Tesla Model 3 revealed

[Ozzie Osmond]

beanbag said:

Exactly! Ozzie's comments are just nonsense.

I commute 60 miles to work, so 120 miles per day. That's well within the range offered and with a super charger installed in my garage it's very practical for me.

So how many electricity generating plants do you think will need to be built and how thick do you think the electricity cables will have to be to enable half the population to charge their cars in the same few overnight hours?

Your idealised view of the future just doesn't stack up. How long do you think it's going to take EDF to build one nuclear power station at Hinckley Point for a modest £18Bn?

[Impasse]

AnotherClarkey said:

RobGT81 said:

We will run out of magnets before we run out of lithium.

Where does a Tesla use magnets?

In the electric motors?

[98elise]

AnotherClarkey said:

RobGT81 said:

We will run out of magnets before we run out of lithium.

Where does a Tesla use magnets?

To be fair it does, but no more than a normal car.

[98elise]

Ozzie Osmond said:

beanbag said:

Exactly! Ozzie's comments are just nonsense.

I commute 60 miles to work, so 120 miles per day. That's well within the range offered and with a super charger installed in my garage it's very practical for me.

So how many electricity generating plants do you think will need to be built and how thick do you think the electricity cables will have to be to enable half the population to charge their cars in the same few overnight hours?

Your idealised view of the future just doesn't stack up. How long do you think it's going to take EDF to build one nuclear power station at Hinckley Point for a modest £18Bn?

Do you understand the difference between energy and power? We have plently of energy capacity to charge over night.

If your lights go out when you cook or turn the shower on then you might be right.

Edited by 98elise on Friday 1st April 10:34

[HB2K]

Ozzie Osmond said:

beanbag said:

Exactly! Ozzie's comments are just nonsense.

I commute 60 miles to work, so 120 miles per day. That's well within the range offered and with a super charger installed in my garage it's very practical for me.

So how many electricity generating plants do you think will need to be built and how thick do you think the electricity cables will have to be to enable half the population to charge their cars in the same few overnight hours?

Your idealised view of the future just doesn't stack up. How long do you think it's going to take EDF to build one nuclear power station at Hinckley Point for a modest £18Bn?

This is actually a very interesting point. I am sure I have read we are not far off maximum capacity now; how much extra demand would the widespread use of electric cars add - is this marginal or significant. And if the latter, how soon before the grid can cope?

[kambites]

George111 said:

By how much ? Is it very different ?

It's not easy to calculate because there are so many variables. I did try to come up with a "best guess" a while ago but I can't really remember the results. I think using a hydrogen fuel cell to power a car required at least twice as much electricity as using Lithium Ion batteries.

[JD]

Ozzie Osmond said:

Not at all. You appear to have no understanding of the energy density of petrol or the relatively limited capacity of UK electricity generation/distribution. You'll have a good many years to wait for a full upgrade of that lot!

From your amazing ascertation of my understanding from such a brief post, you clearly already know what I am thinking so there is no need for me to reply to what is clearly now just nonsense trolling.

[98elise]

Impasse said:

AnotherClarkey said:

RobGT81 said:

We will run out of magnets before we run out of lithium.

Where does a Tesla use magnets?

In the electric motors?

No its a 3 phase induction motor IIRC.

[kambites]

98elise said:

No its a 3 phase induction motor IIRC.

As far as I know there are no permanent magnets in a Tesla's drive-train which of course is not true for an ICE powered car which typically has them in the starter motor.

[Chris Stott]

HB2K said:

This is actually a very interesting point. I am sure I have read we are not far off maximum capacity now; how much extra demand would the widespread use of electric cars add - is this marginal or significant. And if the latter, how soon before the grid can cope?

We're only close to capacity at peak demand periods - primarily in the evenings when families are home watching TV/cooking dinner etc.

Plenty of capacity the rest of the time, particularly at night.

[98elise]

kambites said:

98elise said:

No its a 3 phase induction motor IIRC.

As far as I know there are no permanent magnets in a Tesla's drive-train which of course is not true for an ICE powered car which typically has them in the starter motor.

I didn't think of that! I've always assumed they were equal, but in fact an ICE needs more

[HB2K]

Chris Stott said:

HB2K said:

This is actually a very interesting point. I am sure I have read we are not far off maximum capacity now; how much extra demand would the widespread use of electric cars add - is this marginal or significant. And if the latter, how soon before the grid can cope?

We're only close to capacity at peak demand periods - primarily in the evenings when families are home watching TV/cooking dinner etc.

Plenty of capacity the rest of the time, particularly at night.

Wouldn't charging add to that peak demand, though? The natural thing would be to come home in the evening and plug the car in straightaway. That's certainly what my old next-door neighbour, who had one of those horrible G-Whizz things, did. Perhaps people would have to be educated not to do that.

[Chris Stott]

HB2K said:

Chris Stott said:

HB2K said:

This is actually a very interesting point. I am sure I have read we are not far off maximum capacity now; how much extra demand would the widespread use of electric cars add - is this marginal or significant. And if the latter, how soon before the grid can cope?

We're only close to capacity at peak demand periods - primarily in the evenings when families are home watching TV/cooking dinner etc.

Plenty of capacity the rest of the time, particularly at night.

Wouldn't charging add to that peak demand, though? The natural thing would be to come home in the evening and plug the car in straightaway. That's certainly what my old next-door neighbour, who had one of those horrible G-Whizz things, did. Perhaps people would have to be educated not to do that.

Could be... 'before you go to bed, put the cat out and stick the car on charge'

[Leithen]

HB2K said:

Chris Stott said:

HB2K said:

This is actually a very interesting point. I am sure I have read we are not far off maximum capacity now; how much extra demand would the widespread use of electric cars add - is this marginal or significant. And if the latter, how soon before the grid can cope?

We're only close to capacity at peak demand periods - primarily in the evenings when families are home watching TV/cooking dinner etc.

Plenty of capacity the rest of the time, particularly at night.

Wouldn't charging add to that peak demand, though? The natural thing would be to come home in the evening and plug the car in straightaway. That's certainly what my old next-door neighbour, who had one of those horrible G-Whizz things, did. Perhaps people would have to be educated not to do that.

The grid system is crude and very unsophisticated. There is enormous room for improvement in management of demand and supply. I suspect it will be led from the bottom up - customers will buy Teslas and similar vehicles and the failings of the electricity industry will be gradually become more apparent and require improvement from suppliers and government.

[otolith]

Ozzie Osmond said:

* To which people are these cars most suitable? City dwellers.

• Which people are least likely to be able to charge the car at home, parked on the street? City dwellers.

Buses. You're thinking of buses. And underground trains. These are more for people who commute into the city, not people who live there.

[dazwalsh]

Is the tech not there to have solar panels built into the bonnet/roof to enable self charging or is that some way off yet?

[Impasse]

Got to feel sorry for electric car owners. Fancy having no social life whatsoever and never going out at night.

[98elise]

HB2K said:

Chris Stott said:

HB2K said:

This is actually a very interesting point. I am sure I have read we are not far off maximum capacity now; how much extra demand would the widespread use of electric cars add - is this marginal or significant. And if the latter, how soon before the grid can cope?

We're only close to capacity at peak demand periods - primarily in the evenings when families are home watching TV/cooking dinner etc.

Plenty of capacity the rest of the time, particularly at night.

Wouldn't charging add to that peak demand, though? The natural thing would be to come home in the evening and plug the car in straightaway. That's certainly what my old next-door neighbour, who had one of those horrible G-Whizz things, did. Perhaps people would have to be educated not to do that.

All we need now is for someone to invent the timeswitch

[Krikkit]

HB2K said:

Chris Stott said:

HB2K said:

This is actually a very interesting point. I am sure I have read we are not far off maximum capacity now; how much extra demand would the widespread use of electric cars add - is this marginal or significant. And if the latter, how soon before the grid can cope?

We're only close to capacity at peak demand periods - primarily in the evenings when families are home watching TV/cooking dinner etc.

Plenty of capacity the rest of the time, particularly at night.

Wouldn't charging add to that peak demand, though? The natural thing would be to come home in the evening and plug the car in straightaway. That's certainly what my old next-door neighbour, who had one of those horrible G-Whizz things, did. Perhaps people would have to be educated not to do that.

Have them set with a built-in timer? If you can get sufficient charge between midnight and 6am then that'll do nicely.

Realistically the problems of EVs being fully adopted by most people are years away.

I've a 35 mile commute each way, one of these would be a perfect companion for it, and neatly save at least £200/month on fuel.

[Leithen]

dazwalsh said:

Is the tech not there to have solar panels built into the bonnet/roof to enable self charging or is that some way off yet?

Nowhere near viable and probably never will be for a single car surface to take in enough energy from the sun.