2023 Prius (Sadly not coming here!)

[Evanivitch]

Auslander said:

The black cab is a petrol PHEV.
.

It's a REx. With a 30 kWh battery and a choice of CCS and Chademo rapid charging it's way better.

There are some rubbish claims in the Prius PHEV Wikipedia page which completely ignore the existence of the Ampera/Volt and i3.

[TheDeuce]

Evanivitch said:

Auslander said:

The black cab is a petrol PHEV.
.

It's a REx. With a 30 kWh battery and a choice of CCS and Chademo rapid charging it's way better.

There are some rubbish claims in the Prius PHEV Wikipedia page which completely ignore the existence of the Ampera/Volt and i3.

There's a lot to be said for REx, it allows the use of pure EV for the majority of a cars life - and in the cab's case, should an airport run be required it'll get it done.

A far cry from hybrids which fall back on ICE after tiny miles.

[Auslander]

TheDeuce said:

Yes but they run nearly exclusively on the battery - a Prius can't do that for the same cycles in the real world.

Expensive but better - expensive for a casual Uber driver but well within the means of a cabbie with their group buying power and discounts.

Only if you spend time charging them during the day - and I got a whole load of hassle from some black cab drivers recently because the cost of public charging was more than the cost of putting petrol in it.

[Snow and Rocks]

TheDeuce said:

Tbh I think Toyota, having done so much to kick start electrified cars, have woefully lost their way by going so heavy into endless hybrid variants and also going down the dead end hydrogen route.

I don't think they're doing too badly. Most of their recent models have been pretty well receibed. I asked about delivery timescales when my Hilux was in for a service recently and the salesmen said almost every model had a waiting list. 2 years+ for some models.

Hybrid Toyotas might not grab the headlines like a Tesla but they're incredibly popular amongst the (fairly conservative) buyers and for good reason - they're great cars to own especially now with the 10 year warranty.

[DMZ]

I’m assuming it’s partially Brexit related as in they can’t be bothered with UK certification. I would speculate that maybe the CO2 doesn’t hit the right thresholds for BIK in the UK. The business case for EU certification is easy to justify. There are various market peculiarities in Europe but they’ll sell plenty of these particularly if it looks as good as it does and comes in at a good price point. Plenty of people are still buying hybrids.

[ajprice]

After the state of the current model, this one looks great and the reaction seems positive overall, the 2.0 engine and power hike probably helps too. The Japanese car import companies might bring a few in if they think there is a market and Toyota don't officially sell it here.

Edited by ajprice on Thursday 17th November 09:24

[Jonny_]

Seems bizarre that this new Prius isn't going to be sold here. It looks superb, both styling wise and in technical terms.

If Toyota are basing their decision around poor sales of the current Prius, I reckon they need to have a rethink. The MK4 sold poorly because of the oddball styling and lack of performance, which the new one appears to have improved upon dramatically.

Of course it might just be that the British market is fickle and the only things that sell well are faux off roaders or supposedly premium badges.

Auslander said:

All are compromised. The Ioniq was a good EV but utterly dreadful hybrid.

The Prius platform is designed, ground up, as a hybrid. They won’t compromise that because some oddballs want one that’s fully battery. They have an EV platform for that market.

I have never seen an Iconiq minicab, but almost every time I order an Uber, it’s a Prius. For a very good reason.

I had an Ioniq hybrid for 3 years and thought it was excellent. Pleasant to drive, comfy, reliable, typically returned 65mpg. The car was designed from the outset to be hybrid, plug in and full EV, along with the Niro. What makes you say they were dreadful?

As for minicabs, I've seen plenty of Ioniqs in use as minicabs around West and North Yorkshire. You probably do see more Priuses simply because they've been around a lot longer, and there are plenty of older examples available for little cost.

Will say that for big mileages the Prius drivetrain makes more sense than the Ioniq's in terms of longevity (Toyota system has no clutches or actuators, Hyundai is based around a DCT gearbox).

[AmitG]

I wonder whether another factor is that the UK is going zero emissions in 2030 - which is a full 5 years ahead of the EU.

That is 5 years less to recoup the investment on importing, type approval, advertising, servicing capability, parts network etc. And given that sales are expected to be small - maybe it was a factor in the business case not stacking up.

I expect another factor is that it would cannibalise sales of the Corolla, and they felt that (unlike the US) the UK market is not big enough to sustain both. But personally, if I was Toyota UK I would cut the Corolla hatchback (which doesn't seem to sell well at all) and replace it with the new Prius. So then you have the Prius for tech lovers, and the Corolla estate for practicality. But then you have the issue that the Corolla is made in the UK, and the Prius is made in Japan, so now Derby is under-utilised...It's complicated.

[Snow and Rocks]

Toyota UK have a bit of a habit about making odd decisions - they could sell a good number of Land Cruisers if they got the marketing/supply right but when I went to look at one years ago I couldn't find a demonstrator anywhere and would have to order off the brochure with a long waiting list. They then dropped it citing lack of demand! The new 300 series in GR trim could easily take on the Defender.

They are apparently basing the decision on lack of demand in the final years of the previous model - the Prius will be replaced again by 2030 so not sure that's relevant.

[Mammasaid]

DMZ said:

I’m assuming it’s partially Brexit related as in they can’t be bothered with UK certification. I would speculate that maybe the CO2 doesn’t hit the right thresholds for BIK in the UK. The business case for EU certification is easy to justify. There are various market peculiarities in Europe but they’ll sell plenty of these particularly if it looks as good as it does and comes in at a good price point. Plenty of people are still buying hybrids.

I think you're assuming wrong then.

Toyota said:

We registered just 563 Prius hybrids in Britain last year.

https://www.carmagazine.co.uk/car-news/first-offic...

Shame as it's a much better looking thing.

[Evanivitch]

AmitG said:

I wonder whether another factor is that the UK is going zero emissions in 2030 - which is a full 5 years ahead of the EU.

UK is PHEV on 2030, not zeros emissions.

[Snow and Rocks]

Probably pointless but I messaged Toyota UK on Facebook to tell them how disappointed I was and surprisingly got some proper replies back from a real human almost instantly. Might be worth it if a few others do the same.

[AmitG]

Evanivitch said:

AmitG said:

I wonder whether another factor is that the UK is going zero emissions in 2030 - which is a full 5 years ahead of the EU.

UK is PHEV on 2030, not zeros emissions.

I never knew that - thanks. I thought that it was 2030 for zero emissions.

In that case, Toyota please get a move on and bring this thing to the UK

[Richyboy]

The first time I’ve ever wanted a Prius and it’s not coming here lol. 13.5KWH battery for town and petrol for long trips, solar roof, looks desirable and Toyota reliability.

[sawman]

that looks ace

[AmitG]

I reckon that the JDM importers may be doing some good business here...

[JonChalk]

DMZ said:

I’m assuming it’s partially Brexit related as in they can’t be bothered with UK certification. I would speculate that maybe the CO2 doesn’t hit the right thresholds for BIK in the UK. The business case for EU certification is easy to justify. There are various market peculiarities in Europe but they’ll sell plenty of these particularly if it looks as good as it does and comes in at a good price point. Plenty of people are still buying hybrids.

I'll see if I can find it but saw a quote from a Toyota UK director that said something along the lines of "we sold 165 Prius last year and 12,000+ C-HRs, so not worth the effort, as UK buyers don't want it".

edit: got the numbers wrong, but the principle right - Autocar provided this quote from toyota:

"This shift in UK market conditions has been reflected in Prius sales figures – there were 563 sales in 2021, in comparison to just under 18,000 hybrid Toyota C-HRs. Prius will continue to be sold in other European markets and will only be available as a plug-in version."

Edited by JonChalk on Friday 18th November 14:19

Edited by JonChalk on Friday 18th November 14:20

[Auslander]

That puts to bed the oft-held opinion that people only buy SUVs because they're all that's offered.

The C-HR is a weird looking thing with very compromised packaging - the Prius is streets ahead.

[Snow and Rocks]

I think that's because most people thought the previous model looked horrible - I didn't mind it but mostly because it looked different rather than good! It also only had borderline acceptable performance.

If anyone would be genuinely interested in one, it's worth giving Toyota UK a message on FB.

[AmitG]

I'll give feedback to my dealer. I've had loads of new cars from them including a Prius+, Prius Gen4, Corolla saloon and Camry so I'm going to make it clear that if they brought it over at a non-crazy price they'd have another sale.