gt3 ...138 cars for sale !!!!

[993rsr]

Porsche911R said:

993rsr said:

See the word WHENEVER:

This means that, whenever the car enters a corner, brake pressure is applied to the inside rear wheel. Consequently, a greater amount of drive force is distributed to the outside rear wheel, almost pulling the car into the corner. Turn-in capability is improved, agility is increased.

I tend to find drivers go in too hot and hence PTV gets you round (as you stated above) , as you say pulling you into the corner, rather then you waving some where in the distance at the apex after going in guns slinging if you were in a car without PTV .;-)

Hence not a fan of PDK and e-diff cars for fun and improving your skill levels, just makes the ave driver look a better driver. A tell is normally the bent front tyre tread as they go unsteering every where and they start to bend backwards due to heat, or worn rear disks.
As the car has more understeer, PTV works harder it's a circle of doom and again so common to see.

of course the manual still has PTV but a normal diff, over the PDK, PTV Plus and e-diff doing EVERY thing for you if you go in too hot.

if you understand corner entry, load transfer/weight transfer slip angles and your threshold braking is upto standard then PTV plays a lesser part and you won't see the rear wear as much. One can shout "flat car" to yourself if you like F1 training style. Or you can just hoon in and lean on the electronics.

to quote Porsche
"When the car is driven assertively into a corner, moderate brake pressure is applied to the inside rear wheel. Consequently, a greater amount of drive force is distributed to the outside rear wheel, inducing an additional rotational pulse, they work by intelligently braking the rear wheels as the situation demands."

PTV plus goes one step more as it works with the E-diff and PSM to quote
"PTV Plus is equipped with electronic control offering fully variable torque distribution. In interaction with Porsche Stability Management (PSM), the system improves driving stability"

key word there is stability, again if you understand corner entry you will have a stable car platform to start with and less interaction needed by the electrics and thus less rear disk wear.

I also read the word "assertively" as "in a clueless manner" and "situation demands" = "you f**ked up" in Porsche 1st quote and hence why any noddy can get a fast lap these days and feel good about it, well not a fast lap, but a lap faster than they would other wise.

I guess Porsche had to be more tactful and use "assertively" over "clueless manner"

Enjoy Tuesday, I am at work sadly.

Edited by Porsche911R on Friday 5th October 13:21

My offer still stands, come and impart some of your skill and knowledge to teach an old dog some new tricks and I'll report back as much.

Don't just slip back behind the keyboard, if you've got something of merit to offer demonstrate it.

[993rsr]

Porsche911R said:

Petrus1983 said:

WCZ said:

993rsr said:

I presume you've got an AARDS Instructors licence?

Edited by 993rsr on Friday 5th October 10:46

plenty of good drivers around who don't

And some bad ones who do

I found this, I have had a few poor instructors, hence I tended to stick to current racing drivers to improve but not had any training for a while.

I find the ave track day instructor lacking for advanced work, but of course there are many great ones, but imo still better to hire a current pro racer if you hit a level and want to take it a step more, I just found the next step is harder on the car, you need more track bias geo and for what end !! winning at track day ! so I stopped doing them, it just eats money better spend on Euro trips or weekends way with the other half.


on a plus note the mods have been removing abuse posts which lets hope will make for a better forum going forward.
team work will over come the abuse ;-)

Edited by Porsche911R on Friday 5th October 14:00

If you actually looked at the comments to YOUR posts you'd see where the problem lies.

'I find the ave track day instructor lacking for advanced work.... if you hit a level and want to take it a step more' please turn of the record.

So very conveniently you're simply too good for track days now, you couldn't make it up.

[Taffy66]

nw942 said:

So somewhere like Anglesey, the 991.1 posted a time of 1:38.10 (Chris Harris) and the 991.2 a time of 1:34.96 (Jethro Bovingdon). So that's ~ 3 seconds difference.

I know there are too many variables to prevent it being a true comparison, but where is the 991.2 finding the time?

Is it mainly the engine, drivetrain, tyres, brakes, chassis/suspension? Or just small gains everywhere including aero?

If Bovingdon tested them back-to-back on the same tyres, would the gap still be ~3 seconds?

Don't get me wrong, the gen 2 engine is stronger than the gen 1's especially in the mid range, but not to the extent some people claim IME. One caveat however is i've only driven the PDK gen 2 and not the manual..Its possible if i owned a manual rather than the PDK then the difference might be greater , but i don't think so.
The 3 secs gain at Anglesey is probably a cumulative of several variables such as drivers, weather , tyres ,aero etc.
I seem to recall some independent tests timed the gen 1 GT3 as fast as the gen 1 RS in a straight line, if not faster..There are too many variables to make fair comparison unless the same driver drives both cars on the same track on the same day..

[Porsche911R]

Taffy66 said:

Don't get me wrong, the gen 2 engine is stronger than the gen 1's especially in the mid range, but not to the extent some people claim IME. One caveat however is i've only driven the PDK gen 2 and not the manual..Its possible if i owned a manual rather than the PDK then the difference might be greater , but i don't think so.
The 3 secs gain at Anglesey is probably a cumulative of several variables such as drivers, weather , tyres ,aero etc.
I seem to recall some independent tests timed the gen 1 GT3 as fast as the gen 1 RS in a straight line, if not faster..There are too many variables to make fair comparison unless the same driver drives both cars on the same track on the same day..

same driver Christain Gebhardt at sport auto put the gen 2 at Hockenheim at 1:07.90 while the 991.1 did 1:09.20,

and the 991.1 RS splits them at 1:08.50

the games move on with the .2 RS at 1:05.40... and for interest the 911R at 1:09.10

[Taffy66]

Porsche911R said:

same driver Christain Gebhardt at sport auto put the gen 2 at Hockenheim at 1:07.90 while the 991.1 did 1:09.20,

and the 991.1 RS splits them at 1:08.50

the games move on with the .2 RS at 1:05.40...

I agree that Porsche always manage to pull something out of the hat with each successive gen..The .2 RS's time of 1:05.40 is incredible..Do you know if it had the new R spec tyres or standard MPSCs..

[Digga]

JulierPass said:

Digga said:

hat looks like a lot of fun! I'm sure it's no coincidence that there are so many track cars. Lovely.

(I know this is the Porsche forum, and there's one "B" word we're not allowed to mention any more, but BMW 3 series track cars is okay, surely?)

Thanks Digga. To be fair I was shaking this down as I'll be racing it next year. I'm usually in a GT3 or RS of some variant. A dedicated car is good fun, but as good the BMW is I'd rather be in a 996 RS any day

There's a great video of an E46 M3 just been linked to in the Nurburging topic; https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...

[Digga]

Taffy66 said:

Porsche911R said:

same driver Christain Gebhardt at sport auto put the gen 2 at Hockenheim at 1:07.90 while the 991.1 did 1:09.20,

and the 991.1 RS splits them at 1:08.50

the games move on with the .2 RS at 1:05.40...

I agree that Porsche always manage to pull something out of the hat with each successive gen..The .2 RS's time of 1:05.40 is incredible..Do you know if it had the new R spec tyres or standard MPSCs..

Good question. When I was hovering around Kevin Estre's car on the day he was giving taxi laps of the 'Ring, I heard him say he reckoned the new tyres made a huge difference. I'd happily defer to his knowledge.

[Porsche911R]

Taffy66 said:

I agree that Porsche always manage to pull something out of the hat with each successive gen..The .2 RS's time of 1:05.40 is incredible..Do you know if it had the new R spec tyres or standard MPSCs..

you know how important times are to these people I would say it was on R spec, have you seen the price of a set, crazy !!!

great for people who want to win at track days :-) and not available atm in 20" all round for the non RS.

I expect punters cars to be seen with them on at Silverstone, it's the next must have I would say.

Edited by Porsche911R on Friday 5th October 15:01

[Porsche911R]

anonymous said:

[redacted]

fun and pub talk. like all threads you are either interested or not, I quite like to see the drag racing it also shuts up a lot of people saying PCCB makes no odds RAM air makes no odds, light weight wheels makes no odds , then In a drag race any said car with PCCB wins.

in fact out of all the vids the car with PCCB won be it either car, luck or not that's all we have to go on over forum people saying RAM air and PCCB is worth st all.

if you add up on paper crap the manual .2 GT3 has an on paper 64BHP advantage over the 991.1 steel car and pulls a big gap for a drag race .

I don't agree with this made up 64BHP but a drag race is a drag race :-) and I like them, any one who likes cars likes watching drag races
you telling me you don't watch motortrends drag race of the year every year ?

a winner is a winner the 64BHP can be debated for ever with no real outcome of truth.

[TDT]

anonymous said:

[redacted]

Like he said - you're either interested or not...

[isaldiri]

TDT said:

Was an interesting day for me... was my first non-Porsche-only day and my second time @ Silverstone. Was great day - very busy, loads of interesting metal - but very well organised.

@isaldiri... without being too harsh!...what were your thoughts about my car, driving, line, when you were following?

In terms of times - I was running in the low 2.36s, theoretical best of low 2.35s - losing time in Abbey and Copse...at present i just don't have confidence with blind apexes...

Tbh tdt I'm nowhere near a good enough driver to comment sensibly on your driving (especially as I was rather bloody slow on tuesday!). Certainly I can't claim that I'm too good for the average trackday instructor for example....

but if you don't mind me saying i think you could be a bit more committed under braking (I could brake a fair bit later than you even without triggering abs) and try to carry a bit more speed through the 2nd part of the maggotts/becketts complex. Copse is a tough corner though I agree, need to be committed and turn in faster than you think you can I find.

Julierpass - sorry I missed you! Must get a bit more organised next time, hopefully the other mezger driving loon lasource will be there and he'll be able to let both of us know the other is around anyway!

[Porsche911R]

anonymous said:

[redacted]

bet not to post then :-)

[Dammit]

It's just like triathletes bragging about their new wheels saving 2 seconds over 40Km, pointless if you are not racing (and, indeed, if you are good enough to need them you'd never have to buy them yourself), but good for bragging.

[isaldiri]

Taffy66 said:

I agree that Porsche always manage to pull something out of the hat with each successive gen..The .2 RS's time of 1:05.40 is incredible..Do you know if it had the new R spec tyres or standard MPSCs..

The Sportauto times were run on Cup Rs, both 2rs and 3rs.

[browngt3]

anonymous said:

[redacted]

Maybe you're just taking it all a little too seriously?

[TDT]

isaldiri said:

TDT said:

Was an interesting day for me... was my first non-Porsche-only day and my second time @ Silverstone. Was great day - very busy, loads of interesting metal - but very well organised.

@isaldiri... without being too harsh!...what were your thoughts about my car, driving, line, when you were following?

In terms of times - I was running in the low 2.36s, theoretical best of low 2.35s - losing time in Abbey and Copse...at present i just don't have confidence with blind apexes...

Tbh tdt I'm nowhere near a good enough driver to comment sensibly on your driving (especially as I was rather bloody slow on tuesday!). Certainly I can't claim that I'm too good for the average trackday instructor for example....

but if you don't mind me saying i think you could be a bit more committed under braking (I could brake a fair bit later than you even without triggering abs) and try to carry a bit more speed through the 2nd part of the maggotts/becketts complex. Copse is a tough corner though I agree, need to be committed and turn in faster than you think you can I find.

Thanks for the pointers - sounds like i just need to trust myself and the car a lot more. I've actually booked for Tuesday 9th, so will have another crack at it - and hopefully see some of you others there too... Hunter66 and 993RSR.

Will be intensely studying LaSource's 2.26 in a stock GT4 from a little while ago.

Edited by TDT on Saturday 6th October 15:13

[hunter 66]

Yes TDT have booked and weather looks great .... although at this time of year Fog start is to be expected so I will make an easy start and come late morning ( could not cancel a patient as well ) ... looks like Yellow coming as well hopefully with the 675LT .
993rsr may bring something exciting as well ... and he is always worth an passenger ride with.
Both SK and another friend with a GT4 had a ride with me last time and were interested in keeping speed through corners , both took a few secs off..think they got down to 2.31 -2.32 .
The firm spring rate on the .2RS tend to benefit a stickier tyre and the Dunlops are not up to it , strange they got super hot ( at 30 psi ) but not sticky like the Cup2 and Trofeo.
But as rightly said not a race ( slicks cost about 1,400 a set , and last two hours !! ) so not bothered with changing tyres until these are done

Edited by hunter 66 on Saturday 6th October 15:37

[993rsr]

hunter 66 said:

Yes TDT have booked and weather looks great .... although at this time of year Fog start is to be expected so I will make an easy start and come late morning ( could not cancel a patient as well ) ... looks like Yellow coming as well hopefully with the 675LT .
993rsr may bring something exciting as well ... and he is always worth an passenger ride with.
Both SK and another friend with a GT4 had a ride with me last time and were interested in keeping speed through corners , both took a few secs off..

See you boys there, looking forward to it, not been on track in the 980 for a while, have you got a garage Revo?

[hunter 66]

Whoa , bringing the bad boy out to play . No garage maybe TDT has one .... or just find one . As I said arriving a bit later as prefer the end of the day when it gets a bit quieter .
Hopefully yellow does bring the Macca .
All the talk about PCCB and drag racing the 720 and 675 are in another league and would be great for you to have a ride in his .

[Juno]

isaldiri said:

TDT said:

Was an interesting day for me... was my first non-Porsche-only day and my second time @ Silverstone. Was great day - very busy, loads of interesting metal - but very well organised.

@isaldiri... without being too harsh!...what were your thoughts about my car, driving, line, when you were following?

In terms of times - I was running in the low 2.36s, theoretical best of low 2.35s - losing time in Abbey and Copse...at present i just don't have confidence with blind apexes...

Tbh tdt I'm nowhere near a good enough driver to comment sensibly on your driving (especially as I was rather bloody slow on tuesday!). Certainly I can't claim that I'm too good for the average trackday instructor for example....

but if you don't mind me saying i think you could be a bit more committed under braking (I could brake a fair bit later than you even without triggering abs) and try to carry a bit more speed through the 2nd part of the maggotts/becketts complex. Copse is a tough corner though I agree, need to be committed and turn in faster than you think you can I find.

My 16 stone passenger didn’t help but think this is still reasonable with Ballast,yes they are quicker corners than you first think ! https://youtu.be/tJKwm5JedWI

Julierpass - sorry I missed you! Must get a bit more organised next time, hopefully the other mezger driving loon lasource will be there and he'll be able to let both of us know the other is around anyway!