More ID.3 details
Discussion
Iwantafusca said:
SWoll said:
They've designed the car from the ground up and that's the centre screen solution they signed off on?
Looks like an cheap aftermarket unit someone has stuck on the dash badly with velcro pads?
It reminds of the entertainment unit that was on my mk 1 vw up! , and not in a good way lol. Looks like an cheap aftermarket unit someone has stuck on the dash badly with velcro pads?
ZesPak said:
That does make sense, reducing load in the rear to spare the rear brakes. It is RWD so regenerative braking happens in the back?
Is there a tow hitch available at all?
If you think about it makes quite a lot of sense.Is there a tow hitch available at all?
A normal ice vehicle will of course have options that weigh different amounts but not be that big a swing on the scales, they will also have to deal with an empty/full petrol tank changing the weight.
if you are designing the id3 you have to try and make the smallest (lightest) battery work fine with only a driver on board, you also have to make the largest (heaviest) battery work fine with a full set of passengers and luggage.
There will only be a certain operating range in which the suspension and brakes work, so they have to make the decision to either design different suspension and brakes for the heavier version, or just compromise and limit its weight.
EV are very expensive to make, so I guess the cost of road testing two entire different versions, and having to tool up for two different versions, and having to production split two different versions just doesn't make economic sense.
JD said:
ZesPak said:
That does make sense, reducing load in the rear to spare the rear brakes. It is RWD so regenerative braking happens in the back?
Is there a tow hitch available at all?
If you think about it makes quite a lot of sense.Is there a tow hitch available at all?
A normal ice vehicle will of course have options that weigh different amounts but not be that big a swing on the scales, they will also have to deal with an empty/full petrol tank changing the weight.
if you are designing the id3 you have to try and make the smallest (lightest) battery work fine with only a driver on board, you also have to make the largest (heaviest) battery work fine with a full set of passengers and luggage.
There will only be a certain operating range in which the suspension and brakes work, so they have to make the decision to either design different suspension and brakes for the heavier version, or just compromise and limit its weight.
EV are very expensive to make, so I guess the cost of road testing two entire different versions, and having to tool up for two different versions, and having to production split two different versions just doesn't make economic sense.
Iwantafusca said:
ZesPak said:
Can someone finally answer what they want the buttons for? What buttons does the kona have a tesla or this VW doesn't that you'll miss?
Would you want indicators / wipers / horn on the touchscreen?I like having buttons for basic general controls that you can reach for and operate without looking ( heaters for example )
I don’t want to have to press twice on a screen to reach something?
What would be a 0.5 second operation to twist a dial, with at most a brief glimpse of the console to check you've set the right temp is now 2,3 or 4 separate operations with multiple seconds to watch what you're doing. If the roads rough then double or triple the time.
ChocolateFrog said:
Iwantafusca said:
ZesPak said:
Can someone finally answer what they want the buttons for? What buttons does the kona have a tesla or this VW doesn't that you'll miss?
Would you want indicators / wipers / horn on the touchscreen?I like having buttons for basic general controls that you can reach for and operate without looking ( heaters for example )
I don’t want to have to press twice on a screen to reach something?
What would be a 0.5 second operation to twist a dial, with at most a brief glimpse of the console to check you've set the right temp is now 2,3 or 4 separate operations with multiple seconds to watch what you're doing. If the roads rough then double or triple the time.
Again, why do people post comments like this when they've clearly never used it?
ash73 said:
Stuff like the fuel filler cap isn't used very often, but I hate the idea of switching on the ignition and trying to find it in a menu. Imagine if it's a hire car and they're all hidden in different menus.
I'd probably get used to it though, and they can improve the UI over time.
Plenty of hire cars I've had don't even require you to use an unlock button/latch inside the car.I'd probably get used to it though, and they can improve the UI over time.
If anyone can care to explain why the numerous different locations for physical controls (including Renault's cruise control by the handbrake) makes more sense than a logical touchscreen interface, then I'm all ears.
I think for me there's two classes of annoyance in terms of touch screen control. There's the controls which are rarely used but when they are can be critical to driving - examples of this would be things like screen wash and demist functions. Then there's the things which are (IMO) more convenient on physical buttons because they're used a lot, like basic HVAC (especially air direction - I can't stand the Model-3's screen controlled vents) and basic audio controls (especially volume). Then there's things which are mitigated by features which are optional on some of these cars - for example having the mirror controls burried in the menus is fine if you have memory options for the mirrors but stupid if you don't.
The latter are an annoyance, but one I could live with as long as they're easy to access and/or have decent voice control. The former would put me off a car completely.
What I'd like to see is manufacturers go down the touch screen route but with a number (say 10) of entirely configurable physical buttons and/or dials for whatever function the driver wants to use them. Stick a small screen on each of them so they can display their current function and it could feel very well integrated. I'd also like to see a greater degree of customisation of the touch screen interfaces themselves; maybe even a published API so people can design their own interfaces from the ground up.
The latter are an annoyance, but one I could live with as long as they're easy to access and/or have decent voice control. The former would put me off a car completely.
What I'd like to see is manufacturers go down the touch screen route but with a number (say 10) of entirely configurable physical buttons and/or dials for whatever function the driver wants to use them. Stick a small screen on each of them so they can display their current function and it could feel very well integrated. I'd also like to see a greater degree of customisation of the touch screen interfaces themselves; maybe even a published API so people can design their own interfaces from the ground up.
Edited by kambites on Wednesday 19th August 12:57
kambites said:
I think for me there's two classes of annoyance in terms of touch screen control. There's the controls which are rarely used but when they are can be critical to driving - examples of this would be things like screen wash and demist functions. Then there's the things which are (IMO) more convenient on physical buttons because they're used a lot, like basic HVAC (especially air direction - I can't stand the Model-3's screen controlled vents) and basic audio controls (especially volume).
The latter are an annoyance, but one I could live with as long as they're easy to access and/or have decent voice control. The former would put me off a car completely.
Yeah, most of my experience stems from a Model S which is a bit more conventional than the M3 (like the air vents you mention).The latter are an annoyance, but one I could live with as long as they're easy to access and/or have decent voice control. The former would put me off a car completely.
I think they took it a bit too far in the M3 but I got used to it in the Model S really quickly.
The main thing that irks me about most journalists is "oh no, I had to set the seat and mirrors on the touch screen". But then most of us do it once, these cars have memory for multiple drivers, and never bother with it again. In my model s these are physical buttons I never interact with...
As for audio controls, I've yet to see a car that doesn't have this? All of the cars these days have them on the steering wheel. And with the Tesla there's one on the right of the screen that's "conveniently" placed for my wife
.ZesPak said:
As for audio controls, I've yet to see a car that doesn't have this? All of the cars these days have them on the steering wheel. And with the Tesla there's one on the right of the screen that's "conveniently" placed for my wife .
From what I remember, Tesla sometimes have a volume control on the steering wheel; it depends on which page the screen is on? I also like to have playlists on physical buttons so if I decide I want a different type of music while driving along I can press a physical button I've configured to play "70s music" or whatever. I'm sure that's something most people wouldn't see any value in at all though, which I suppose is an indication of how personal these things are. .I hvaen't played with an ID3 system so I don't know what's where but I hope it's less screen orientated than the Model-3, which I hated. The ID3 certainly has a lot more buttons than the Tesla.
ETA: Looking more closely at the pictures, there seems to be a bank of switches to the left of the steering wheel which I hadn't noticed for things like demisters, so maybe they've got the balance about right. I'd still like to see knobs for the temperature control and fan speed, but otherwise it actually looks quite well thought out.
Edited by kambites on Wednesday 19th August 13:11
I do wish people would actually spend some time using these things before posting about issues with them.
Yes there are maybe a couple of things that are more awkward (climate air flow, wiper speed should you need to alter it) but in the most part it's incredibly well thought out and works brilliantly IME, and I was not at all convinced that was going to be the case prior to getting the car.
Yes there are maybe a couple of things that are more awkward (climate air flow, wiper speed should you need to alter it) but in the most part it's incredibly well thought out and works brilliantly IME, and I was not at all convinced that was going to be the case prior to getting the car.
I've spent enough time in a Model-3 to know I would never buy one simply because of the control setup, however good it was in other ways. You like it, that's great. I don't.
The ID3 looks like it might be fine, though. Right now it's still hovering near or at the top of the list to be our next family car (if the price turns out to be reasonable). I'm certainly impressed with the way VAG are managing to package things on the MEB platform; the upcoming Skoda looks promising too.
ETA: Fortunately the EV market is finally getting broad enough now that we can actually make a choice on such boring things as interior UI designs.
The ID3 looks like it might be fine, though. Right now it's still hovering near or at the top of the list to be our next family car (if the price turns out to be reasonable). I'm certainly impressed with the way VAG are managing to package things on the MEB platform; the upcoming Skoda looks promising too.
ETA: Fortunately the EV market is finally getting broad enough now that we can actually make a choice on such boring things as interior UI designs.
Edited by kambites on Wednesday 19th August 14:41
ZesPak said:
I hope it's at least fixed solidly in place. One thing that impressed by about the Model 3 is how little movement there is in the screen.
aestetix1 said:
That looks awful. Stuck on to the dashboard like an afterthought, and made of shiny black plastic that will show up every fingerprint and spec of dust.
I don't get this current obsession with gloss black interiors. It looks cheap, feels nasty, shows every scratch and mark. There's nothing remotely premium looking about it. It must be cheap to install.RobDickinson said:
I'm sure all you button lovers are still using Nokia or blackberry phones.
I don't use my phone whilst operating dangerous, fast moving heavy machinery.My E-Tron has a three screen setup that looks great, and has proper buttons for the most important things, but the climate control is not exactly easy to use on the move. My Volvo was the same. I'd rather have physical buttons and dials for climate control, and the option to navigate menus and options by jog-wheel as well as touch screen.
There's a balance that can be struck.
Any situation I'd feel uncomfortable using the touch screen I'd feel equally uncomfortable using non wheel controls in any other car.
Obviously I have full voice commands if I need to change something without taking my eyes of the road or hands off the wheel which beats either kind of other control.
Obviously I have full voice commands if I need to change something without taking my eyes of the road or hands off the wheel which beats either kind of other control.
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