Second hand zoes - the battery lease?

[FiF]

That's fair enough analysis, but if you're someone who keeps vehicles for a fair time then leased battery model is a non starter.

[chandrew]

FiF said:

That's fair enough analysis, but if you're someone who keeps vehicles for a fair time then leased battery model is a non starter.

Yes, I agree. However my understanding is that the reason that Renault did this was to reduce the fear of folks about batteries becoming unusable which is mostly a concern for people who keep their cars a fair time. If you just intend to hand it back after 2 or 3 years then why not just provide one lease for both car + battery?

I think someone at Renault has made a big mistake in their financial models. I suspect they've compared the price of a battery lease to the cost of running a petrol / diesel equivalent. If you do this then a car plus a lease enables you to offer a Zoe at a similar price to a similar spec Clio and a battery lease which is a bit cheaper than fuel costs of the Clio + the owners get all the tax advantages of an electric car.

However, these cars 'competitors' on the second hand market are other electric cars first and the fixed battery lease can only result in really tragic depreciation.

[HTP99]

Renault now offer; and have done for some time now, the ZOE with the option of battery ownership, how many people now opt to purchase it that way, not many, from a new proposition; which is what Renault only really care about as it is registrations that they are after and to get people on board to electric, the current way with low monthly payments on a PCP, is the perfect way for them to sell new ZOE's.

[teabelly]

Once all these EVs are out of normal warranty ie 4 years old will any of them sell anyway? It's not like you have a lot of decent indies to take one to yet.

[TooLateForAName]

HTP99 said:

Renault now offer; and have done for some time now, the ZOE with the option of battery ownership, how many people now opt to purchase it that way, not many, from a new proposition; which is what Renault only really care about as it is registrations that they are after and to get people on board to electric, the current way with low monthly payments on a PCP, is the perfect way for them to sell new ZOE's.

My view is that the resale value of the zoe is now too tarnished for the i- models to make any difference.

With the PCP deals offered nobody is doing any purchase other than through PCP and the residuals afterwards are just laughable. It might work elsewhere in europe (Im not sure how) but in the UK the zoe is dead on the used market.

[teabelly]

You seem to have to give away a Zoe even when it's new.

http://www.greenhousrenault.co.uk/offers/new-car/r...

If the zoe is dead second hand now then it's potentially dead as a new car within 18 months. I can't see how Renault can keep thinking they can churn these things out as a loss and have to scrap them when they're 2 or 3. It's not exactly environmentally friendly is it? I hope they're sending them abroad to be hire cars on islands as they'd be ideal for that.

Edited by teabelly on Wednesday 24th February 09:48

[gangzoom]

teabelly said:

You seem to have to give away a Zoe even when it's new.

http://www.greenhousrenault.co.uk/offers/new-car/r...

If the zoe is dead second hand now then it's potentially dead as a new car within 18 months. I can't see how Renault can keep thinking they can churn these things out as a loss and have to scrap them when they're 2 or 3. It's not exactly environmentally friendly is it? I hope they're sending them abroad to be hire cars on islands as they'd be ideal for that.

Edited by teabelly on Wednesday 24th February 09:48

Nissan were doing these deals last year. They are all done via RCI - which I believe is Nissan/Renault backed. Either these car are so cheap to make they don't care, or they are selling them as 'loss leaders'. Whos knows.

[essayer]

So I need a zero emissions car to take me to the station, where parking (normally £117/month) is free if you have an electric car

This is would appear to be a no brainer for that! Is the deal available nationally?

[AH33]

Put the EV's back in the oven, they're not done yet

[teabelly]

I don't know. It's still worth adding up the total costs as you still have the battery lease on top so another £55 a month. Plus 30p a mile charge if you go over 3000 miles which could cost you a lot. That £99 a month isn't. It's £154 a month minimum plus another £999 for the deposit.

[TooMany2cvs]

teabelly said:

You seem to have to give away a Zoe even when it's new.

If the zoe is dead second hand now then it's potentially dead as a new car within 18 months. I can't see how Renault can keep thinking they can churn these things out as a loss and have to scrap them when they're 2 or 3. It's not exactly environmentally friendly is it?

"...have to scrap them..."? Unlikely... They'd certainly sell - like hotcakes - at a price considerably above scrap value. Hell, I'd have one for £500. Whether that's a price lower than export (to RHD countries?) is another question, as is whether Renault choose to scrap them to maintain brand value.

[teabelly]

They might sell but if the traction batteries are knackered due to being sat about for months then Renault won't want to cough up to replace them. A zoe with duff batteries is an economic write off before it's reached even 4. It's making sure they don't end up sitting about that's key so they need to get rid of the battery lease or make sure the cars are shifted off to be used as soon as possible.

Sensible thing to do with them is to sell them off to hire car/taxi firms abroad in RHD territories but re-badged as something else. Dacia maybe?

[Prizam]

teabelly said:

Sensible thing to do with them is to sell them off to hire car/taxi firms abroad in RHD territories but re-badged as something else. Dacia maybe?

Or put a V8 in them.


I have been tempted to get a Twizzy and put a motorbike engine in it. but getting out of the battery rental scheme is difficult.

[teabelly]

Prizam said:

Or put a V8 in them.


I have been tempted to get a Twizzy and put a motorbike engine in it. but getting out of the battery rental scheme is difficult.

I suppose you could you take the batteries out and send them to RCI as you wouldn't be renting their batteries

[onedsla]

teabelly said:

You seem to have to give away a Zoe even when it's new.

http://www.greenhousrenault.co.uk/offers/new-car/r...

Edited by teabelly on Wednesday 24th February 09:48

If the £999 deposit bothers you:

£92 per month with £92 deposit (3,000 miles)
£99 per month with £99 deposit (7,500 miles)
£108 per month with £108 deposit (10,000 miles)
Plus Battery Rental as below
3,000 Mile (750 miles Per Quarter) £55pm (30ppm excess)
7,500 Mile £80pm (7.5ppm excess)
10,000 Mile £95pm (7.5ppm excess)
Quotes on higher mileage on request
100% Electric - Includes Free 7kW Wallbox
2yr PCP and 2yr Battery Rental

The 7500 mile deal works out around £183pm over the 2 year term.
(Wonder if there's a market for second hand wallbox to recoup after the term ends?)

[dsquires]

how I'm looking at it:

- the battery lease is covered by not buying car mags, wine gums& coffess due to not visiting petrol stations
- the Mrs pays the congestion charge 3x a week, so thats over £100 a month saved
- the parking permit where I live is free for a ZEV so thats £200 a year saved
- cant think of another 2 year old vehicle with 6k miles, warranty, 5 seats etc thats cheaper than a 2nd hand Zoe at sub £6k
- cant value the amusement factor of hooning in silence
- the ride is amazingly good over sh*tty London tarmac
- cant be bothered to work it out but free Westminster parking could easily save a few hundred a year

at these prices a 2nd hand Zoe is frankly cheaper than the bus.

I'm in!

[dave_s13]

It'll certainly be interesting to see what happens when we all give these back in December. There's was quite a few of us on here that git them for cheap.

Ours was £150 deposit then £155/month for 7500m per year. 24m contract. The GFV is something like £8.5k....Yeah right!

I'd be more than happy to keep the car and run it another 2yrs under some kind of extended pcp. Do manufacturers ever give you th option to just keep the car and extend the term rather than buy it off them?

If it does indeed have to go back and there's nothing comparable on offer for the new zoe, or leaf, then I'm eying up a mitsubishi iMIEV as a replacement. They seem to be priced around £5-6k as an outright purchase, no battery rental.

[teabelly]

There's is no harm in asking the pcp provider about whether the term can be extended for another year or two. You'd want to be paying less than you do now though.

[HTP99]

teabelly said:

There's is no harm in asking the pcp provider about whether the term can be extended for another year or two. You'd want to be paying less than you do now though.

I sell Renault's; I believe you can only finance the whole of the remaining balloon on HP as opposed to extending the PCP, I would think that if the PCP was extendable RCI would want to take a serious look at the residual as the way things are going; a 4 year old ZOE will be worth peanuts so therefore the monthlies would likely be higher than what is being paid currently.

[ooo000ooo]

dave_s13 said:

It'll certainly be interesting to see what happens when we all give these back in December. There's was quite a few of us on here that git them for cheap.

Ours was £150 deposit then £155/month for 7500m per year. 24m contract. The GFV is something like £8.5k....Yeah right!

I'd be more than happy to keep the car and run it another 2yrs under some kind of extended pcp. Do manufacturers ever give you th option to just keep the car and extend the term rather than buy it off them?

If it does indeed have to go back and there's nothing comparable on offer for the new zoe, or leaf, then I'm eying up a mitsubishi iMIEV as a replacement. They seem to be priced around £5-6k as an outright purchase, no battery rental.

Mines due back in January, would happily extend it for another year if I could.
My dealer had a year old one with 10 miles on it for £5995. I thought it was a typo but perhaps not!