Boxster Spyder
Discussion
Hi I am considering the potential purchase of the Boxter Spyder, used mainly for weekend country drives and possibly an annual hoon (europe or scotland) Thinking about a Manual and my other option is the TVR Griff. I have been a past TVR owner many years ago and thinking the Spyder will be more relaiable and modern. My biggest concern is not having that V8 Noise with the porsche. I would appreciate any thoughts and comments other cars would be considered though thinking the Lotus might be too hard and depreciation is always a consideration, Morgan rulled out due to costs for the 368BHP (I will be checking out the spyder on you tube)
- I would be interested in finding an owner ideally in Nottinghamshire or surrounding counties who I could speak to and possibly have a look at a car.
- Then finally any cars for sale ideally white manual if local a bonus.
Thanks for you help much appreciated.
- I would be interested in finding an owner ideally in Nottinghamshire or surrounding counties who I could speak to and possibly have a look at a car.
- Then finally any cars for sale ideally white manual if local a bonus.
Thanks for you help much appreciated.
Myself and Zyp are local both have white cars, one with buckets one without.
No other cars comes close, only a Lotus Elise New shape charged cooled one would be on my radar.(if the Spyder had not been made)
Some say the best handling car Porsche have ever made,
Not a great deal to choose from though if you want manual and buckets with PSE and Spyder wheels.
as most current owners are now long termers,
Even Zyp and myself are know car flippers but we have both had them over 2 years which is crazy.
No other cars comes close, only a Lotus Elise New shape charged cooled one would be on my radar.(if the Spyder had not been made)
Some say the best handling car Porsche have ever made,
Not a great deal to choose from though if you want manual and buckets with PSE and Spyder wheels.
as most current owners are now long termers,
Even Zyp and myself are know car flippers but we have both had them over 2 years which is crazy.
Edited by mrdemon on Wednesday 15th January 11:31
mrdemon said:
Some say the best handling car Porsche have ever made,
In what way? Different people want different things from a car's handling. Handling can be that it does things without fuss, easily and efficiently, which probably leads to a quicker car from A to B. Edited by mrdemon on Wednesday 15th January 11:31
Or it can be entertaining handling, for example getting it to slide around and keeping the driver involved.
I suspect the Spyder being mid engined is the former but not the latter. It's pretty hard sliding a mid engined car in an accessible and controlled way, so I would be surprised if it was the best handling car in the sense of driver involvement. It also does not have the steering feel or generally alive feeling of a GT3.
Precision and balance are also entertaining, especially when 'making progress', although the Spyder also feels great just trundling around, due to its inherent 'rightness'.
911 handling characteristics are either a bonus or a flaw of the layout, depending on your perspective.
Depends what you want. It's good that we have a choice.
ETA - also not wishing to debate which is best! Just different.
911 handling characteristics are either a bonus or a flaw of the layout, depending on your perspective.
Depends what you want. It's good that we have a choice.
ETA - also not wishing to debate which is best! Just different.
Edited by Lox on Wednesday 15th January 12:56
[quote=On`it]Hi I am considering the potential purchase of the Boxter Spyder, used mainly for weekend country drives and possibly an annual hoon (europe or scotland) Thinking about a Manual and my other option is the TVR Griff. I have been a past TVR owner many years ago and thinking the Spyder will be more relaiable and modern. My biggest concern is not having that V8 Noise with the porsche. I would appreciate any thoughts and comments other cars would be considered though thinking the Lotus might be too hard and depreciation is always a consideration, Morgan rulled out due to costs for the 368BHP (I will be checking out the spyder on you tube)
- I would be interested in finding an owner ideally in Nottinghamshire or surrounding counties who I could speak to and possibly have a look at a car.
- Then finally any cars for sale ideally white manual if local a bonus.
Thanks for you help much appreciated.
[/quote]
I was a serial TVR owner a while back and, whilst there's no denying they are very different, the Spyder reminds me of them in some ways. Lots of feel and presence plus you get a manual roof to faff with! Seriously though, the build quality and engineering is in a different class. Also, much as I still love 'em, you'd end up in a mess if you attempted to drive on twisty roads in the same way in a Griffith. As for the noise, no they don't rumble but the PSE is good. Nice deep sound at low revs and then, an almost Speed 6 like howl when revved high - well maybe not quite so violent!
Incidentally, are you adding to the 430 or replacing it?
- I would be interested in finding an owner ideally in Nottinghamshire or surrounding counties who I could speak to and possibly have a look at a car.
- Then finally any cars for sale ideally white manual if local a bonus.
Thanks for you help much appreciated.
[/quote]
I was a serial TVR owner a while back and, whilst there's no denying they are very different, the Spyder reminds me of them in some ways. Lots of feel and presence plus you get a manual roof to faff with! Seriously though, the build quality and engineering is in a different class. Also, much as I still love 'em, you'd end up in a mess if you attempted to drive on twisty roads in the same way in a Griffith. As for the noise, no they don't rumble but the PSE is good. Nice deep sound at low revs and then, an almost Speed 6 like howl when revved high - well maybe not quite so violent!
Incidentally, are you adding to the 430 or replacing it?
Zyp said:
Not wishing to get involved in an argument about which car handles best, but two of the instructors at the PEC told me it was the best P car they have driven.
This article was posted up on the PCGB forum a couple of days ago. It is from the American Porsche Club and is a comparison between a Spyder (the author's) and a, perhaps unusually, a 981 Boxster with optional sports suspension. Some of the accolades to which MrD alludes for the Spyder are listed in the article.
I do agree with Alpinestars though - "best" has to be subjective and the Spyder is clearly a different beast to the GT cars.
http://pca.imirus.com/Mpowered/book/vpca14/i1/p70
Porsche's generally (at least newish ones) are excellent at going around corners "properly" - flat, fast and with the car remaining balanced and within grip tolerances. If you want the car to be a bit more fun in the sense of slippy, get worse tyres :-)
I expect that any mid-engined Porsche will react fairly predictably as regards managing oversteer and understeer (although they do not have an obvious bias against which to fight, if you see what I mean).
The Spyder is very unlikely to be the best handling Porsche on any basis, though. I would be amazed if it could be better than the Cayman R (given that they are very similar but the Cayman must, I assume, be more rigid). Maybe I am wrong, but the Cayman R would seem a more obvious competitor than the GT3 (where some subjective elements come in given the different engine layout). That said, all this bumf out mid-engined v rear-engined is overblown given the actual difference in engine position as between a modern 911 and a Cayman/Boxster; the weight allocation is pretty damn similar, too.
I expect that any mid-engined Porsche will react fairly predictably as regards managing oversteer and understeer (although they do not have an obvious bias against which to fight, if you see what I mean).
The Spyder is very unlikely to be the best handling Porsche on any basis, though. I would be amazed if it could be better than the Cayman R (given that they are very similar but the Cayman must, I assume, be more rigid). Maybe I am wrong, but the Cayman R would seem a more obvious competitor than the GT3 (where some subjective elements come in given the different engine layout). That said, all this bumf out mid-engined v rear-engined is overblown given the actual difference in engine position as between a modern 911 and a Cayman/Boxster; the weight allocation is pretty damn similar, too.
Alpinestars said:
In what way? Different people want different things from a car's handling. Handling can be that it does things without fuss, easily and efficiently, which probably leads to a quicker car from A to B.
Or it can be entertaining handling, for example getting it to slide around and keeping the driver involved.
I suspect the Spyder being mid engined is the former but not the latter. It's pretty hard sliding a mid engined car in an accessible and controlled way, so I would be surprised if it was the best handling car in the sense of driver involvement. It also does not have the steering feel or generally alive feeling of a GT3.
quote was from car and driver. :-)Or it can be entertaining handling, for example getting it to slide around and keeping the driver involved.
I suspect the Spyder being mid engined is the former but not the latter. It's pretty hard sliding a mid engined car in an accessible and controlled way, so I would be surprised if it was the best handling car in the sense of driver involvement. It also does not have the steering feel or generally alive feeling of a GT3.
as for steering, it is every way as good regarding feel as any GT3, so not sure about those comments and that maybe more to do with the cars geo set up than steering feel. with most GT3 running -2 neg camber and a tad of toe out !!! and standard Spyder is -.05 neg camber and toe in. Like for like steering feel will be the same :-)
as you say pretty hard sliding a mid engine car, so you could day harder to drive than a GT3, as I have never got this "easy to drive" or harder to drive" b
ks which comes up every time a GT3 or a Boxster is talked about.I found the GT3 easier to drive over the limit if any thing, so that's just forum up talk or down talk depending which camp you are in :-)
I have seen many a Boxster spin even on public roads, but was drifting off my 1st round about the day I picked my GT3 up !!
will_ said:
Good enough for your sister though, eh? 
I would say girls don't get steering feel, but that feels a bit 80s. It's always difficult to say which car handles best when comparing very good cars, but as far as steering feels goes, there is just no comparison. PS do they come with tongues and a hairdryer?
Anyone who has ever played Gran Turismo on a Playstation can tell you that you cannot slide a mid-engined car 
They hold hold hold and then spin like mad, with nothing in between...
In reality, I think it is a lot lot easier to play with the limits in a car with the engine stuck out in the front than with a car that has no obvious tendency as regards balance and grip. The natural tendency of a modern Porsche to hold about as tightly at front and back makes it both faster and less easy to do silly things in.
I think the Playstation view of mid-engine handling is overstated, though, as the rear tyres will let go quite predictably and come back into line quite predictably, too. It is just a little bit harder to judge the right and wrong amount of overload than it is when the car has a clear bias. I bet any fool (e.g. someone like me) would get the back end of a Jag F-type sliding out on every low-speed corner along a chosen b-road drive, to be honest. But I bet I would go faster in a Cayman S (and faster still in an R)along the same road. The real benefit of the way a Porsche handles is in mid to high speed corners, in my view: you cannot slide the back end out at silly speeds anyway, and the Cayman/Boxster will stick fast and flat at speeds that would make the back end twitchy in a FR or RR layout car (with the caveat that 911s dont really behave as RR cars anymore).
They hold hold hold and then spin like mad, with nothing in between...In reality, I think it is a lot lot easier to play with the limits in a car with the engine stuck out in the front than with a car that has no obvious tendency as regards balance and grip. The natural tendency of a modern Porsche to hold about as tightly at front and back makes it both faster and less easy to do silly things in.
I think the Playstation view of mid-engine handling is overstated, though, as the rear tyres will let go quite predictably and come back into line quite predictably, too. It is just a little bit harder to judge the right and wrong amount of overload than it is when the car has a clear bias. I bet any fool (e.g. someone like me) would get the back end of a Jag F-type sliding out on every low-speed corner along a chosen b-road drive, to be honest. But I bet I would go faster in a Cayman S (and faster still in an R)along the same road. The real benefit of the way a Porsche handles is in mid to high speed corners, in my view: you cannot slide the back end out at silly speeds anyway, and the Cayman/Boxster will stick fast and flat at speeds that would make the back end twitchy in a FR or RR layout car (with the caveat that 911s dont really behave as RR cars anymore).
ORD said:
Anyone who has ever played Gran Turismo on a Playstation can tell you that you cannot slide a mid-engined car They hold hold hold and then spin like mad, with nothing in between...
In reality, I think it is a lot lot easier to play with the limits in a car with the engine stuck out in the front than with a car that has no obvious tendency as regards balance and grip. The natural tendency of a modern Porsche to hold about as tightly at front and back makes it both faster and less easy to do silly things in.
I think the Playstation view of mid-engine handling is overstated, though, as the rear tyres will let go quite predictably and come back into line quite predictably, too. It is just a little bit harder to judge the right and wrong amount of overload than it is when the car has a clear bias. I bet any fool (e.g. someone like me) would get the back end of a Jag F-type sliding out on every low-speed corner along a chosen b-road drive, to be honest. But I bet I would go faster in a Cayman S (and faster still in an R)along the same road. The real benefit of the way a Porsche handles is in mid to high speed corners, in my view: you cannot slide the back end out at silly speeds anyway, and the Cayman/Boxster will stick fast and flat at speeds that would make the back end twitchy in a FR or RR layout car (with the caveat that 911s dont really behave as RR cars anymore).
The 5th Gear test of the Boxster Spyder suggests that it's handling can be quite playful. They hold hold hold and then spin like mad, with nothing in between...In reality, I think it is a lot lot easier to play with the limits in a car with the engine stuck out in the front than with a car that has no obvious tendency as regards balance and grip. The natural tendency of a modern Porsche to hold about as tightly at front and back makes it both faster and less easy to do silly things in.
I think the Playstation view of mid-engine handling is overstated, though, as the rear tyres will let go quite predictably and come back into line quite predictably, too. It is just a little bit harder to judge the right and wrong amount of overload than it is when the car has a clear bias. I bet any fool (e.g. someone like me) would get the back end of a Jag F-type sliding out on every low-speed corner along a chosen b-road drive, to be honest. But I bet I would go faster in a Cayman S (and faster still in an R)along the same road. The real benefit of the way a Porsche handles is in mid to high speed corners, in my view: you cannot slide the back end out at silly speeds anyway, and the Cayman/Boxster will stick fast and flat at speeds that would make the back end twitchy in a FR or RR layout car (with the caveat that 911s dont really behave as RR cars anymore).
anonymous said:
[redacted]
not really, elastic-kinematic joints are used on the 996 and 997 GT3.only the GT2 RS uses rose joints as far as I know, but don't quote me :-) some RS might also. (ie the RS4.0)
I run RSS LCA with more solid mounting and solid rear toe links (which stops any rear steer under heavy braking) :-)
the so called GT3 "alive" feeling just comes from the over stiff front ARB which makes the steering wheel buck. lol that is NOT feel :-)
remember, I am the only current owner of a Cayman R and a Spyder (both modded) at the same time, who also ran a GT3 for 12 months at the same time.
but people want to tell me how they all feel , classic.
shavenhaven said:
Careful if you've arranged to meet Zyp, On'it? Stick to public areas (preferably daytime) and keep your back to the wall at all times. I'd also take some Mace spray if i were you.
Mace has no effect on me as well you know, after I enlarged your sphincter two fold... 
Edited by Zyp on Wednesday 15th January 16:31
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