My 911 Carrera 63 Reg - Intermittant High Pitch noise
Discussion
I bought a 911 in October 2021 from a main Porsche dealer. A few weeks after purchase I could hear a high pitch screeching noise seemingly emanating from the PCM screen but it quickly disappeared. Since then the noise remains but only heard on an intermittantl basis, i.e weeks can pass without hearing it. The noise has a mind of its own but it only starts when I reach 49mph and continues in higher speeds. It can be heard with the soundsystem on or off. The vehicle is still under warranty and I have taken the car to the dealer I bought the car from and another Porsche dealer who is closer to where I live. However, after testing neither could not hear the noise. Although I made a tape recording of the noise and played it to the current Porsche dealer who is trying to help he tells me unless a technician can witness the noise they are not willing to conduct a deeper investigation.
I would be very grateful if anyone on the site has experienced an issue like this and if/how it was resolved would get in touch and share their experience.
thank you David Wood Ross
I would be very grateful if anyone on the site has experienced an issue like this and if/how it was resolved would get in touch and share their experience.
thank you David Wood Ross
DAVIDWOODROSS said:
I bought a 911 in October 2021 from a main Porsche dealer. A few weeks after purchase I could hear a high pitch screeching noise seemingly emanating from the PCM screen but it quickly disappeared. Since then the noise remains but only heard on an intermittantl basis, i.e weeks can pass without hearing it. The noise has a mind of its own but it only starts when I reach 49mph and continues in higher speeds. It can be heard with the soundsystem on or off. The vehicle is still under warranty and I have taken the car to the dealer I bought the car from and another Porsche dealer who is closer to where I live. However, after testing neither could not hear the noise. Although I made a tape recording of the noise and played it to the current Porsche dealer who is trying to help he tells me unless a technician can witness the noise they are not willing to conduct a deeper investigation.
I would be very grateful if anyone on the site has experienced an issue like this and if/how it was resolved would get in touch and share their experience.
thank you David Wood Ross
This happened to me when I had my windscreen changed. The plastic strip covering the gap between pillars and the screen was not seated properly on the outside of the car causing it to make a high pitched whistle which changed pitch with speed.I would be very grateful if anyone on the site has experienced an issue like this and if/how it was resolved would get in touch and share their experience.
thank you David Wood Ross
Thank you so much for responding so quickly. The situation is driving me insane. The local Porsche rep asked me to maintain a diary and every time I take the car out record key data i.e time/speed etc, I have now complied on a daily basis for the past 7 days but each time I the noise has refused to cooperate.
Your experience with your windscreen - I assume you heard the noise internally coming from the PCM area? Is that right and how was the issue resolved?
Pleased to hear from you
Your experience with your windscreen - I assume you heard the noise internally coming from the PCM area? Is that right and how was the issue resolved?
Pleased to hear from you
Thanks for your response. My car is a 63 plate so not £100k. However, your remarks are valid but the limtations of a Porsche Warranty i.e apparently Porsche dealers are not reimbursed for diagnostic costs so they have no incentive to do a comprehensive fault finding exercise. In my case they have insisted they must hear the noise before carrying out any further work although they have heard my tape. Therefore, I find myself in a 'double bind' its been more than a week since I last heard the noise (that does not mean it has disappeared) and since I am unable to record it, Porsche will not continue further investigations.
My noise emanated throughout the car. The only reason I knew it was the windscreen was because it had just been changed. If I had just heard the noise without that information Id have had no clue.
In regards to PCM noise, in other cars, particularly older stuff I found when i had this type of noise coming from the audio system it changed pitch with revs and turned out to be a bad earth on the audio unit or amp.
What i would do is ask them to temporarily remove the unit for a week or so and see if it goes. If it does then you know its the audio system or peripheral wiring.
The other option is to go and see an audio specialist who can check the wiring, but being on a Fibre CAN Bus it maybe difficult to diagnose. Thats where my knowledge ends Im afraid.
Hope that helps.
In regards to PCM noise, in other cars, particularly older stuff I found when i had this type of noise coming from the audio system it changed pitch with revs and turned out to be a bad earth on the audio unit or amp.
What i would do is ask them to temporarily remove the unit for a week or so and see if it goes. If it does then you know its the audio system or peripheral wiring.
The other option is to go and see an audio specialist who can check the wiring, but being on a Fibre CAN Bus it maybe difficult to diagnose. Thats where my knowledge ends Im afraid.
Hope that helps.
Many thanks again for your message. I told the Porsche dealer before that since the noise seems to be originating from the PCM the fault could be the amp but my suggestion was dismissed. I will return to the dealer and ask them to carry another investigation along the lines you have suggested. If they refuse I will look into your alternative suggestion.
I am still trying to find a resolution to the noise defect issue but not making much progress. What I have discovered is my research has thrown up a massive can of worms regarding the Porsche Approved Warranty bringing Consumer Law (mis-selling) and Porsche brand reputation into play. I am awaiting a response to my last email to the selling dealership and will revert.
David Wood Ross
David Wood Ross
DAVIDWOODROSS said:
I am still trying to find a resolution to the noise defect issue but not making much progress. What I have discovered is my research has thrown up a massive can of worms regarding the Porsche Approved Warranty bringing Consumer Law (mis-selling) and Porsche brand reputation into play. I am awaiting a response to my last email to the selling dealership and will revert.
David Wood Ross
Oh really, sounds ominous.David Wood Ross
Have you had a good explore with the HVAC settings OP? It's all right behind the PCM, you might find that it's a blower motor or flap actuator or just something caught in the ducting.
It could be that if you have it set on Auto it's only hitting the sweet spot every now and again and could even seem weather dependent. If you have a go at a combination of manual settings that cover fan low/medium/high, hot/cold/inbetween, up/face/down, recirc or AC on and off and engine hot and cold you might be able to provoke it
It could be that if you have it set on Auto it's only hitting the sweet spot every now and again and could even seem weather dependent. If you have a go at a combination of manual settings that cover fan low/medium/high, hot/cold/inbetween, up/face/down, recirc or AC on and off and engine hot and cold you might be able to provoke it
for The Wookie Many thanks for your suggestion which makes a lot of plausible sense. I will now test following your guidance and let you know the result. I took the car to two Porsche dealerships in recent months for investigation and because they could not hear the noise will not carry out any further diagnosis. They say it is an acoustic problem not covered by the Warranty because it does not affect functionality.
What bull....! and what about my enjoyment which is what driving a high performance Porsche is all about?. My lawyer will love to get his teeth into this but I am not at that stage yet.
thanks again David
What bull....! and what about my enjoyment which is what driving a high performance Porsche is all about?. My lawyer will love to get his teeth into this but I am not at that stage yet.
thanks again David
Wookie,
Thanks again for your help and tested my car on two occasions over the weekend along the lines you suggested but disappointingly was unable to replicate the noise. Nevertheless I still think your theory has potential merit and will explore further with Porsche, if I can convince them to investigate further.
As mentioned in a recent post Porsche are being difficult regarding the Porsche Approved Warranty which I may have been mis-sold and may also have brand reputational implications. I am finding the topic shrouded in mystery and non disclosure since many Porsche employees I have spoken to have not been forthcoming in providing information. I now know why and was shocked to learn for the first time recently that all Porsche employees have to be FCA qualified before they can sell these Warranties and discuss their T's and C's with a customer. The plot thickens since I also have discovered the Warranty is in fact not a Warranty but an insurance policy (a big difference between the two) outsourced to a third party insurer.
In my case, I only became aware of this when I realised I never received a Warranty certificate which should have been given after I bought the policy. A week ago, after requesting I was emailed the document certificate which confirmed it is an insurance policy and provided the name of the insurer who underwrites the contract.
I would much appreciate hearing from any forum member who has purchased such a Warranty to get in touch and confirm or otherwise if they knew about any of these facts prior to buying the Warranty. Thank you.
David
Thanks again for your help and tested my car on two occasions over the weekend along the lines you suggested but disappointingly was unable to replicate the noise. Nevertheless I still think your theory has potential merit and will explore further with Porsche, if I can convince them to investigate further.
As mentioned in a recent post Porsche are being difficult regarding the Porsche Approved Warranty which I may have been mis-sold and may also have brand reputational implications. I am finding the topic shrouded in mystery and non disclosure since many Porsche employees I have spoken to have not been forthcoming in providing information. I now know why and was shocked to learn for the first time recently that all Porsche employees have to be FCA qualified before they can sell these Warranties and discuss their T's and C's with a customer. The plot thickens since I also have discovered the Warranty is in fact not a Warranty but an insurance policy (a big difference between the two) outsourced to a third party insurer.
In my case, I only became aware of this when I realised I never received a Warranty certificate which should have been given after I bought the policy. A week ago, after requesting I was emailed the document certificate which confirmed it is an insurance policy and provided the name of the insurer who underwrites the contract.
I would much appreciate hearing from any forum member who has purchased such a Warranty to get in touch and confirm or otherwise if they knew about any of these facts prior to buying the Warranty. Thank you.
David
For Wookie
I have continued testing and on 5 April had a breakthrough when after setting the HVAC at 22 C and Auto off the noise began after leaving my home and continued for an hour at speeds of 15 and 60 mph. It has not behaved like that before. However, after switching the engine off for 10 minutes I drove again for 15 minutes (same settings) but the noise was not heard. I stopped and tested again 5 mins after.and the noise returned. The next day tested for 5 times and the noise was heard twice. I was able to record each time.
Next week I will return to Porsche locally with this new information and hope they will do something. However, I am not optimistic! It would help my cause if you were able to expand your knowledge when you said it might be a blower motor or flap actuator or something in the ducting. Have you had experience with these issues? I am talking to Porsche from a position of relative ignorance so with more technical information might convince them to investigate. Because their software says NO they are not taking my issue seriously enough despite hearing the first recording of it. I have reported the matter to Porsche GB who are a wholly owned subsidiary of Porsche AG but they are equally unhelpful.
Any extra information you have can only assist my campaign.
Many thanks again David Wood Ross
I have continued testing and on 5 April had a breakthrough when after setting the HVAC at 22 C and Auto off the noise began after leaving my home and continued for an hour at speeds of 15 and 60 mph. It has not behaved like that before. However, after switching the engine off for 10 minutes I drove again for 15 minutes (same settings) but the noise was not heard. I stopped and tested again 5 mins after.and the noise returned. The next day tested for 5 times and the noise was heard twice. I was able to record each time.
Next week I will return to Porsche locally with this new information and hope they will do something. However, I am not optimistic! It would help my cause if you were able to expand your knowledge when you said it might be a blower motor or flap actuator or something in the ducting. Have you had experience with these issues? I am talking to Porsche from a position of relative ignorance so with more technical information might convince them to investigate. Because their software says NO they are not taking my issue seriously enough despite hearing the first recording of it. I have reported the matter to Porsche GB who are a wholly owned subsidiary of Porsche AG but they are equally unhelpful.
Any extra information you have can only assist my campaign.
Many thanks again David Wood Ross
Sorry no specific experience beyond knowing sort of how these systems generally work and where they are in the car. Sounds like you’re getting close to making it repeatable though!
Try and think about anything else that might coincide with the behaviour eg weather conditions, time of day, fuel level, have you just done a long journey (so battery charge or residual temperature) even random stuff like whether it’s parked uphill or downhill
If you can’t get it 100% repeatable then the best thing you could do is get it to happen and drive it straight to the dealer workshop and let them hear it. As soon as they’ve heard it then it’s ultimately their problem.
Try and think about anything else that might coincide with the behaviour eg weather conditions, time of day, fuel level, have you just done a long journey (so battery charge or residual temperature) even random stuff like whether it’s parked uphill or downhill
If you can’t get it 100% repeatable then the best thing you could do is get it to happen and drive it straight to the dealer workshop and let them hear it. As soon as they’ve heard it then it’s ultimately their problem.
Thanks again Wookie for the suggestions. I have been keeping a diary since 22 February - 7 April less two weeks off with covid) and logged 25 tests noting time/weather/speeds/ roof open shut/auto on of/ air temp/ moved temp control in cabin/ etc and heard the sound 10 times. So no of test days excl covid 31. Monthly sound result: Feb (6 days) 0 times March (4 days) 4 times April ( 5 days) 4 times.
You mention fuel level which is interesting which I never paid much attention to before. I heard the noise 4 times over 5/6 April but since late pm 6 April when I topped up to 3/4 full, after short testing 4 times yesterday the sound was not there. However there may a correlation since the fuel level was very low before filling. However, when I last filled up with low fuel pre covid the noise was not heard. Nevertheless, there could be a link with extra weight or its distribution. Having said that the car feels more solid when driving after filling up but may be my imagination. Who knows? but will continue testing today and over Easter. Nearly forgot to say during both last tests the noise began at a speed of around 15 mph whereas previously it would only start at 49 mph. Maybe significant?
You also suggest taking it to the dealer workshop. Just to demonstrate how difficult and temperamental the noise is. I mentioned the local Porsche dealer is only 5 miles away and on two occasions I heard the noise I changed course and headed for the dealer and the sound accompanied me. On both occasions I managed to get a technician to immediately escort me on a test drive and guess what? sods law came into play and the noise was not evident. Porsche are insisting they witness the noise before they do any diagnostic work. Any further insights would be most welcome. Thank you again
You mention fuel level which is interesting which I never paid much attention to before. I heard the noise 4 times over 5/6 April but since late pm 6 April when I topped up to 3/4 full, after short testing 4 times yesterday the sound was not there. However there may a correlation since the fuel level was very low before filling. However, when I last filled up with low fuel pre covid the noise was not heard. Nevertheless, there could be a link with extra weight or its distribution. Having said that the car feels more solid when driving after filling up but may be my imagination. Who knows? but will continue testing today and over Easter. Nearly forgot to say during both last tests the noise began at a speed of around 15 mph whereas previously it would only start at 49 mph. Maybe significant?
You also suggest taking it to the dealer workshop. Just to demonstrate how difficult and temperamental the noise is. I mentioned the local Porsche dealer is only 5 miles away and on two occasions I heard the noise I changed course and headed for the dealer and the sound accompanied me. On both occasions I managed to get a technician to immediately escort me on a test drive and guess what? sods law came into play and the noise was not evident. Porsche are insisting they witness the noise before they do any diagnostic work. Any further insights would be most welcome. Thank you again
No probs!
Fuel level I was actually thinking fuel pump as the tank is ahead of the bulkhead and any noise could sound like it’s coming from where you’re describing. I’ve experienced a pump on the way out whirring intermittently on a low fuel level, although it wasn’t a Porsche most modern cars are all similar
In terms of going to the dealer, I mean actually phone them on your way and get the technician to come out while you’ve kept it running.
Fuel level I was actually thinking fuel pump as the tank is ahead of the bulkhead and any noise could sound like it’s coming from where you’re describing. I’ve experienced a pump on the way out whirring intermittently on a low fuel level, although it wasn’t a Porsche most modern cars are all similar
In terms of going to the dealer, I mean actually phone them on your way and get the technician to come out while you’ve kept it running.
Wookie,
Thanks once more. I had not thought about a possible failing pump and its location but was thinking the extra weight after a refill could in some way shift the wiring or unknown parts which are causing the noise. Will mention this to the local dealer when I go there this week.
Your suggestion phoning whilst on my way and getting a technician iwho would be available at short notice to come out for a test.whilst I wait and keep the car running is unlikely. I have known this dealership for 20 years and I now feel they are getting fed up with me bothering them unless I agree to pay for an investigation which could be akin to offering them a blank cheque. I will ask and let you know the result after my meeting with them.
Thanks once more. I had not thought about a possible failing pump and its location but was thinking the extra weight after a refill could in some way shift the wiring or unknown parts which are causing the noise. Will mention this to the local dealer when I go there this week.
Your suggestion phoning whilst on my way and getting a technician iwho would be available at short notice to come out for a test.whilst I wait and keep the car running is unlikely. I have known this dealership for 20 years and I now feel they are getting fed up with me bothering them unless I agree to pay for an investigation which could be akin to offering them a blank cheque. I will ask and let you know the result after my meeting with them.
Wookie,
Here is the latest.I have been keeping a log and driving test record since 22 February. I did this at the suggestion of the service adviser at the local dealer and wrote up my findings although I didn't discover anything which linked to a cause. Last Monday I called the guy and asked if I could meet to discuss my report and informed him I recorded the noise (now very loud) 3 times over the weekend which I e-mailed to him. He acknowledged 'WHAT A NOISE'. but repeated what he told me before a noise defect is not covered by the warranty if it doesn't impact funtionality. He also he repeated what he has said many times 'somebody in the dealership has to witness it before we can act' He offered no explanation when I countered and asked 'is driving not a function?' particularly when it overides hearing the radio/CD, impacts my concentration and distracts my attention which is a safety matter. His answer he did not write the policy. Another copout!! I then also asked for a meeting with the dealer principal which triggered a response and whilst he turned down a meeting he asked me to bring the car in again for 2 days on 20/21 April. You may appreciate my position so we'll see what develops but given the obstacles Porsche are putting in the way I cannot envisage a good outcome. After reading reviews on Trust pilot about Porsche GB and Porsche generally whose service ratings are pretty awful eroding my confidence even further,however, it will come as no surprise to me to learn they get good ratings about Porsche sales people particularly when they are selling brand new cars.
A month ago I made a complaint about this and other issues to Porsche GB (a wholly owner sub of Porsche AG) and accused the brand of mis-selling the warranty, which is a reputational issue for Porsche. They failed to take me seriously so I e-mailed the just appointed CEO who referred me back to another w....r in their service dept who called me 2 days ago but guess what? knew nothing about Warranties. He is now going to refer things to his legal/warranty dept for an opinion. Make it up? You couldn't!
Matters are further complicated since I have decided to sell the car. If the defect is not resolved can you imagine how difficult this could be?
Apologies for the rant but trust you and others reading about my experience may be interested and find it beneficial in any future dealings they have with Porsche.
David Wood Ross
David Wood Ross
Here is the latest.I have been keeping a log and driving test record since 22 February. I did this at the suggestion of the service adviser at the local dealer and wrote up my findings although I didn't discover anything which linked to a cause. Last Monday I called the guy and asked if I could meet to discuss my report and informed him I recorded the noise (now very loud) 3 times over the weekend which I e-mailed to him. He acknowledged 'WHAT A NOISE'. but repeated what he told me before a noise defect is not covered by the warranty if it doesn't impact funtionality. He also he repeated what he has said many times 'somebody in the dealership has to witness it before we can act' He offered no explanation when I countered and asked 'is driving not a function?' particularly when it overides hearing the radio/CD, impacts my concentration and distracts my attention which is a safety matter. His answer he did not write the policy. Another copout!! I then also asked for a meeting with the dealer principal which triggered a response and whilst he turned down a meeting he asked me to bring the car in again for 2 days on 20/21 April. You may appreciate my position so we'll see what develops but given the obstacles Porsche are putting in the way I cannot envisage a good outcome. After reading reviews on Trust pilot about Porsche GB and Porsche generally whose service ratings are pretty awful eroding my confidence even further,however, it will come as no surprise to me to learn they get good ratings about Porsche sales people particularly when they are selling brand new cars.
A month ago I made a complaint about this and other issues to Porsche GB (a wholly owner sub of Porsche AG) and accused the brand of mis-selling the warranty, which is a reputational issue for Porsche. They failed to take me seriously so I e-mailed the just appointed CEO who referred me back to another w....r in their service dept who called me 2 days ago but guess what? knew nothing about Warranties. He is now going to refer things to his legal/warranty dept for an opinion. Make it up? You couldn't!
Matters are further complicated since I have decided to sell the car. If the defect is not resolved can you imagine how difficult this could be?
Apologies for the rant but trust you and others reading about my experience may be interested and find it beneficial in any future dealings they have with Porsche.
David Wood Ross
David Wood Ross
TO: Wookie and everyone who has contributed
Update since my last. The local Porsche dealer asked me to bring my car in for further investigation. After 5 days in this dealership they conducted 4 tests and heard only one noise which was recorded and attributed to a faulty rear seat buckle. However this noise has no correlation to my recording. Nevertheless they have ordered a replacement buckle which arrives in 3 weeks. Clutching at straws! Its a computer says NO situation since if Porsche software cannot detect a fault then Porsche junior technicians do not have sufficient experience or out of the box thinking to find a solution. The only way forward is to find a Porsche technician somewhere in the network who has some acoustic fault finding experience.
A response from mumsn3t on 2 March suggested an audio specialist which now seems a good idea but after trying on the internet I have not found anyone with the necessary skills.
In my mind my car has become tainted so I need to get rid but selling with a noise? Imagine what this could do to its value!!! .
Appreciate any suggestions from readers.
David Wood Ross
Update since my last. The local Porsche dealer asked me to bring my car in for further investigation. After 5 days in this dealership they conducted 4 tests and heard only one noise which was recorded and attributed to a faulty rear seat buckle. However this noise has no correlation to my recording. Nevertheless they have ordered a replacement buckle which arrives in 3 weeks. Clutching at straws! Its a computer says NO situation since if Porsche software cannot detect a fault then Porsche junior technicians do not have sufficient experience or out of the box thinking to find a solution. The only way forward is to find a Porsche technician somewhere in the network who has some acoustic fault finding experience.
A response from mumsn3t on 2 March suggested an audio specialist which now seems a good idea but after trying on the internet I have not found anyone with the necessary skills.
In my mind my car has become tainted so I need to get rid but selling with a noise? Imagine what this could do to its value!!! .
Appreciate any suggestions from readers.
David Wood Ross
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