Time to buy my first 911
Discussion
OP,
If it's a 911 you've got your heart set on, then of course go for it - with your eyes wide open as per all the other comments on here re engines in the 996 & 997 models.
However, if it was my first Porsche and I was in your shoes with a budget of £25k or thereabouts, and I wanted a painless and more modern take on first Porsche ownership, i'd be seriously considering a 981 Cayman or Boxster.
£25k will buy you quite a lot of 981 these days...in anyone's book a thoroughly modern and exciting car to drive, with none of the potential pitfalls of some of the older cars. And unlike the latest versions it still has a glorious flat-six!! (For the OP's sake I'm focusing deliberately on the DFI engine models before anyone pipes up and lists the various weaknesses of the 986/987 engines which are broadly the same as those of the 996/997gen1. OP you could also look at later gen2 987 Caymans/Boxsters which had the first DFI engines).
Happy trails!!
"Bargain Hunt" - 981 Boxster (GT Porsche - Issue 189 - August 2017)
"Tried & Tested" Cayman 981 2013 (911 & Porsche World - Issue 281 - August 2017)
If it's a 911 you've got your heart set on, then of course go for it - with your eyes wide open as per all the other comments on here re engines in the 996 & 997 models.
However, if it was my first Porsche and I was in your shoes with a budget of £25k or thereabouts, and I wanted a painless and more modern take on first Porsche ownership, i'd be seriously considering a 981 Cayman or Boxster.
£25k will buy you quite a lot of 981 these days...in anyone's book a thoroughly modern and exciting car to drive, with none of the potential pitfalls of some of the older cars. And unlike the latest versions it still has a glorious flat-six!! (For the OP's sake I'm focusing deliberately on the DFI engine models before anyone pipes up and lists the various weaknesses of the 986/987 engines which are broadly the same as those of the 996/997gen1. OP you could also look at later gen2 987 Caymans/Boxsters which had the first DFI engines).
Happy trails!!
"Bargain Hunt" - 981 Boxster (GT Porsche - Issue 189 - August 2017)
"Tried & Tested" Cayman 981 2013 (911 & Porsche World - Issue 281 - August 2017)
I read that article too, on a plane so I read every word in the magazine cover-to-cover, and whilst an old hand at porsches might be able to say "I used to have a 911 but now this is a great choice" the man clearly wants his dream 911. I can understand that feeling and whilst I wouldn't belittle a 981...
It is not a 911.
It is not a 911.
Yes, good luck OP. I was completely uneducated in 911's before my 996 purchase and PH was extremely helpful. The guys commenting on this thread know their stuff and I learnt a lot, however I didn't follow the 'preferred choice' rule of a manual C2 and went for the much more frowned upon cab tip C4S. That was my choice because I liked the looks, wanted a cab, and I'm not a fast driver who would benefit from manual. Three and a half years on, I'm more than happy with my choice.
Anyway, look forward to hearing about any purchase you make. Happy shopping!
Anyway, look forward to hearing about any purchase you make. Happy shopping!
I would personally go for a 996 C4S as they are the only Porsche in that price range that will start to appreciate.
First thing I would do would be to book it in for a uprated IMS bearing, RMS and a new clutch as that way you will have peace of mind that it won't go bang and the new clutch will make it nicer to drive as 4wd clutches get a bit heavy and on these you will pretty much get back what you put into it rather than throwing dead money at a car.
Get a 2004 chassis as 2 year servicing and as a 996 no pasm worries.
Lots are silver but on an older car it wears a lot better than dark colours and cobalt only looks good when it is perfect and doesn't wear that well.
I would rather be fussy about the interior colour and would only have black or (metropole) blue as the grey is very bland and the other browns,reds etc are a bit garish.
I would buy this as it is a 2004 manual coupe with blue interior and sports seats and has had the Nav updated already and with a few ££ on upgrades would be a lovely thing
http://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/2017...
First thing I would do would be to book it in for a uprated IMS bearing, RMS and a new clutch as that way you will have peace of mind that it won't go bang and the new clutch will make it nicer to drive as 4wd clutches get a bit heavy and on these you will pretty much get back what you put into it rather than throwing dead money at a car.
Get a 2004 chassis as 2 year servicing and as a 996 no pasm worries.
Lots are silver but on an older car it wears a lot better than dark colours and cobalt only looks good when it is perfect and doesn't wear that well.
I would rather be fussy about the interior colour and would only have black or (metropole) blue as the grey is very bland and the other browns,reds etc are a bit garish.
I would buy this as it is a 2004 manual coupe with blue interior and sports seats and has had the Nav updated already and with a few ££ on upgrades would be a lovely thing
http://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/2017...
Dr Ing said:
I have now hit the big 40, worked hard to establish my career (as a teacher - yes I often wonder why) and can actually now afford (while though not certainly not rich) to perhaps this time just go for it and buy the car I've always talked about and longed after - the Porsche 911 Carrera.
[/footnote]
A few notes from a fellow part-time educator/lecturer;[/footnote]
A few of us (boys) in the university have flat6/porsche love so one of my colleagues was pretty lucky to get a 993 (the last air-cooled), another one has a lovely 964(inheritance) and me got a 986 boxster (recently sold it actually, owned for 6 years). I was in your situation when I got the boxster (although I was just hitting 30
). I have done a massive looked at 911 options for several years, but decided it's not for me. It is also the fact that my dad had a 997.1 and had engine issue, luckily he got rid of it pretty quickly as being a company lease car.I know many owners would kill me for saying this now but If I was in your shoes, I would only look at DFI engines (which is either cayman, boxster or new 997.2). I would not go close to 996, 997.1 or even many 987.1's with larger engines. You could give it a go with 986 as they are absolutely cheap nowadays, even with the worst case scenario it can't hurt you financially but 996 and 997.1 can be nightmare unless you have OPC warranty. They are fantastic to drive but nightmare to own. (imho)
I wonder what would be the economics behind "a late global recall" to all 997.1 and 996 for Porsche? If they want to continue the legacy, I think they better get properly fix these models forever. The only reason those modern models sold very well, people had the perception of bullet-proof reliable classic porsche (mezger), as many of them were still on the roads.
Nowadays, most of the air-cooled going to rare museum or collector pieces and the only ones on the road with the current prices are large number of mass produced m96/97 engines where almost everyone know their expensive issues. I can't see engine rebuilds getting quite cheap soon, surely many owners would start to get id of them if they can't afford? and if people won't see more porsches on the roads would they still be paying premium prices to new ones? Maybe extreme comparison but TVR's bad reputation with its engines, completely ruined the brand even though they had the coolest cars at the time.
If they want to continue the legacy, I think they better get properly fix these models forever. The only reason those modern models sold very well, people had the perception of bullet-proof reliable classic porsche (mezger), as many of them were still on the roads. Nowadays, most of the air-cooled going to rare museum or collector pieces and the only ones on the road with the current prices are large number of mass produced m96/97 engines where almost everyone know their expensive issues. I can't see engine rebuilds getting quite cheap soon, surely many owners would start to get id of them if they can't afford? and if people won't see more porsches on the roads would they still be paying premium prices to new ones? Maybe extreme comparison but TVR's bad reputation with its engines, completely ruined the brand even though they had the coolest cars at the time.
ooid said:
A few notes from a fellow part-time educator/lecturer;
A few of us (boys) in the university have flat6/porsche love so one of my colleagues was pretty lucky to get a 993 (the last air-cooled), another one has a lovely 964(inheritance) and me got a 986 boxster (recently sold it actually, owned for 6 years). I was in your situation when I got the boxster (although I was just hitting 30). I have done a massive looked at 911 options for several years, but decided it's not for me. It is also the fact that my dad had a 997.1 and had engine issue, luckily he got rid of it pretty quickly as being a company lease car.
I know many owners would kill me for saying this now but If I was in your shoes, I would only look at DFI engines (which is either cayman, boxster or new 997.2). I would not go close to 996, 997.1 or even many 987.1's with larger engines. You could give it a go with 986 as they are absolutely cheap nowadays, even with the worst case scenario it can't hurt you financially but 996 and 997.1 can be nightmare unless you have OPC warranty. They are fantastic to drive but nightmare to own. (imho)
'I know nothing about 996 or 997s but my Dad had one and it went wrong, so they're all rubbish' A few of us (boys) in the university have flat6/porsche love so one of my colleagues was pretty lucky to get a 993 (the last air-cooled), another one has a lovely 964(inheritance) and me got a 986 boxster (recently sold it actually, owned for 6 years). I was in your situation when I got the boxster (although I was just hitting 30
). I have done a massive looked at 911 options for several years, but decided it's not for me. It is also the fact that my dad had a 997.1 and had engine issue, luckily he got rid of it pretty quickly as being a company lease car.I know many owners would kill me for saying this now but If I was in your shoes, I would only look at DFI engines (which is either cayman, boxster or new 997.2). I would not go close to 996, 997.1 or even many 987.1's with larger engines. You could give it a go with 986 as they are absolutely cheap nowadays, even with the worst case scenario it can't hurt you financially but 996 and 997.1 can be nightmare unless you have OPC warranty. They are fantastic to drive but nightmare to own. (imho)
STiG911 said:
'I know nothing about 996 or 997s but my Dad had one and it went wrong, so they're all rubbish'
I knew one of you guys would come after me with a gun, eventually OP should shop around a bit and read a few genuine owners recent experiences at 911 forum;
http://www.911uk.com/viewtopic.php?t=120609
ooid said:
I knew one of you guys would come after me with a gun, eventually
OP should shop around a bit and read a few genuine owners recent experiences at 911 forum;
http://www.911uk.com/viewtopic.php?t=120609
Ahhhh - a negative internet post (more of a critique on the dealer than the car) vs 0000's of 997s running fine. Maybe you should do more research yourself so you know what you're actually talking about - if all you're doing is looking for negatives, that's all you're gonna find. OP should shop around a bit and read a few genuine owners recent experiences at 911 forum;
http://www.911uk.com/viewtopic.php?t=120609
I recently bought a 1998 996 C2. It seems mostly everything has been covered about the cars, choices and potential horror stories. So I'd like to chime in with a couple of things which have not been covered:
1. Do you need to sell your BMW.
You could keep it and drive the Porsche less often. You can use your Porsche for occasional drives only. This has the benefit of making the Porsche feel special even when it is the same car. My first 911 was a 6 month old 997 C2S which I drove for 20000 miles in 9 months without driving anything else. It was lovely but I started thinking about different cars after about 6 months. Variety is the spice of life. Drive the same car constantly and you forget how great it is. You need to drive something else to reset your barometer.
2. Insurance.
I got quotes of 1200+ for my 911 and this was enough to put me off buying it as I already had a 981. Then I discovered classic insurance and now pay something ridiculous like 375. There are restrictions on a classic policy like this can't be your only car and it needs to be old etc. So following on from the 2 car discussion you can see why keeping the BMW can be advantageous. I'm going to throw in road tax here too - boring I know - most 997 are after the cross over into 500 per year tax. I didn't even realise that pre 2000 cars are capped at 230 per year until I bought one. So tax and insurance for my 911 is 600 all in.
1. Do you need to sell your BMW.
You could keep it and drive the Porsche less often. You can use your Porsche for occasional drives only. This has the benefit of making the Porsche feel special even when it is the same car. My first 911 was a 6 month old 997 C2S which I drove for 20000 miles in 9 months without driving anything else. It was lovely but I started thinking about different cars after about 6 months. Variety is the spice of life. Drive the same car constantly and you forget how great it is. You need to drive something else to reset your barometer.
2. Insurance.
I got quotes of 1200+ for my 911 and this was enough to put me off buying it as I already had a 981. Then I discovered classic insurance and now pay something ridiculous like 375. There are restrictions on a classic policy like this can't be your only car and it needs to be old etc. So following on from the 2 car discussion you can see why keeping the BMW can be advantageous. I'm going to throw in road tax here too - boring I know - most 997 are after the cross over into 500 per year tax. I didn't even realise that pre 2000 cars are capped at 230 per year until I bought one. So tax and insurance for my 911 is 600 all in.
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