911 help - need to go incognito!

[LukeyLikey]

I have a couple of other exotic cars (F and M) and tend to contribute to those sections on PH. So, hopefully you don't mind a gatecrasher! I used to own a 996 C4S and a 997 C2, both coupes. From time to time I would like to be able to take a sporty car to places the exotics don't really fit and have been thinking about renewing my acquaintance with 911 ownership. However, I am in need of a little advice.

My criteria are:

-Should not depreciate more than about £3k pa, appreciation is even better
-I prefer a coupe but my wife prefers a cab, so a cab it is (no doubt many of you guys know how this stuff works and since it is a 3rd toy car I'm finding it hard to argue...)
-GT3 is out, the standard 911 rear seats do have an occasional use for me and are something the other cars don't have (yes, I know they are small but my kids squash well!)
-I am a cash buyer and price is not completely relevant (except see point 1) so budget is between £20k and £40k. Maybe up to £50k if point 1 still applies
-Would love a Turbo and actually like the 996 version, but since I have a 12C Spider, don't need the performance and do value the NA way of life
-Prefer 4S to 2S since a cab already disrupts the 'purity' so may as well go the whole way (again subject to point 1 above), and prefer S to non S.

The car will be used year round, about 3-5k miles and I prefer the widebody look, although point 1 is the most important (except that I have enough hassle in life and constant garage visits are to be avoided and break down is very definitely to be avoided.)


So, the cars I am thinking about are; 993, 996 Turbo, 997, 997 Turbo. Any advice on what may fit my criteria best? Those who have owned multiple of my target cars I would really appreciate hearing from. Also, any suppliers to avoid? I know 993 is the best bet for depreciation free motoring but I'm far from convinced that it is a good convertible car given my other requirements.

Thanks in advance for any help.

[LukeyLikey]

Paul O said:

Shurv said:

997.2 cab. None of the bore scoring risks and well within budget. You don't need a turbo, you have the 12C.

Agree, should come in budget and the best of the worlds you require. Depreciation might be steeper than you'd like though due to volume in the marketplace.

So....I had thought I would enjoy the search, spin it out a bit and look at various different cars etc. but seems I can't help being quick with the trigger.

Before I tell you what I bought, I'll go through my thought process. Started at 993 which ticks many boxes, except the fact that a 20 year old car will undoubtedly have more issues to attend to, even being a Porsche. It was the romantic and possibly most profitable choice but you have to look hard, and pay hard, to find the best examples, especially in C4S guise. A close call, and one I may regret in the future because I have a feeling that this car is about 10 or so years away from doing what the early 70's 'S' has done.

I considered 996 Turbo, the look of which I love (possibly even more than the 997 version). It is similar to the 996 C4S which I preferred to the 997 that I had and would make for a sensible progression on from that car. However, as stated above, I should drive the 12C whenever I want a shove in the back. Although I quite fancied a Turbo, and began to look at both 996 and 997 with plenty of examples around, I ultimately concluded a NA car is where it is at. If it was an only toy, I might have thought different.

So, felt that a 997.1 was the logical car. I didn't mind whether it was S or non S, and knew I didn't want a tip. There are a number of cars around that seem good. A friend has just bought a 997.2 C4S, which looks great. "C4S I thought". I used to like those, what about a 997 C4S? The budget for lower mileage 997.1 C4Ss needs to be around mid to high £30's and some into £40k.

Then I realised that some spec items were important to me - sports exhaust (sorry, can't help it), adaptive seats (had the feeling my wife would actually drive this car due to its size, in fact sitting here in my office she has just txt me to say how much she is enjoying HER car today...) adaptive seats ease the pain of finding exactly the right position after someone else has used it. Also, preferred the hard seat backs and the wide body look.

Then, the engine issues on a 997.1 - well, unlikely to affect me because overall the cars are reliable but if I was unlucky it would certainly take the shine off and with other cars in the garage, an easy life has a value. So, began looking at 997.2.

What I like about basic 997s is the old school look, the fact that it still feels somewhat closely related to the early seventies cars, they are not air cooled but they are hydraulically steered and the 911 character is still very much in evidence. I suspect one day they may hold a similar appeal to the 993 today and if that proves correct values will be ok. You would have to hold one longer than I plan to to have a really good experience but in 5-10 years I reckon carefully chosen ones would have been respectably cheap to own.

997.2 opened up another possibility. PDK. Would be very popular with my (long suffering when it comes to cars) wife and would mean I could take the 911 even on journeys with traffic etc. By this time the budget is heading high enough to need some pretty flawless 'man maths'. As I looked around an idea struck me. GTS. Not so many of those around, if I'm already around £50k why not opt for a car that could just be a 'sleeper' in the range? In 15 years time, if the 997 is viewed like the 993, this could well be the one to have. What does that mean though if I want to sell in 5 years? Or 2 years?

So, began looking at GTSs and, of course, too expensive. A price in the mid 60s for a PDK GTS Cab is just too much risk. Mid 50s max max max.

So here was the choice: 997.1 C4S manual, 997.2 C4S PDK or....997 GTS manual in dark blue. The adaptive seats, hard seat backs, dynamic lights and extra spec of the GTS, plus the low mileage of below 10k and the fact it was supplied from an OPC with two years warranty for a mid fifties price got my signature.

Delivered yesterday. Car seems perfect. After the 12C my reference points have all been moved because that car is just unbelievable. The 911 feels quick and torquey but on a whole level lower, in fact two levels lower than the 12C. The engine note at high revs is wonderful and provides a great alternative to the flat plane V8s I love so much. However, after the 12C the body control is far away from what I have become used to with the ride just on the harsh side for British 'B' roads but with the car being easy to unsettle into turns. With practice I'll come to anticipate it and it does make for some fun and entertainment. The front end bobbing seems more than I remember and that is, again, probably because of the cars I've owned since last driving a 911, especially the 12C.

I don't think you can find a more characterful, practical, usable and entertaining all round package than a 911 though.

Thanks for everyone's comments, this and other threads have been helpful. Cheers!

Edited by LukeyLikey on Thursday 3rd April 15:02

Edited by LukeyLikey on Thursday 3rd April 15:04

[LukeyLikey]

Orangecurry said:

LukeyLikey said:

My criteria are:

-Should not depreciate more than about £3k pa, appreciation is even better

Yes, I know, good point. In my defence, if I keep it 25 years, appreciation no question! Also, it's all relative - a 4 year old GTS is a veritable investment in comparison to a 12C...

[LukeyLikey]

Paul O said:

, loving your man maths taking centre stage at so many turns hehe!

Great choice, enjoy the car - sounds like you've got a fab stable indeed. Any piccies?

When I get a moment I'll try and take a few proper pics.

Yes, the man maths - all car nuts need to be good at that!

Here's my man maths logic; I always buy a car with a view to keeping it a long time. Usually fail at that. However, I sold the C4S I had to buy an Aston and only got £24k for it - great car, brilliant spec, low mileage, in 2008. It's worth that now and I regretted selling it - certainly would have been a cheap car to own over the last five years. So, if I keep the GTS around four years I am likely to feel,"what the heck, keep it". If I keep it, then better having a GTS over a C2S or C4S.

Alternatively, if I kept the GTS for four years, it would be as old as an 06 C2S I saw, with 25k miles, really nice spec, at around £32k. In four years, a GTS would retail at £32k plus inflation, plus a bit extra for the extra specialness of a GTS. Meaning I would drop about £15k plus dealer margin over four years. About £5k per year.

My original budget was £3k per year, but for two of those years I have a full OPC warranty, which could easily represent the extra £2k. So, on average £1k per year, or about £85 per month to drive a four year newer GTS compared with a gen 1 C2S.

Man maths see?