accurate. The 991 GT3/RS was always on the cards to be produced, but the R is more than a little left field so how can someone express an interest in a car that nobody knows about?
The 911R rumour has been floating around for a while. Now is a good time to express interest in a 991.2 GT2 for example.
hunter 66 said:
The R is very similar in power and idea to the 570S and was probably the reason it was made ...... just as a car the 570 is a bit more dynamic ( 30 % better ) due to carbon tub etc ....... also little easier to buy .
BUT we are POrsche nuts and cannot help ourselves
the 570S does have a hydrolic rack still :-) Porsche must have lost Sales as people switch brands to cars they CAN buy.BUT we are POrsche nuts and cannot help ourselves
to quote the 570 steering
"The steering, moderately quick at 2.5 turns from lock to lock, lacks the nervousness that can afflict Ferraris and is full of information while largely free from kickback. In its weight and finesse and accuracy, though, it’s first class. "
sounds nice, I will have to get a test drive.
And not only that if one cannot buy a GT3,911R etc then one will prob avoid the Porsche dealer ship for the wifes Macan and buy another brand, so 2 sales lost per client who moves brand.
I find it very odd, but they are selling cars to the masses.
Edited by Porsche911R on Wednesday 2nd March 11:38
mollytherocker said:
Mario149 said:
If they want to stop flippers they just need to charge £250K for it. Job jobbed. While there might be a few people here who'd pay £25K overs for it, an extra £120K would eliminate most people I think.
But that would cause an even worse problem. They would be castigated for profiteering and the mags would all say that it was good but not worth it and therefore it wouldn't win ECOTY!Edited by Mario149 on Wednesday 2nd March 10:57
The only answer is to make more. But they wont unless they change strategy.
As it is now, everyone's unhappy apart from 918 owners and the odd person who's dropped mega money at an OPC.
Edited by Mario149 on Wednesday 2nd March 11:37
If Porsche GT cars depreciated like virtually all their peers ~80% of people on here would not be the least bit interested in them as they wouldn't be able to stomach losing 60% of their cash in 3 years.
People have short memories, a 997GT2 was £135K new in 2008/9 and around 2011 was worth about £60K, this is normal car depreciation and so demand for the car was mainly people who wanted it to try and drive (OK maybe the very first tranche of punters maybe have been speculators) and would accept that they would lose money.
Today's angry people (like many in this thread) should stop pretending, what you guys really want is a free car (or even better overs) to drive for a year or so. This is Porsche's show, they created the demand and it's their rules - suck it the f
k up 
And to the guy above panicking to get one's name down for a 991GT2, would he actually want one (and keep it) if it lost £25K in its first year ?
People have short memories, a 997GT2 was £135K new in 2008/9 and around 2011 was worth about £60K, this is normal car depreciation and so demand for the car was mainly people who wanted it to try and drive (OK maybe the very first tranche of punters maybe have been speculators) and would accept that they would lose money.
Today's angry people (like many in this thread) should stop pretending, what you guys really want is a free car (or even better overs) to drive for a year or so. This is Porsche's show, they created the demand and it's their rules - suck it the f
k up And to the guy above panicking to get one's name down for a 991GT2, would he actually want one (and keep it) if it lost £25K in its first year ?
TB993tt said:
If Porsche GT cars depreciated like virtually all their peers ~80% of people on here would not be the least bit interested in them as they wouldn't be able to stomach losing 60% of their cash in 3 years.
People have short memories, a 997GT2 was £135K new in 2008/9 and around 2011 was worth about £60K, this is normal car depreciation and so demand for the car was mainly people who wanted it to try and drive (OK maybe the very first tranche of punters maybe have been speculators) and would accept that they would lose money.
Today's angry people (like many in this thread) should stop pretending, what you guys really want is a free car (or even better overs) to drive for a year or so. This is Porsche's show, they created the demand and it's their rules - suck it the fk up
And to the guy above panicking to get one's name down for a 991GT2, would he actually want one (and keep it) if it lost £25K in its first year ?
It's a car forum & that's what happens. I think most commenting here either have a Porsche, want a Porsche or are just drawn to the brand, so although i'm sure many are not in a position to spunk £250k into a car, i'd hazard a guess many could or would love to own an aspirational piece of Pork at £100-130k, however are excluded because they're not in the clique. Let's be honest we all know 90% of these 991R's will be collected by people who'll never drive them or more likely flip them & make a quick £100k. It's what's happened with most of the RS's although i tend to think the %age of 991 GT3 owners who have or will do that is likely to be lower at say 50%.People have short memories, a 997GT2 was £135K new in 2008/9 and around 2011 was worth about £60K, this is normal car depreciation and so demand for the car was mainly people who wanted it to try and drive (OK maybe the very first tranche of punters maybe have been speculators) and would accept that they would lose money.
Today's angry people (like many in this thread) should stop pretending, what you guys really want is a free car (or even better overs) to drive for a year or so. This is Porsche's show, they created the demand and it's their rules - suck it the f
k up And to the guy above panicking to get one's name down for a 991GT2, would he actually want one (and keep it) if it lost £25K in its first year ?
Even so, excluding so many people who want, would drive & can afford these cars in favour of those who'll clearly just make a quick ££ is somewhat frustrating & although i'm sure it won't damage the brand overall, it will be pi$$ing a few people off.
Honestly, I think if you put in an order (for an RS with an Option to change for an R) in time (i.e. not two weeks before Geneva) you had as fair a chance as it will get with only 991 cars.
A 918 wont't guarantee you an R - my friend has an 918, I don't and still I got one of three Rs at my OPC and he didn't. It'll be interesting to see what happens if he makes a fuss about this...
A 918 wont't guarantee you an R - my friend has an 918, I don't and still I got one of three Rs at my OPC and he didn't. It'll be interesting to see what happens if he makes a fuss about this...
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