Tesla and Uber Unlikely to Survive (Vol. 2)

[gangzoom]

ZesPak said:

Sad state that they had to be told to do so though.

Try owing any BMW .

Tesla should just get on with it and replace the memory chips though, I believe they can now even tell which chips are about to fail through a software test.

[Heres Johnny]

Burwood said:

I always check. I wouldn't buy anything that wasn't 5 star sage.

You’d be doing well to find a car for sale in Europe that costs £40k+ and doesn’t have a 5 star NCAP score, that’s why few are bothered over here, tends to only really be a factor on smaller and city cars.

I think only the Honda e and the Ampera misses it on EVs at any price getting only a 4 star rating. Just looked, i3 gets a 4 star due to moderate severe side impact with a pole and whiplash

I can understand why some Americans are bothered, the worst cars for sale are things like the Ford mustang so I imagine the cars available in their market are much more mixed.

NCAP criteria drive design, let’s hope they don’t start looking for ease of access when it comes to turning on fog lights, accessing the e-call system or ease of exit in the event of total electrical failure, or added adaptive headlights and windscreen wiper performance to the criteria. Like every system of measurement there are criteria that you value more than others, and there are things you value that are not in the criteria, Tesla would score badly on those example areas if they were included.

Edited by Heres Johnny on Saturday 16th January 09:31

[Mikehig]

Here's Johnny: according to this report there is rising awareness of the problem of drivers taking their eyes off the road to fiddle with stuff on screens:
https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/industry-news/a...

[Heres Johnny]

Mikehig said:

Here's Johnny: according to this report there is rising awareness of the problem of drivers taking their eyes off the road to fiddle with stuff on screens:
https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/industry-news/a...

Interesting and not really surprising. Mobile phones had issues, not all of them to do with the screen, but they decided to ban the hand held use of them.

As technology evolve, the testing criteria has to adjust. NCAP introduced new tests for driver assistance and included a healthy dose of the usability and driver engagement characteristics (which the Tesla folk don't like as Tesla doesn't score well on that particular criteria even though they get some of the best scores in other areas). These things are a balance. I can see that being extended to other aspects. I hope it doesn't become silly and every software update that changes the layout renders the NCAP tests obsolete, but equally Tesla reducing the size of the speedo has upset lots of drivers and possibly made it harder to see quickly.

.

[hyphen]

First EV M car announced...

https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...

Bmw must have something up its sleeve to use the M badge on it.

[ZesPak]

hyphen said:

Bmw must have something up its sleeve to use the M badge on it.

That's optimistic. The X6M exists.

[JD]

hyphen said:

First EV M car announced...

https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...

Bmw must have something up its sleeve to use the M badge on it.

Yes they are normally so conservative with the use of M badges aren’t they.

[NDNDNDND]

https://jalopnik.com/tesla-is-here-to-stay-1846099...

I guess it's time to admit you really can make a dodgy company survive on pure bullst and fanboyism!

[ZesPak]

NDNDNDND said:

https://jalopnik.com/tesla-is-here-to-stay-1846099...

I guess it's time to admit you really can make a dodgy company survive on pure bullst and fanboyism!

Jalopnik Article said:

Still others will tweet about how much they personally hate Elon, because they are emotionally feeble.

So I'm guessing you're in this category then?

[jjwilde]

NDNDNDND said:

https://jalopnik.com/tesla-is-here-to-stay-1846099...

I guess it's time to admit you really can make a dodgy company survive on pure bullst and fanboyism!

I know right, all those awards their cars have won were just fiction! Their wild unprecedented success is just make believe!

Everyone who said they bought one is a paid actor! The factories are EMPTY! I have the videos!

[NDNDNDND]

ZesPak said:

NDNDNDND said:

https://jalopnik.com/tesla-is-here-to-stay-1846099...

I guess it's time to admit you really can make a dodgy company survive on pure bullst and fanboyism!

Jalopnik Article said:

Still others will tweet about how much they personally hate Elon, because they are emotionally feeble.

So I'm guessing you're in this category then?

Only as much as you're in this category:

https://jalopnik.com/in-case-you-needed-a-reminder...

[NDNDNDND]

jjwilde said:

NDNDNDND said:

https://jalopnik.com/tesla-is-here-to-stay-1846099...

I guess it's time to admit you really can make a dodgy company survive on pure bullst and fanboyism!

I know right, all those awards their cars have won were just fiction! Their wild unprecedented success is just make believe!

Everyone who said they bought one is a paid actor! The factories are EMPTY! I have the videos!

If only I could pick from one of the many, appropriate 'triggered' gifs available!

[hyphen]

Tesla is here to stay. But stay as what is the question...

Indications are that within 5 years, both its battery tech will have been overtaken, and that it will find competitors cars will match if not exceed.

And with Microsoft pumping money into multiple autonomous car projects, plus apple, waymo and others it's not a sure bet that Tesla will win that race either.

It does though have a sizeable r&d budget, so if do manage to make a breakthrough then it will be another story.

[ZesPak]

hyphen said:

Indications are that within 5 years, both its battery tech will have been overtaken, and that it will find competitors cars will match if not exceed.

Indications are that within 20 years we'll have fusion energy and hydrogen everything.

[JD]

JD said:

hyphen said:

VW and VAG seem to be doing fine? E-tron has had strong sales, Porsche with the Taycan diminished Tesla's claim to be way ahead in performance, and the MEB platform is going to be churning out EVs across all their brands, and for their partners (e.g. Ford).

When you say doing fine; they are already paying MG to pool credits, and I would expect to see an announcement of fines for missing the 2020 emissions targets pretty soon.

Of course the E-tron sells well, they were basically giving them away earlier in the year!

Constantly in this thread it’s oh Tesla won’t survive because VW is going to come eat their market. The new market IS EV, every car needs to be an EV, Tesla are already in the new market and the traditional manufacturers have to balance their losing of the old market.

Much to finance expert Burwood’a analysis below, VW are never going to make as much money on the ID3 but they will make tons on an 1.5l T-cross R-line so that is what they will do until they can’t.

As expected:

https://www.ft.com/content/22514024-554b-482b-bc4f...

[anonymous-user]

ZesPak said:

hyphen said:

Indications are that within 5 years, both its battery tech will have been overtaken, and that it will find competitors cars will match if not exceed.

Indications are that within 20 years we'll have fusion energy and hydrogen everything.

They were saying that when i was studying A-Level Physics in 1983.

Hydrogen has great potential, especially in commercial scale applications. Fusion, i don't see that in my lifetime, I would love to be wrong.

[ZesPak]

jsf said:

They were saying that when i was studying A-Level Physics in 1983.

I'm aware, it was a response to:

hyphen said:

Indications are that within 5 years, both its battery tech will have been overtaken, and that it will find competitors cars will match if not exceed.

Which is something they've been saying for over a decade now .

[hyphen]

ZesPak said:

Which is something they've been saying for over a decade now .

The richest countries in the world didn't set bans on ICE cars a decade a go. They set it recently.

And as such, it is now a race. Europe is co-ordinating at the EU level, China State is backing/owningsome of their key players.

New deep pocketed players are entering by the day. e.g. this week SAIC (China's largest car maker and partner of GM, Toyota and Honda) teamed up with Alibaba, to create a new luxury ev brand. CATL have been brought in for batteries and been directed to create a 'silicon-doped lithium supplement battery cell'. GAC are experimenting with putting Graphene into batteries etc

https://www.electrive.com/2021/01/15/saic-alibaba-...

The chinese are also thinking of new approaches, e.g.

Nio said:

“Battery cost will make our cars more expensive than the ICE competitors, but we want to promote our battery-as-a-service (BaaS) model to make the cars more attractive.”

The BaaS business model allows customers to buy an electric car while subscribing to a separate battery-leasing plan for a fee to help lower the upfront cost of owning an electric car by about 20 per cent.

Edited by hyphen on Thursday 21st January 20:14

[hyphen]

JD said:

As expected:

https://www.ft.com/content/22514024-554b-482b-bc4f...

The fine is 'only' 100m EUR or so. Small change...


https://www.businesslive.co.za/bd/companies/indust...

[jamoor]

hyphen said:

Edited by hyphen on Thursday 21st January 20:14

It's literally the Smartphone market mk2.

It's uncannily similar.