500 mile+ ranged EV Confirmed
Discussion
Every one wants more range, but range in EV = ££££ as you have to have a bigger battery.
When we bought our X we could have gone for the 'long range' version, so 250 miles of real world range versus 200 miles of ours, but for our usage that extra 50 miles would only come in handy once a year, and paying a £8k+ premium at the time for the range made no sense.
3.5 years and 46k on I have no issues with our 200 mile range EV interms of family duties. Day to day I don't keep it charged beyond 50%. Looking at the data only 6% of our tirps in the car required DC charging, which implies the extra range would have only have come in handy at most 6% of the time. In reality its less than that as many of those trips were beyond 250 miles so we have to have charged anyways the real difference a bigger battery would have made I suspect is sub 3% of all trips.
Pre COVID there was a case for us to have a car that could do 300 miles in all weathers/speeds for day return work trips, but actually login into Teams is much easier for everyone, and I suspect we'll never go back to doing those kind of trips.
Any of current EVs sold today is more than good enough for most families in the UK. Sure if you need to tow a caravan across Europe in sub zero temperatures every day in winter you will need a 500 mile+ range EV, but just don't expect it to be cheap. Don't forget if you decide to pay £££££ for a big battery but than don't use all the extra range all the time your ineffect throwing your cash away.
Rather than just assume you need a 500 mile range EV be realistic about how you actually use your car. Than work out the cost versus inconvenience of having to stop for 20 mintues for a charge versus not in a small versus larger battery EV.
It’s a really interesting time. The game is becoming more competitive as new companies bring products to market. The e 208 that fits my need might not suit all but I really want one. Hopefully these cars can become a reality and it can become a more even market place. I don’t do many trips a year over 150 miles so 99.9% of the time the e 208 works for me.
Others in business with the need to travel further enjoy their Tesla’s and I get that. Most people traditionally gravitate to the transport that is appropriate and within their budget. This won’t change and more choice is a good thing.
Others in business with the need to travel further enjoy their Tesla’s and I get that. Most people traditionally gravitate to the transport that is appropriate and within their budget. This won’t change and more choice is a good thing.
aestetix1 said:
Tesla start throttling DC charging speeds around 2250kWh so your battery is nearly half way to being worn out. You should probably try to limit the amount of DC charging you do, including on CCS and CHAdeMO because it all counts towards the total.
This was new info for but I went to look it up and the only case I've found was a guy who did over 6600kWh of supercharging.Also, no mention on the Tesloop vehicles and those have done an order of magnitude more.
Do you have any source on your info?
ZesPak said:
This was new info for but I went to look it up and the only case I've found was a guy who did over 6600kWh of supercharging.
Also, no mention on the Tesloop vehicles and those have done an order of magnitude more.
Do you have any source on your info?
Unfortunately the threshold is a secret that Tesla won't share. Some people with 90kWh packs put it around 2250kWh, for some it's been around 6000kWh. Some claim that 100kWh packs can take 10,000kWh or more.Also, no mention on the Tesloop vehicles and those have done an order of magnitude more.
Do you have any source on your info?
So you could be half way there or 1/10th of the way there, no way to know for sure.
Worse still Tesla can change the limit at any time with a software update. If they notice they are seeing too many warranty claims your battery might be downgraded to save them some cash.
As knowledge of this spreads it will be interesting to see how it affects used prices. People know to check for degradation but I think few check for how much DC charging has been done.
SWoll said:
Not wildly cheaper? UK numbers below
Mercedes C63 - 470bhp - 1800KG - 24mpg = 20p per mile @ £106.9 per litre
Model 3 P - 480bhp - 1800kg - 275 mile range from 75kWh battery - 3.66 miles per Kw = 4p per mile @ 15p per kW.
Over 12k miles per that's a saving of £2400 - £480 = £1920 or an 80% difference.
And those figures are based on being kind to the C63 on mpg, current cheap UK fuel costs and an above average kW cost without special rates taken into account.
Errrr, C63S owner here..... yeah, they 'can' be good on MPG on a run, but seriously anything remotely enthusiastic and you will struggle to break 24MPG and around town its pretty disastrous. Its impressive for a 500BHP engine, but seriously its a stuffing fortune in fuel!Mercedes C63 - 470bhp - 1800KG - 24mpg = 20p per mile @ £106.9 per litre
Model 3 P - 480bhp - 1800kg - 275 mile range from 75kWh battery - 3.66 miles per Kw = 4p per mile @ 15p per kW.
Over 12k miles per that's a saving of £2400 - £480 = £1920 or an 80% difference.
And those figures are based on being kind to the C63 on mpg, current cheap UK fuel costs and an above average kW cost without special rates taken into account.
off_again said:
SWoll said:
Not wildly cheaper? UK numbers below
Mercedes C63 - 470bhp - 1800KG - 24mpg = 20p per mile @ £106.9 per litre
Model 3 P - 480bhp - 1800kg - 275 mile range from 75kWh battery - 3.66 miles per Kw = 4p per mile @ 15p per kW.
Over 12k miles per that's a saving of £2400 - £480 = £1920 or an 80% difference.
And those figures are based on being kind to the C63 on mpg, current cheap UK fuel costs and an above average kW cost without special rates taken into account.
Errrr, C63S owner here..... yeah, they 'can' be good on MPG on a run, but seriously anything remotely enthusiastic and you will struggle to break 24MPG and around town its pretty disastrous. Its impressive for a 500BHP engine, but seriously its a stuffing fortune in fuel!Mercedes C63 - 470bhp - 1800KG - 24mpg = 20p per mile @ £106.9 per litre
Model 3 P - 480bhp - 1800kg - 275 mile range from 75kWh battery - 3.66 miles per Kw = 4p per mile @ 15p per kW.
Over 12k miles per that's a saving of £2400 - £480 = £1920 or an 80% difference.
And those figures are based on being kind to the C63 on mpg, current cheap UK fuel costs and an above average kW cost without special rates taken into account.
They do make a lovely noise though.
ETA - Just seen where you are based. Not tempted to try an M3P?
Edited by SWoll on Friday 14th August 20:10
aestetix1 said:
What poor b
d needs a 500 mile range car? That implies they are doing 500 mile trips regularly and/or can't afford to take 20 minute breaks on that 10 hour journey.
Or maybe they can't charge at home or work and are forced to pay €€€ for a huge battery and public charging.
250 miles seems to be the sweet spot for price and range.
Having a car with a long range is a benefit and has to be seen as a welcome feature, a 250 mile range would be seen as woeful in an ICE car so why you think it should be seen as the sweet spot in an EV is bizarre.d needs a 500 mile range car? That implies they are doing 500 mile trips regularly and/or can't afford to take 20 minute breaks on that 10 hour journey.Or maybe they can't charge at home or work and are forced to pay €€€ for a huge battery and public charging.
250 miles seems to be the sweet spot for price and range.
I loved the range of my 7 series 700 miles on a tank I didn't feel like a poor b
d wafting along in that, my M5 had a sub 400 mile range and that grated on long journeys. I love the silly suggestion about not being able to "afford" to stop for 20 minutes....pure comedy, well done.
Wills2 said:
aestetix1 said:
What poor bd needs a 500 mile range car? That implies they are doing 500 mile trips regularly and/or can't afford to take 20 minute breaks on that 10 hour journey.
Or maybe they can't charge at home or work and are forced to pay €€€ for a huge battery and public charging.
250 miles seems to be the sweet spot for price and range.
Having a car with a long range is a benefit and has to be seen as a welcome feature, a 250 mile range would be seen as woeful in an ICE car so why you think it should be seen as the sweet spot in an EV is bizarre.d needs a 500 mile range car? That implies they are doing 500 mile trips regularly and/or can't afford to take 20 minute breaks on that 10 hour journey.Or maybe they can't charge at home or work and are forced to pay €€€ for a huge battery and public charging.
250 miles seems to be the sweet spot for price and range.
I loved the range of my 7 series 700 miles on a tank I didn't feel like a poor b
d wafting along in that, my M5 had a sub 400 mile range and that grated on long journeys. I love the silly suggestion about not being able to "afford" to stop for 20 minutes....pure comedy, well done.
I'll normally stop every 200-250 miles or 3-4 hours of driving for a leg stretch/drink/pee and don't think that is unusual + probably a good idea from a safety perspective?
SWoll said:
I'll normally stop every 200-250 miles or 3-4 hours of driving for a leg stretch/drink/pee and don't think that is unusual + probably a good idea from a safety perspective?
Not sure how you even manage to spend that amount of time in a car non stop. We did our first long trip since lock down, travelling at the speed limit, all of us couldn't wait to get out at the end. If my daughter hadn't slept for the first 90 minutes I recon we would have had to stop half way for everyone's sanity!The thought of driving 500 miles non stop is utterly insane.
aestetix1 said:
Tesla start throttling DC charging speeds around 2250kWh so your battery is nearly half way to being worn out. You should probably try to limit the amount of DC charging you do, including on CCS and CHAdeMO because it all counts towards the total.
I hardly ever DC supercharge, 6% of trips in 36k so far, I doubt we'll see significant throttling on our car till we hit near 100k as its a gradual drop and not a sudden drop. By the time I see significant drop in DC Supercharging rates I'll be looking to swap cars.Edited by gangzoom on Friday 14th August 22:55
ZesPak said:
Do you have source on that?
Its been known about and confirmed by Tesla for a few years now. Every single battery pack made by Tesla is effected, 60,70,75,85,90,100 and the current SR/LR Model 3 packs. https://youtu.be/Qbl74bL0zGQ
gangzoom said:
SWoll said:
I'll normally stop every 200-250 miles or 3-4 hours of driving for a leg stretch/drink/pee and don't think that is unusual + probably a good idea from a safety perspective?
Not sure how you even manage to spend that amount of time in a car non stop. We did our first long trip since lock down, travelling at the speed limit, all of us couldn't wait to get out at the end. If my daughter hadn't slept for the first 90 minutes I recon we would have had to stop half way for everyone's sanity!The thought of driving 500 miles non stop is utterly insane.
[Img]https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50226197128_8f75aed618_k_d.jpg[/thumb]
Yorkshire for a 3 day weekend and work in London for 4 days.
Drive down at night with an audio book or podcast and it flew by with cruise and the gizmos. If I stopped I would be angry with myself as no matter how quick you pee it always added a good 20 mins to the journey. That makes the difference between getting into bed for 11:30 or midnight if you stopped twice.
Journey back up would Unfortunately include Toilet stops, but was always a 4-5 hour journey anyway.
If the conditions are right and you drive it regularly 250 miles non stop is not a chore. Granted that’s not with children.
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