The electric revolution
Discussion
chappardababbar said:
Me in Westfield. Fast fwd 5 years and this will be surrounded by the next generation of i3s, Leafs, Prius' etc...
The reason I'm pondering all this is because I'm massively into modern classics. Perhaps this is an extreme view but I don't think I should be adding any classics to the garage from now on.
I'm actually really excited about the next wave of petrol / electric hybrids which will fit in perfectly in the new era.
All the cars in that pic could be at least 5 years old. What makes you think that in five years time the same pic won't have cars from today and the past in it?The reason I'm pondering all this is because I'm massively into modern classics. Perhaps this is an extreme view but I don't think I should be adding any classics to the garage from now on.
I'm actually really excited about the next wave of petrol / electric hybrids which will fit in perfectly in the new era.
buggalugs said:
Petrol stations are going to be a rare sight in 20 years!
I'm not a gambling man, but I'll happily wager that you'r dead wrong in this regard.EV vehicles are a solution - but only for certain types of journey ie. those that are within the range of the vehicle and offer sufficient charge time between use.
Personally speaking, there isn't an EV on the market that offers viable transport for my use and even if it did, I'd probably still take an IC car simply because transport infrastructure (garages/service stations etc) is in place for it. Until you can walk to a garage and pick up a replacement battery pack to get you going again should you run out of charge (and you will), IC is here to stay.
Look at fuel cell by way of comparison. It's not so much that the technology isn't available, but that there isn't any infrastructure to support it. Not to mention the huge power requirements (mostly fossil - which partly defeats the point) of generating the hydrogen in the first place!
EVs are still relatively in their infancy, but unless major advances are made in terms of battery capacity, charge time and longevity are made, IC will be around for many, many years - even if it's in a range extender role.
Besides, there is too much money tied up, politically and privately, around fossil fuel to catalyse any change.
Stig said:
buggalugs said:
Petrol stations are going to be a rare sight in 20 years!
I'm not a gambling man, but I'll happily wager that you'r dead wrong in this regard.EV vehicles are a solution - but only for certain types of journey ie. those that are within the range of the vehicle and offer sufficient charge time between use.
Which isn't that rare
Stig said:
Personally speaking, there isn't an EV on the market that offers viable transport for my use and even if it did, I'd probably still take an IC car simply because transport infrastructure (garages/service stations etc) is in place for it. Until you can walk to a garage and pick up a replacement battery pack to get you going again should you run out of charge (and you will), IC is here to stay.
Look at fuel cell by way of comparison. It's not so much that the technology isn't available, but that there isn't any infrastructure to support it. Not to mention the huge power requirements (mostly fossil - which partly defeats the point) of generating the hydrogen in the first place!
EVs are still relatively in their infancy, but unless major advances are made in terms of battery capacity, charge time and longevity are made, IC will be around for many, many years - even if it's in a range extender role.
Besides, there is too much money tied up, politically and privately, around fossil fuel to catalyse any change.
in 20 years time 50% of car sales will be capable of running on battery only either as part of a hybrid or as pure EV. The rest will be split between diesel and petrolLook at fuel cell by way of comparison. It's not so much that the technology isn't available, but that there isn't any infrastructure to support it. Not to mention the huge power requirements (mostly fossil - which partly defeats the point) of generating the hydrogen in the first place!
EVs are still relatively in their infancy, but unless major advances are made in terms of battery capacity, charge time and longevity are made, IC will be around for many, many years - even if it's in a range extender role.
Besides, there is too much money tied up, politically and privately, around fossil fuel to catalyse any change.
xRIEx said:
McWigglebum4th said:
xRIEx said:
Pints said:
0a said:
(surely this thread should be in the electric car forum?)
I didn't know we had one of those.It is positively buzzing
celicawrc said:
Rubbish.
Every single electric car that has ever been released has flopped BIG TIME!
Until the battery charge becomes equal in distance and convenience to petrol/diesel it won't happen. As for electric sports cars....the noise an engine makes is a massive part of the experience of driving. Don't know why anyone with petrol in their veins would want and electric car? Ever!
thisEvery single electric car that has ever been released has flopped BIG TIME!
Until the battery charge becomes equal in distance and convenience to petrol/diesel it won't happen. As for electric sports cars....the noise an engine makes is a massive part of the experience of driving. Don't know why anyone with petrol in their veins would want and electric car? Ever!
EV evangelism is a horrific thing, its getting as bad as the smugness that went around with hybrids
davepoth said:
Censorious said:
iva cosworth said:
100 mile electric car range is just not good enough.......
The BMW i3 uses a 168bhp electric motor under the boot floor, combined with a lithium-ion battery pack. It is also available with an optional range-extending motorcycle engine that keeps the batteries topped up.Without the range extender the BMW i3’s range stands at anywhere between about 80 miles and 125 miles depending on how you drive; with the range-extender those numbers could double.
As it happens, it would be plenty practical for me as I have off road parking at both ends of my short commute, but how many people have that?
The range extender. I presume the petrol engine is generating electric that feeds the motor? So as long as you have petrol you'll never run out of range.
Not that it tries to top up the battery, but you'll draw energy faster than the extender can make it, so eventually you'll have to stop regardless.
Not that it tries to top up the battery, but you'll draw energy faster than the extender can make it, so eventually you'll have to stop regardless.
Munter said:
The range extender. I presume the petrol engine is generating electric that feeds the motor? So as long as you have petrol you'll never run out of range.
Not that it tries to top up the battery, but you'll draw energy faster than the extender can make it, so eventually you'll have to stop regardless.
Only if you drive at 100plus MPH everywhere for hundreds of milesNot that it tries to top up the battery, but you'll draw energy faster than the extender can make it, so eventually you'll have to stop regardless.
davepoth said:
Censorious said:
iva cosworth said:
100 mile electric car range is just not good enough.......
The BMW i3 uses a 168bhp electric motor under the boot floor, combined with a lithium-ion battery pack. It is also available with an optional range-extending motorcycle engine that keeps the batteries topped up.Without the range extender the BMW i3’s range stands at anywhere between about 80 miles and 125 miles depending on how you drive; with the range-extender those numbers could double.
As it happens, it would be plenty practical for me as I have off road parking at both ends of my short commute, but how many people have that?
Munter said:
McWigglebum4th said:
Only if you drive at 100plus MPH everywhere for hundreds of miles
Not exactly standard EV driver behavior 
I used the M4 Heston rapid chargers the other day - had about half batter and it went up a few notches in about 10 mins. I can see a world where rapid chargers are everywhere, and instead of stopping for a long time to charge up (like if you were going on a long journey), most charging would be of short duration of a few minutes and would happen often during the day. Right now we have to plug in, but in the future wireless charging might be the norm.
davepoth said:
But then it would be a hybrid and not an electric car. The point stands - 100 mile range and several hour recharge times just aren't practical for a lot of people.
As it happens, it would be plenty practical for me as I have off road parking at both ends of my short commute, but how many people have that?
There are plenty of rapid chargers installed that will take you from almost flat to 80% in about 30 minutes.As it happens, it would be plenty practical for me as I have off road parking at both ends of my short commute, but how many people have that?
I haven't found the range of my leaf to be too much of a limitation. It'll do work and back (80 miles) without needing to charge, but as my client now has dedicated parking and charging facilities to encourage EV use, it'd be rude not too. but I do see your point - 100 miles seems to be the 'magic' range figure in many peoples' heads, despite the actual percentage of people actually needing that range to be pretty small. I'm on a two year lease, based on a prediction that a 48kWh / 150 mile leaf is going to land next year...
s1962a said:
I used the M4 Heston rapid chargers the other day - had about half batter and it went up a few notches in about 10 mins. I can see a world where rapid chargers are everywhere, and instead of stopping for a long time to charge up (like if you were going on a long journey), most charging would be of short duration of a few minutes and would happen often during the day. Right now we have to plug in, but in the future wireless charging might be the norm.
I stopped at a garage the other day. Took me about 3 mins to fill the tank giving me enough range for a week's worth of driving 
Inductive charging (especially in parking spaces) would be a great solution. But again, who is going to pay for the infrastructure????
Stig said:
I stopped at a garage the other day. Took me about 3 mins to fill the tank giving me enough range for a week's worth of driving
Inductive charging (especially in parking spaces) would be a great solution. But again, who is going to pay for the infrastructure????
I doudt if it took 3 minutesInductive charging (especially in parking spaces) would be a great solution. But again, who is going to pay for the infrastructure????
Does that include waiting to get to the pump and dealing with the idiots in the shop
And that is assuming you have a petrol station on your direct route.
My route to work passes exactly zero petrol stations without diverting from the normal path
Inductive charging is only for the terminally lazy
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