991.2 GT3 RS batch '2' GPF?
Discussion
Sandy59 said:
Thanks, so does that mean you concede it's actually feasible you may end up liking the PDK RS best, ie it's not a foregone conclusion on the manual ??
To be honest I like them both kind of equally, I think I can have just as much fun in either for some reason.
On track I would enjoy a RS PDK.To be honest I like them both kind of equally, I think I can have just as much fun in either for some reason.
On the road I really am a die hard Manual driver and find autos dull. The manual 991.2 GT3 is a special car.
I do own a hardcore auto car btw I just don’t post about my cars that much and it would not suit a manual box.
Juno said:
My good friend who is manual die hard fan drove my PDK GT3 .2 and said “wow I’ve been missing out,this is much more fun” he’s now converted
I’ve also got a several manual cars and drive them as you would heel toeing all the time to manually rev match. I don’t quit see what all the fuss is about as it doesn’t take any more thought or skill to drive,its second nature. I’d love to drop a PDK type system in these older manual cars to see what they would be like,probably even more fun
all IMO of course
Sorry it’s chalk and cheese driving a manual hard vs a PDK.I’ve also got a several manual cars and drive them as you would heel toeing all the time to manually rev match. I don’t quit see what all the fuss is about as it doesn’t take any more thought or skill to drive,its second nature. I’d love to drop a PDK type system in these older manual cars to see what they would be like,probably even more fun
all IMO of course You can take so many liberties in the PDK you cannot do in the Manual, the brain work is much harder as you really do have to plan the braking and downshifts on track and it’s hard work.
Get it a few meters late in a PDK, no bother what so ever.
Nothing to do with heal or toe, but I doubt you can nail threshold braking at 100% in a manual while doing that downshift, it’s pretty hard. I think I am quite a high level of driver (if I say so myself ! ) but I am far faster in a PDK as it’s much much easier and you can left foot brake also.
Again I own an auto high bhp track built weapon of a car as Well as my other cars.
I think PDK makes people gods if they have a bit of skill and I think that’s why people love them today.
hunter 66 said:
Not really , just makes it easier and is a different fun . Took the RS down to Hampshire today to check progress in race car prep for this season .......a few had drive in the car , all saying the highlight of the car is the PDK box .
It is a highlight to have a go in, not to own imo.I think people are shocked how fast, aggressive and good the RS PDK is, it’s bound to wow people who have a go. One has to be impressed with it.
PDK suits the RS though as it is about lapping fast and is the right box for the RS. But the wrong box for the normal GT3 imo.
I would not want a manual 991.2 RS.
It’s all personal choice at the end of the day, I just don’t agree with what PDK owners say about them, when they say it’s just as involving and a manual is no harder to drive !
hunter 66 said:
Agree but as I live in London , there are other benefits ...
I love the cars to bits not nocking it.I daily think about that red GT3 RS at TM for sale.
I just know I would regret the swap , but would enjoy the odd track day in it.
And the looks blow me away on them.
I have just found the GT3 touring market, if you are wealthy you can own the RS and touring together in a fleet :-) but out of all 3 I would keep the one I have.
hunter 66 said:
Not really , just makes it easier and is a different fun . Took the RS down to Hampshire today to check progress in race car prep for this season .......a few had drive in the car , all saying the highlight of the car is the PDK box .
Is it now ready at last!I have some info on fuel cell,premier confirming price etc tomorrow.
Porsche911R said:
Sorry it’s chalk and cheese driving a manual hard vs a PDK.
You can take so many liberties in the PDK you cannot do in the Manual, the brain work is much harder as you really do have to plan the braking and downshifts on track and it’s hard work.
Get it a few meters late in a PDK, no bother what so ever.
Nothing to do with heal or toe, but I doubt you can nail threshold braking at 100% in a manual while doing that downshift, it’s pretty hard. I think I am quite a high level of driver (if I say so myself ! ) but I am far faster in a PDK as it’s much much easier and you can left foot brake also.
Again I own an auto high bhp track built weapon of a car as Well as my other cars.
I think PDK makes people gods if they have a bit of skill and I think that’s why people love them today.
If you are a high level driver and the manual is far slower then I can only conclude that the manual must be sYou can take so many liberties in the PDK you cannot do in the Manual, the brain work is much harder as you really do have to plan the braking and downshifts on track and it’s hard work.
Get it a few meters late in a PDK, no bother what so ever.
Nothing to do with heal or toe, but I doubt you can nail threshold braking at 100% in a manual while doing that downshift, it’s pretty hard. I think I am quite a high level of driver (if I say so myself ! ) but I am far faster in a PDK as it’s much much easier and you can left foot brake also.
Again I own an auto high bhp track built weapon of a car as Well as my other cars.
I think PDK makes people gods if they have a bit of skill and I think that’s why people love them today.
t 
I don't actually think about all that stuff you talk about,I tend to naturally do whatever is required in the vehicle I am in based on where I am. I must admit thought on the odd occasion I have tried to heel and toe the PDK Lol
isaldiri said:
A (non self proclaimed) 'high level' driver would have much less difference between manual and dual clutch... If one is 'far faster' in the dual clutch car, it's more likely an issue of driving ability.
I don't do enough track time and spend time on the limit to drive 100% perfect and no one can drive perfect any way, electric add on's get you closer though ! I said I am a high level driver, so what, I also said I am faster in a PDK car, if I were the same I WOULD be a PRO racer not a high level amateur driver. I am not good at much, but I will stick my neck out and say I can drive ok and have learnt some basic level skills which I don't see on track days from others in all my years having passenger rides.Seems Juno is a far better driver than me..as he ask no such issue the Pro's have.
In the 997 cup 911's the pro racers took autoblip as it's a main area where people make mistakes and loose places on track.
I am not a pro, but the pro's want Auto's also on track to limit mistakes.
no one can threshold brake 100% perfect while changing down the manual gears on every bend , it's impossible.
the issue is, it made the 911 cup racing dull and train like as now no mistakes were being made and under brakes was normally a good over taking point.
Most track day drivers don't even threshold brake full stop !!
the heal and toe bit people get hung up on, it's threshold braking to not allow ABS to cut in while doing the down shift.
That's why I LOL at people who fit BIG MC on their brakes and remove all that modulation, but again those people don't threshold brake and use ABS.
you own manuals and seem to live on track, I thought you would understand UNLESS you just allow ABS to kick in on your cars !!!
As I have said many many times, lap time is all about corner entry nothing else (once you know the lines and hit a good level of driving), if people grasped this and learnt how to beat ABS they would be far faster drivers. The hardest part is always braking for corner entry, PDK takes all that hassle away as you left book brake and don't worry about gears. As I said above PDK makes ave drivers gods. Maybe that does piss me off a little as my skill set I have used over 30 years has been over taken by electronics, and now most people are pretty fast in modern cars if they are keen track day drivers. And why you see on hire car days in Caterhams, the bloody things are spinning off every where, the modern driver just does not have the skill set to drive a Caterham.
I don't mind being s
t at stuff, I bought motobikes, I was crap on them(still had fun though but I would buy a modern bike today with EVERY electric aid if I went back) , I was last to be picked at college for sports teams etc etc I cannot even swim FFS. what I can do is drive ok and I always won karting at birthdays and have just lived and breathed cars from an early age, my dad also was into cars, I drove his at 5+ upward on his knee, I raced at national level with model cars from 10 till 15, I then worked out in the field and did 40k miles a year in cars, while tracking Lotus's, Spending time at one thing if you have a bit of natural talent makes you pretty ok at any hobby you decide to go in. I am not a Pro and cannot match Pro's times, just a very keen driver which seems to upset you for some reason ! I am still not at Juno's level it seems though :-)Edited by Porsche911R on Monday 6th January 09:36
Think Lewis would prefer auto in his Merc rather than a full manual ...... actually they would find it hard work after 70 laps ..
Also helps when in a race situation and suddenly are blocked and need another gear . Auto/ Sequential also helps prevent expensive mistakes ........ after 3 days of heel and toe and nice shifts , at 5 am in the morning on the Banking coming onto the start finish straight , I mis shifted , the first all weekend ......but that was that , race over .
So agree Isaldri as fast over a lap , but there are benefits to modernisation ...
Also helps when in a race situation and suddenly are blocked and need another gear . Auto/ Sequential also helps prevent expensive mistakes ........ after 3 days of heel and toe and nice shifts , at 5 am in the morning on the Banking coming onto the start finish straight , I mis shifted , the first all weekend ......but that was that , race over .
So agree Isaldri as fast over a lap , but there are benefits to modernisation ...
PDK; Porsche were in a 'damned if they do, damned if they don't' situation with the RS. The mindset would have been that pretty much every other car of comparable price and intent would only be auto now, and so the market would expect it.
Not driven a gen 2 RS, but the Gen 1 certainly worked nicely with it.
Not driven a gen 2 RS, but the Gen 1 certainly worked nicely with it.
Porsche911R said:
isaldiri said:
A (non self proclaimed) 'high level' driver would have much less difference between manual and dual clutch... If one is 'far faster' in the dual clutch car, it's more likely an issue of driving ability.
I don't do enough track time and spend time on the limit to drive 100% perfect and no one can drive perfect any way, electric add on's get you closer though ! I said I am a high level driver, so what, I also said I am faster in a PDK car, if I were the same I WOULD be a PRO racer not a high level amateur driver. I am not good at much, but I will stick my neck out and say I can drive ok and have learnt some basic level skills which I don't see on track days from others in all my years having passenger rides.Seems Juno is a far better driver than me..as he ask no such issue the Pro's have.
In the 997 cup 911's the pro racers took autoblip as it's a main area where people make mistakes and loose places on track.
I am not a pro, but the pro's want Auto's also on track to limit mistakes.
no one can threshold brake 100% perfect while changing down the manual gears on every bend , it's impossible.
the issue is, it made the 911 cup racing dull and train like as now no mistakes were being made and under brakes was normally a good over taking point.
Most track day drivers don't even threshold brake full stop !!
the heal and toe bit people get hung up on, it's threshold braking to not allow ABS to cut in while doing the down shift.
That's why I LOL at people who fit BIG MC on their brakes and remove all that modulation, but again those people don't threshold brake and use ABS.
you own manuals and seem to live on track, I thought you would understand UNLESS you just allow ABS to kick in on your cars !!!
As I have said many many times, lap time is all about corner entry nothing else (once you know the lines and hit a good level of driving), if people grasped this and learnt how to beat ABS they would be far faster drivers. The hardest part is always braking for corner entry, PDK takes all that hassle away as you left book brake and don't worry about gears. As I said above PDK makes ave drivers gods. Maybe that does piss me off a little as my skill set I have used over 30 years has been over taken by electronics, and now most people are pretty fast in modern cars if they are keen track day drivers. And why you see on hire car days in Caterhams, the bloody things are spinning off every where, the modern driver just does not have the skill set to drive a Caterham.
I don't mind being s
t at stuff, I bought motobikes, I was crap on them(still had fun though but I would buy a modern bike today with EVERY electric aid if I went back) , I was last to be picked at college for sports teams etc etc I cannot even swim FFS. what I can do is drive ok and I always won karting at birthdays and have just lived and breathed cars from an early age, my dad also was into cars, I drove his at 5+ upward on his knee, I raced at national level with model cars from 10 till 15, I then worked out in the field and did 40k miles a year in cars, while tracking Lotus's, Spending time at one thing if you have a bit of natural talent makes you pretty ok at any hobby you decide to go in. I am not a Pro and cannot match Pro's times, just a very keen driver which seems to upset you for some reason ! I am still not at Juno's level it seems though :-)Edited by Porsche911R on Monday 6th January 09:36
Sir I doff my cap to you and thank you for bestowing me with this accolade
I am probably not worthy and it is more likely my lack of Brain Power that causes me to not think about about what I am doing
PLUS the fact the JUNO has no ABS
Porsche911R said:
just a very keen driver which seems to upset you for some reason
Oh don't think too highly of yourself. Just because I feel compelled to point out some of the gibberish you come up with (nevermind some of the stuff even you admit you made up) is actually hogwash doesn't mean I'm upset....
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