Tesla and Uber Unlikely to Survive...
Discussion
RobDickinson said:
could be a 6 year old model s, who knows. yes they can burn, so far statistically far less than ice cars.
f
king pointless bks, car fires shouldnt make the news,.
Well, I’ve looked but can’t find those stats. f
king pointless bks, car fires shouldnt make the news,.Whatever, you’d expect a battery car to be less of a risk than something dragging round several litres of flammable fuel I guess.
REALIST123 said:
RobDickinson said:
could be a 6 year old model s, who knows. yes they can burn, so far statistically far less than ice cars.
fking pointless bks, car fires shouldnt make the news,.
Well, I’ve looked but can’t find those stats. f
king pointless bks, car fires shouldnt make the news,.Whatever, you’d expect a battery car to be less of a risk than something dragging round several litres of flammable fuel I guess.
https://insideevs.com/number-of-fire-related-death...
REALIST123 said:
Well, I’ve looked but can’t find those stats.
Whatever, you’d expect a battery car to be less of a risk than something dragging round several litres of flammable fuel I guess.
Kind of ish depending on many circumstances.Whatever, you’d expect a battery car to be less of a risk than something dragging round several litres of flammable fuel I guess.
Petrol needs two things. Air and a spark (or high temperatures). You can control these 2 reasonably easy and only introduce when you need to.
Lithium batteries need a few things to go hay wire. Overcharging, rapid discharge (short circuit) and heat (thermal runaway).
It's not hard to do any of the lithium three simply, but it is hard to do them with extreme high safety factors and reliability.
RobDickinson said:
Hardly relevant. The Tesla had been around about 2 years then, was it compared with only two year old ice cars?Even then, that article seems to imply the Tesla was far worse than other brands of EV.
Evanivitch said:
REALIST123 said:
Well, I’ve looked but can’t find those stats.
Whatever, you’d expect a battery car to be less of a risk than something dragging round several litres of flammable fuel I guess.
Kind of ish depending on many circumstances.Whatever, you’d expect a battery car to be less of a risk than something dragging round several litres of flammable fuel I guess.
Petrol needs two things. Air and a spark (or high temperatures). You can control these 2 reasonably easy and only introduce when you need to.
Lithium batteries need a few things to go hay wire. Overcharging, rapid discharge (short circuit) and heat (thermal runaway).
It's not hard to do any of the lithium three simply, but it is hard to do them with extreme high safety factors and reliability.
REALIST123 said:
Evanivitch said:
REALIST123 said:
Well, I’ve looked but can’t find those stats.
Whatever, you’d expect a battery car to be less of a risk than something dragging round several litres of flammable fuel I guess.
Kind of ish depending on many circumstances.Whatever, you’d expect a battery car to be less of a risk than something dragging round several litres of flammable fuel I guess.
Petrol needs two things. Air and a spark (or high temperatures). You can control these 2 reasonably easy and only introduce when you need to.
Lithium batteries need a few things to go hay wire. Overcharging, rapid discharge (short circuit) and heat (thermal runaway).
It's not hard to do any of the lithium three simply, but it is hard to do them with extreme high safety factors and reliability.
An example. If I wanted to stop a lithium cell having thermal runaway I could bond a thermal fuse to it that triggers at 100C. Easy.
But, everyone that cell approaches that 100C it will age the thermal fuse, eventually causing it to fail before it gets to 100C and breaking the circuit. You'd then have to replace the cell, which is a big job in a large battery.
So you have simple solutions, but they're not practical long-term and reliable solutions.
An interesting read, esp on the short situation.
https://m.dailykos.com/stories/2018/5/29/1767826/-...
https://m.dailykos.com/stories/2018/5/29/1767826/-...
RobDickinson said:
An interesting read, esp on the short situation.
https://m.dailykos.com/stories/2018/5/29/1767826/-...
And this man, apart from having a huge hard on for Musk, is ?https://m.dailykos.com/stories/2018/5/29/1767826/-...
Mr2Mike said:
RobDickinson said:
Shorting stock is an open book on hurt.
If is always hurts, why do people do it?Tesla shares having a good day so far, $369.77 just now
All time high is a touch under $390
I think there is a chance of $400 being touched soon (but won’t be surprised to be wrong)
Some short sellers must be twitching a bit in the vicinity of the ringpiece
Car maker shares going up on news that one of its cars has set on fire is, I reckon, bullish behaviour
All time high is a touch under $390
I think there is a chance of $400 being touched soon (but won’t be surprised to be wrong)
Some short sellers must be twitching a bit in the vicinity of the ringpiece
Car maker shares going up on news that one of its cars has set on fire is, I reckon, bullish behaviour
How going long works.. Aka boring usual investment.
You buy a share at say 300, hope it increases in value, if it does you can sell at a profit. Sometimes you get dividends.
Max possible to gain unlimited.
Max possible to loose is 300.
How going short works. Aka betting on failure.
Someone else buys a share. Share price gets to 300.
They loan you their share for an interest payment, say 10 percent pa.
You sell that share for 300, put that in a bank or whatever.
At some future point you have to buy a share back to return to the original owner. You hope the share price has fallen.
Max to gain is 300
Max to loose is ~unlimited.
Now when you short stock you need to keep funds on hand with the broker to cover your position. So unlimited really just means whatever funds you have allocated. Once you reach this limit the broker automatically buys a share back and hands it over to the original owner.
If this happens at 600 you've lost 300 plus interest. Plus this adds demand and pushes up the price of the stock.
As the price goes up this forces more shorts to bail, putting more upward pressure on the price.
For Tesla about a third of the liquid stock in the market is shorted, 12bn worth. So when this happens you will see a short squeeze that pushes out more and more short sellers, because that much stock buying pushes the price up a lot.
Every 20 on tsla is another billion lost by the shorts...
The short seller isn't an investor, doesn't own any stock.
What's the shorts reasoning? We'll up until last month it was Tesla wouldn't be able to make enough model 3s to meet demand and be profitable.
This month that's changed. Now they can make enough cars but there's no demand.
Really... Apparently. Once the order book is complete no one else will want a model 3.. fkwits.
Tesla seem to be able to sell S and X without a problem the 3 will sell just fine. Plus the short situation will be screwed before Tesla run out of current m3 orders anyhow.
You buy a share at say 300, hope it increases in value, if it does you can sell at a profit. Sometimes you get dividends.
Max possible to gain unlimited.
Max possible to loose is 300.
How going short works. Aka betting on failure.
Someone else buys a share. Share price gets to 300.
They loan you their share for an interest payment, say 10 percent pa.
You sell that share for 300, put that in a bank or whatever.
At some future point you have to buy a share back to return to the original owner. You hope the share price has fallen.
Max to gain is 300
Max to loose is ~unlimited.
Now when you short stock you need to keep funds on hand with the broker to cover your position. So unlimited really just means whatever funds you have allocated. Once you reach this limit the broker automatically buys a share back and hands it over to the original owner.
If this happens at 600 you've lost 300 plus interest. Plus this adds demand and pushes up the price of the stock.
As the price goes up this forces more shorts to bail, putting more upward pressure on the price.
For Tesla about a third of the liquid stock in the market is shorted, 12bn worth. So when this happens you will see a short squeeze that pushes out more and more short sellers, because that much stock buying pushes the price up a lot.
Every 20 on tsla is another billion lost by the shorts...
The short seller isn't an investor, doesn't own any stock.
What's the shorts reasoning? We'll up until last month it was Tesla wouldn't be able to make enough model 3s to meet demand and be profitable.
This month that's changed. Now they can make enough cars but there's no demand.
Really... Apparently. Once the order book is complete no one else will want a model 3.. f
kwits. Tesla seem to be able to sell S and X without a problem the 3 will sell just fine. Plus the short situation will be screwed before Tesla run out of current m3 orders anyhow.
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