GT4RS - Availability, what’s the latest?
Discussion
ChrisW. said:
Well, actually, I am a little deaf and I was wearing a helmet ...
Maybe that will go in your favour then if you want one ..... Or it will totally finish you off !!@Finmac - I didn't see HM do that test but having hooned one round the Alps for a few hours, I was more than happy to give it back !!
Far Cough said:
ChrisW. said:
Well, actually, I am a little deaf and I was wearing a helmet ...
Maybe that will go in your favour then if you want one ..... Or it will totally finish you off !!@Finmac - I didn't see HM do that test but having hooned one round the Alps for a few hours, I was more than happy to give it back !!
Such a shame, I’d love one but have tinnitus already - no desire to make it any worse, so it would be noise cancelling headphones if I get an allocation. Edited by finmac on Thursday 8th February 23:13
This seems to be a common reply ... to try it first.
I'm reading the current ECOTY 2023 and you really can sense the disappointment in the number of times and the way that the reviewers refer to last years ECOTY with the GT4RS ....
Meaden ... (the GT3RS) retained its poise on the same raggedy roads that had last year's GT4RS skimming like a demented stone ...
Tomalin ... how much more convincing the 3RS was than last years GT4RS ...
Gallagher ... Of the GT3RS ... I was genuinely nervous that we had set it up to fail by including it in ECOTY on the same roads and routes that had undone the Cayman GT4RS last year ...
The GT3RS winner summary ...Considering the way last years Cayman GT4RS struggled on many of these very roads, and the fact that Porsche itself bills its big brother as a track car you may take occasionally on the road, you'd be forgiven for thinking the GT3RS's victory comes as something of a surprise. But not if you've been lucky enough to drive it ...
Of the Carrera T, comparing this to the GT3RS in race mode to reduce the damping, ... the T seems to find bumps in the road that the others don't, whereas the GT3RS is controllable ...
Of the GT4RS summary ... Thrilling when the road suits it - Too many great roads don't ...
I appears that the damping issue can be resolved at a cost, ... whereas the noise issue may require ear defenders ...
Maybe the GT4RS is now a tough sell with currently available specifications and prices. I wonder if Porsche would fit the coilover upgrade as part of the build specification ... and at what cost ? Or if they were to build a special RS with this plus other select mods, what would they call it ?
I'm reading the current ECOTY 2023 and you really can sense the disappointment in the number of times and the way that the reviewers refer to last years ECOTY with the GT4RS ....
Meaden ... (the GT3RS) retained its poise on the same raggedy roads that had last year's GT4RS skimming like a demented stone ...
Tomalin ... how much more convincing the 3RS was than last years GT4RS ...
Gallagher ... Of the GT3RS ... I was genuinely nervous that we had set it up to fail by including it in ECOTY on the same roads and routes that had undone the Cayman GT4RS last year ...
The GT3RS winner summary ...Considering the way last years Cayman GT4RS struggled on many of these very roads, and the fact that Porsche itself bills its big brother as a track car you may take occasionally on the road, you'd be forgiven for thinking the GT3RS's victory comes as something of a surprise. But not if you've been lucky enough to drive it ...
Of the Carrera T, comparing this to the GT3RS in race mode to reduce the damping, ... the T seems to find bumps in the road that the others don't, whereas the GT3RS is controllable ...
Of the GT4RS summary ... Thrilling when the road suits it - Too many great roads don't ...
I appears that the damping issue can be resolved at a cost, ... whereas the noise issue may require ear defenders ...
Maybe the GT4RS is now a tough sell with currently available specifications and prices. I wonder if Porsche would fit the coilover upgrade as part of the build specification ... and at what cost ? Or if they were to build a special RS with this plus other select mods, what would they call it ?
Edited by ChrisW. on Monday 11th December 17:32
gtsralph said:
Expect this is why Manthey suspension will sell well. Maybe a DSC controller would fix it for a more reasonable cost?
DSC controller is a mixed bag on this platform with the OEM dampers IMO, and based on my own experience in the 981 whilst you might soften it for the road, you lose some feeling and confidence when really starting to push the boundaries, and you encounter compound corners and surfaces. I know one or two in the UK have tried it in their 4RS and reverted.Its also a popular mod with the US track guys, they are also trying it but then quickly reverting or graduating to MCS dampers…
Edited by TDT on Monday 11th December 18:24
ChrisW. said:
This seems to be a common reply ... to try it first.
I appears that the damping issue can be resolved at a cost, ... whereas the noise issue may require ear defenders ...
Maybe the GT4RS is now a tough sell with currently available specifications and prices. I wonder if Porsche would fit the coilover upgrade as part of the build specification ... and at what cost ? Or if they were to build a special RS with this plus other select mods, what would they call it ?
For me this is what makes it difficult… the 992 GT3 at similar pricing or less (+ you have the add the kit to make the 4RS equal) doesn’t have any compromises or limitations. My heart is with the 4RS because it is that familiar compact and practical platform with all the power now, but the 992 GT3 at the same price is simply a league ahead… albeit larger and some people say too easy/clinical.I appears that the damping issue can be resolved at a cost, ... whereas the noise issue may require ear defenders ...
Maybe the GT4RS is now a tough sell with currently available specifications and prices. I wonder if Porsche would fit the coilover upgrade as part of the build specification ... and at what cost ? Or if they were to build a special RS with this plus other select mods, what would they call it ?
Guess the answer is you need both, lol.
The 4RS is unique, as there will not be another, whereas the GT3 has many generations, with the next one around the corner. That’s the basic proposition…
Edited by TDT on Monday 11th December 18:41
Freakuk said:
I'm watching AT waiting for the sub 150's to happen, it won't be long now hopefully. I know I'd never get an allocation but getting one in the right spec near list is the current goal.
Considering the age of the Cayman platform, wouldn’t a 992 gt3 be a strong contender over a gt4rs considering they are now at a similar price point? You also don’t have to drive around with ear defenders on the public road.
GT4RS said:
Freakuk said:
I'm watching AT waiting for the sub 150's to happen, it won't be long now hopefully. I know I'd never get an allocation but getting one in the right spec near list is the current goal.
Considering the age of the Cayman platform, wouldn’t a 992 gt3 be a strong contender over a gt4rs considering they are now at a similar price point? You also don’t have to drive around with ear defenders on the public road.
I think Porsche have made an error in the alignment of the 4RS. I bet they will never admit it but the story goes like this :
Long time GT and RS owner / driver - immediately detects a handling issue when driven hard on B roads. Over a slight crest where previous cars have given no problem , the car gets air and very nearly followed by a ditch.
OPC check alignment and declare it's all within Porsche tolerances. Said car goes to Centre Gravity and they declare that whilst it may well be within "P" tolerances , it's all over the shop !!
Once sorted the car is completely different to drive and mirrors the previous handling traits of GT & RS products owned.
Weirdly , C of G also declare that this 4RS is by no means the 1st one they have seen with these handling symptoms.
I think the people who got the early cars fall into 2 categories. The people that just had to have one because it's a new RS product but quickly fell out of love with it due to noise and handling - Hence why there are quite a few 2nd hand ones knocking about ......... and the long time enthusiast that has kept the cars and looked at solving the handling characteristics and happy to put up with the noises racket inside the cabin.
Great car on a circuit , road trip , b roads - not so much
Long time GT and RS owner / driver - immediately detects a handling issue when driven hard on B roads. Over a slight crest where previous cars have given no problem , the car gets air and very nearly followed by a ditch.
OPC check alignment and declare it's all within Porsche tolerances. Said car goes to Centre Gravity and they declare that whilst it may well be within "P" tolerances , it's all over the shop !!
Once sorted the car is completely different to drive and mirrors the previous handling traits of GT & RS products owned.
Weirdly , C of G also declare that this 4RS is by no means the 1st one they have seen with these handling symptoms.
I think the people who got the early cars fall into 2 categories. The people that just had to have one because it's a new RS product but quickly fell out of love with it due to noise and handling - Hence why there are quite a few 2nd hand ones knocking about ......... and the long time enthusiast that has kept the cars and looked at solving the handling characteristics and happy to put up with the noises racket inside the cabin.
Great car on a circuit , road trip , b roads - not so much
Far Cough said:
I think Porsche have made an error in the alignment of the 4RS. I bet they will never admit it but the story goes like this :
Long time GT and RS owner / driver - immediately detects a handling issue when driven hard on B roads. Over a slight crest where previous cars have given no problem , the car gets air and very nearly followed by a ditch.
OPC check alignment and declare it's all within Porsche tolerances. Said car goes to Centre Gravity and they declare that whilst it may well be within "P" tolerances , it's all over the shop !!
Once sorted the car is completely different to drive and mirrors the previous handling traits of GT & RS products owned.
Weirdly , C of G also declare that this 4RS is by no means the 1st one they have seen with these handling symptoms.
I think the people who got the early cars fall into 2 categories. The people that just had to have one because it's a new RS product but quickly fell out of love with it due to noise and handling - Hence why there are quite a few 2nd hand ones knocking about ......... and the long time enthusiast that has kept the cars and looked at solving the handling characteristics and happy to put up with the noises racket inside the cabin.
Great car on a circuit , road trip , b roads - not so much
I think there is some truth in the above.Long time GT and RS owner / driver - immediately detects a handling issue when driven hard on B roads. Over a slight crest where previous cars have given no problem , the car gets air and very nearly followed by a ditch.
OPC check alignment and declare it's all within Porsche tolerances. Said car goes to Centre Gravity and they declare that whilst it may well be within "P" tolerances , it's all over the shop !!
Once sorted the car is completely different to drive and mirrors the previous handling traits of GT & RS products owned.
Weirdly , C of G also declare that this 4RS is by no means the 1st one they have seen with these handling symptoms.
I think the people who got the early cars fall into 2 categories. The people that just had to have one because it's a new RS product but quickly fell out of love with it due to noise and handling - Hence why there are quite a few 2nd hand ones knocking about ......... and the long time enthusiast that has kept the cars and looked at solving the handling characteristics and happy to put up with the noises racket inside the cabin.
Great car on a circuit , road trip , b roads - not so much
I had mine checked over and set up at CG after 1000 miles, and settings were a bit out and it was driving to the right on full acceleration, so that was resolved as well. I've since had 1 very enjoyable track day and yes the noise at 9k is pretty loud even with a helmet on, but I found it quite exhilarating so no issues there.
Away from the track I just find it can be as noisy as you want it to be, but it can also be reasonably subdued and almost refined if you just want to relax and listen to the radio or some music even, and still have fun. I actually think you get a bit of the best of all worlds, reasonably normal relaxed driving one minute, noisy mayhem the next, and something in between as well when you fancy.
A bit of a Jekyll and Hyde car I suppose but always great fun to drive which is the main thing for me, I don’t actually care if the GT3 is technically superior, a bit more stable, or faster around a track - I’m not swapping it out anytime soon.
I think if I ended up in one I'll be off to somewhere like suspension secrets who aren't too far and have a fast road setup to hopefully resolve any nervousness.
To be fair my GT4 is a handful on some of the roads I go down, so I am used to this trait and/or maybe the GT4 needs some tinkering also.
I think there's quite a few for sale as a percentage of the people with an allocation saw instant pound signs, some people would have paid north of 200K not too long ago at their peak, so maybe people are getting out while they can and not take too much of a hit. I was having a chat with an owner I bumped into at a petrol station a month or two ago and he admitted paying overs for his, so they'll be quite a lot of people I would imagine in the same boat.
To be fair my GT4 is a handful on some of the roads I go down, so I am used to this trait and/or maybe the GT4 needs some tinkering also.
I think there's quite a few for sale as a percentage of the people with an allocation saw instant pound signs, some people would have paid north of 200K not too long ago at their peak, so maybe people are getting out while they can and not take too much of a hit. I was having a chat with an owner I bumped into at a petrol station a month or two ago and he admitted paying overs for his, so they'll be quite a lot of people I would imagine in the same boat.
I’m genuinely stumped by all this talk of ear defenders for the GT4RS. Has PH been annexed to the Saga forum?
It really isn’t all that loud. It is a bit stiff on bumpy cambered B roads but not terrible.
But loud? No. If you think it is loud, dare I say you need to drive some properly loud cars
It really isn’t all that loud. It is a bit stiff on bumpy cambered B roads but not terrible.
But loud? No. If you think it is loud, dare I say you need to drive some properly loud cars
AndrewD said:
I’m genuinely stumped by all this talk of ear defenders for the GT4RS. Has PH been annexed to the Saga forum?
It really isn’t all that loud. It is a bit stiff on bumpy cambered B roads but not terrible.
But loud? No. If you think it is loud, dare I say you need to drive some properly loud cars
Have a lifetime of “properly loud” cars and have got permenant tinnitus as a result. Each to their own, it’s your hearing after all, personally wish I could turn the clock back re my own hearing. Now if I’m driving my Exige or Caterham I wear noise cancelling headphones…. It really isn’t all that loud. It is a bit stiff on bumpy cambered B roads but not terrible.
But loud? No. If you think it is loud, dare I say you need to drive some properly loud cars
AndrewD said:
I’m genuinely stumped by all this talk of ear defenders for the GT4RS. Has PH been annexed to the Saga forum?
It really isn’t all that loud. It is a bit stiff on bumpy cambered B roads but not terrible.
But loud? No. If you think it is loud, dare I say you need to drive some properly loud cars
Sorry but I think you are completely wrong on this! It really isn’t all that loud. It is a bit stiff on bumpy cambered B roads but not terrible.
But loud? No. If you think it is loud, dare I say you need to drive some properly loud cars
Multiple independent tests measuring cabin noise, put the 4RS as the noisiest car on sale today. Show me another mass produced standard car that is noisier.
Yes you can drive it sensibly and at a level where the noise is not too intrusive, but where is the fun in that?
Paradoxically from the outside the car is quite quiet, stood on the pit wall watching mine go past at full chat its quite muted.
For me it was not just the sound level inside the cabin but the sound quality that is such a let down. It’s just a blare of intake noise, almost white noise in quality. There are loads of cars that do intake noise really well: M3CSL, Alfa twin cams in fact virtually anything on Weber DCOE carbs.
In my particular car the intake noise was overlaid by a truly awesome set of rattles and squeaks from the interior which felt very substandard for a Porsche. Of particular note were the 2 weird plastic bits on the cage behind the headrests these rattled against the cage whole time.
I also have had some properly loud cars in the garage but these have been loud in the right way, usually exhaust noise, but a fair amount of mechanical chatter thrown in for good measure. Back in the day I had a straight piped MGC on triple Webers which I used to drive on the road along with hill climbs, sprints and races. Now that was noisy but it was the right sort of noisy.
So no I might be in my 60’s but it’s not a “Saga” thing. It’s genuinely not a nice noise. Sorry.
Ps it’s great on track and the noise isn’t an issue once the helmet is on.
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