EVs and Motorways
Discussion
I'm a massive EV convert. But also a realist.
If you have an EV and drive at 70+ mph, might as well knock at least a quarter off whatever range you normally achieve.
If you have to use motorways often and for varied routes that exceed the range you have, I'd say buy a diesel.
If you have to use motorways often but for the same trips, I'd say find a routine that works charging the EV and enjoy the overall benefits of EV.
Luckily no one is being asked to abandon ICE anytime soon so there's at least another decade of charger network and EV improvements. A couple of those improvements could be major game changers and remove any practical reasons for 99% to not have an EV. I suspect currently about 80% could get on just fine with one, however probably more like 30% have come to appreciate how it could work for them, the rest simply aren't interested or keen.
If you have an EV and drive at 70+ mph, might as well knock at least a quarter off whatever range you normally achieve.
If you have to use motorways often and for varied routes that exceed the range you have, I'd say buy a diesel.
If you have to use motorways often but for the same trips, I'd say find a routine that works charging the EV and enjoy the overall benefits of EV.
Luckily no one is being asked to abandon ICE anytime soon so there's at least another decade of charger network and EV improvements. A couple of those improvements could be major game changers and remove any practical reasons for 99% to not have an EV. I suspect currently about 80% could get on just fine with one, however probably more like 30% have come to appreciate how it could work for them, the rest simply aren't interested or keen.
DMZ said:
I’m sure you could find a routine to make it work too if needs be. Mentally set aside 30 mins or whatever and find a good solid charger array that’s usually available. Spend that 30 mins catching up on stuff.
Absolutely. You don't need to look far to see that humans can and will adapt to any environment of there is the will or need but we also have an overwhelming preference for the simpler solution. DonkeyApple said:
DMZ said:
I’m sure you could find a routine to make it work too if needs be. Mentally set aside 30 mins or whatever and find a good solid charger array that’s usually available. Spend that 30 mins catching up on stuff.
Absolutely. You don't need to look far to see that humans can and will adapt to any environment of there is the will or need but we also have an overwhelming preference for the simpler solution. SWoll said:
The issue being that for the vast majority of the time Ev's are the simpler solution. Charge at home, remote heating/cooling, simple maintenance, no gearbox etc. Literally the only time they aren't is when travelling beyond the maximum range.
Completely agree. This thread is just about the anomalous scenario of someone having to drive those distances on a seemingly daily basis. It's not the typical thread of 'EV's are bad because for some reason I suddenly care about little African children I've previously been happy to exploit so I can get my mits on some tat from Dunelm'The fundamental problem EVs have is that they started expensive. If they'd started cheap then half of the loons who froth against them would have one and be rabid fans while half of the loons who think they are their Messiah wouldn't go near them because they're cheap and strangers might think they're not successful men of means who care deeply about important issues.
DMZ said:
It doesn’t appear to be a fundamental problem for manufacturers seeing as they’re all posting their best results ever on falling sales. One would guess they will not be too keen to return to the old ways.
I've not seen any figures but if this is the case then one may guess that the shortage of supply has meant no need to discount as effectively there is no actual competitive market place currently post Covid. While on the other side a lot of the furlough cash will be flooding into cars. But arguably there are lean years ahead as rising fuel inflation will remove spending power from consumers and should interest rates go high enough to trip society out of its 25 year shopping binge where an entire society genuinely believes that the way to save money is to spend more money then I'm not sure we'll see any new records for annual car sales. Plus, WFH along with the household squeeze may lead to an overall reduction in how many cars a household needs or wants and when the chip shortage finally ends then manufacturers will be slitting their throats to get consumer volumes back from each other.
Regardless, I suspect that recent political events will massively spike EV purchases over the next year or two as anyone coming off a lease and who has the means to self charge and a usage pattern that isn't inconvenient will almost certainly consider an EV and given how British shoppers just go where directed then we can expect a very large number to go EV now there's a reasonable choice at a reasonable price in the market place.
Like solar which is going to see millions of retired idiots thinking borrowing £10k at junk rates so as to, in 8 years time (5 years after they have died) start saving £1 on a utility bill.
SWoll said:
The issue being that for the vast majority of the time Ev's are the simpler solution. Charge at home, remote heating/cooling, simple maintenance, no gearbox etc. Literally the only time they aren't is when travelling beyond the maximum range.
Being pedantic (or just to make it clear what that means), it’s travelling beyond half the maximum range from home, and realistically it’s 40% of the max range to give a safety buffer. The difference between 250 miles and 125 miles is quite significant in that respect. That’s pretty much London to Bristol, London to Birmingham, Liverpool to Sheffield, in fact most of our big cities are 100 miles or so apart, so travel from any one to another and back and you’re getting close to being on the edge and hoping for no issues on route.Arguably the big step forward as far as the U.K. is concerned, being a small, affluent island, may be the arrival of commercially viable solid state batteries before the end of the decade. On paper the solution is looking to give a 30% improvement on energy density over current battery tech. Just that relatively modest increase would tip personal EVs over the line to being easily usable for almost every car owner.
It does seem eminently plausible that by 2035 your typical family sized, allrounder EV will probably have become more price competitive than it's ICE counterpart in initial cost but with a range that caters for the most anomalous of journeys and uses.
It does seem eminently plausible that by 2035 your typical family sized, allrounder EV will probably have become more price competitive than it's ICE counterpart in initial cost but with a range that caters for the most anomalous of journeys and uses.
DonkeyApple said:
I've not seen any figures but if this is the case then one may guess that the shortage of supply has meant no need to discount as effectively there is no actual competitive market place currently post Covid. While on the other side a lot of the furlough cash will be flooding into cars.
But arguably there are lean years ahead as rising fuel inflation will remove spending power from consumers and should interest rates go high enough to trip society out of its 25 year shopping binge where an entire society genuinely believes that the way to save money is to spend more money then I'm not sure we'll see any new records for annual car sales. Plus, WFH along with the household squeeze may lead to an overall reduction in how many cars a household needs or wants and when the chip shortage finally ends then manufacturers will be slitting their throats to get consumer volumes back from each other.
Regardless, I suspect that recent political events will massively spike EV purchases over the next year or two as anyone coming off a lease and who has the means to self charge and a usage pattern that isn't inconvenient will almost certainly consider an EV and given how British shoppers just go where directed then we can expect a very large number to go EV now there's a reasonable choice at a reasonable price in the market place.
Like solar which is going to see millions of retired idiots thinking borrowing £10k at junk rates so as to, in 8 years time (5 years after they have died) start saving £1 on a utility bill.
I’m sure lack of discounts is one part but cars are much more expensive to buy now, particularly EVs. With EVs in particular car manufacturers are in effect getting a slice of the fuel savings which they never have before so they are taking a greater wallet share than before. Plus there is of course very little pressure on margins when governments are tax subsidising their products. And then there are nice finance packages to wrap all of this. And then they have found that blaming semi conductors and having 1y waiting lists is very profitable. I find it hard to believe that an industry that has solved over supply and low margins will suddenly return to the old ways. But arguably there are lean years ahead as rising fuel inflation will remove spending power from consumers and should interest rates go high enough to trip society out of its 25 year shopping binge where an entire society genuinely believes that the way to save money is to spend more money then I'm not sure we'll see any new records for annual car sales. Plus, WFH along with the household squeeze may lead to an overall reduction in how many cars a household needs or wants and when the chip shortage finally ends then manufacturers will be slitting their throats to get consumer volumes back from each other.
Regardless, I suspect that recent political events will massively spike EV purchases over the next year or two as anyone coming off a lease and who has the means to self charge and a usage pattern that isn't inconvenient will almost certainly consider an EV and given how British shoppers just go where directed then we can expect a very large number to go EV now there's a reasonable choice at a reasonable price in the market place.
Like solar which is going to see millions of retired idiots thinking borrowing £10k at junk rates so as to, in 8 years time (5 years after they have died) start saving £1 on a utility bill.
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