I'm a dinosaur - educate/change my mind
Discussion
Fastdruid said:
You'd think that but it turns out that EV's are **less** reliable and have more time at the garage before being repaired.
...but a large chunk of those are software issues.
Which is where the "respected" brands fall down (same to be fair as they do normally). The more expensive the vehicle is the *MORE* likely you are to have issues.
Do you have data to validate your first statement? My ICE has needed more repair work than my wife's EV. ...but a large chunk of those are software issues.
Which is where the "respected" brands fall down (same to be fair as they do normally). The more expensive the vehicle is the *MORE* likely you are to have issues.
McAndy said:
Fastdruid said:
You'd think that but it turns out that EV's are **less** reliable and have more time at the garage before being repaired.
...but a large chunk of those are software issues.
Which is where the "respected" brands fall down (same to be fair as they do normally). The more expensive the vehicle is the *MORE* likely you are to have issues.
Do you have data to validate your first statement? My ICE has needed more repair work than my wife's EV. ...but a large chunk of those are software issues.
Which is where the "respected" brands fall down (same to be fair as they do normally). The more expensive the vehicle is the *MORE* likely you are to have issues.
All that said, take out Tesla (customers seem to be used as beta-testers) and Jaguar (never the most reliable) and I reckon EVs would be seen as super-reliable. Kia, Hyundai & Nissan certainly seem to have the hang of it, though Renault aren't that great.
Personal experience is that my Nissan Leaf has been - literally - faultless since I've had it. A sample of 1 tells nothing, but I'm certainly very happy with my choice.
McAndy said:
Fastdruid said:
You'd think that but it turns out that EV's are **less** reliable and have more time at the garage before being repaired.
...but a large chunk of those are software issues.
Which is where the "respected" brands fall down (same to be fair as they do normally). The more expensive the vehicle is the *MORE* likely you are to have issues.
Do you have data to validate your first statement? My ICE has needed more repair work than my wife's EV. ...but a large chunk of those are software issues.
Which is where the "respected" brands fall down (same to be fair as they do normally). The more expensive the vehicle is the *MORE* likely you are to have issues.
ks.longblackcoat said:
He's correct - Which? suggests that 31% of EVs aged 0-4 in their survey had one fault or more in the last year compared with 19% for petrol. Other surveys are available, obviously.
All that said, take out Tesla (customers seem to be used as beta-testers) and Jaguar (never the most reliable) and I reckon EVs would be seen as super-reliable. Kia, Hyundai & Nissan certainly seem to have the hang of it, though Renault aren't that great.
Personal experience is that my Nissan Leaf has been - literally - faultless since I've had it. A sample of 1 tells nothing, but I'm certainly very happy with my choice.
Thank you. It'd be interesting to see how Kia's Niro range breaks-down by, erm, breakdowns(!) per powertrain. There are enough models now that have two or three powertrains within one model to get a clear picture of reliability that filters out non-powertrain failures.All that said, take out Tesla (customers seem to be used as beta-testers) and Jaguar (never the most reliable) and I reckon EVs would be seen as super-reliable. Kia, Hyundai & Nissan certainly seem to have the hang of it, though Renault aren't that great.
Personal experience is that my Nissan Leaf has been - literally - faultless since I've had it. A sample of 1 tells nothing, but I'm certainly very happy with my choice.
Delboy_trotter said:
No not implying electric should be free at all, what I'm highlighting is a mindset and the familiarity, when the Electric message you to say your Bill is going up £15 a month, folks get upset, but are comfortable with the concept of going to a fuel pump and filling a car up, and as a dyed in the wool petrolhead, this is where my head is, I moan about a tank of fuel going up, but accept it as its a process and concept I'm very familiar and comfortable with, however to charge a car at home and have the electric bill go up by an arbitrary £60 a month makes me wince
This thread has ended up in the weird situation where other people are trying harder to explain the basics to you than you seem to be trying to understand.You've been told ways to calculate your future electricity usage, you've been told what kit is required to give you a clear and easy to read breakdown and it's been pointed out to you that none of it is worth worrying about anyway because it will definitely be cheaper than fuel for your ICE.
What more do you want from us!?
Delboy_trotter said:
I'm a dinosaur - educate/change my mind
No, you're not a dinosaur.I have (sort of) worked out one of the reasons I am happy with my Tesla (and two V8's I rarely use) and it's because I am now 60 and have had a whole lot of V8's and V12's in my life. Loved them. Been there, done that. And in a major way.
For those that haven't had enough ICE, I can totally understand why they'd want to go on a bit longer - and so you should.
EV's are more 'appliance' than car and if they suit your use case, they're excellent. Comically cheap to run (not that I ever worried before) and, in my case, more reliable than any Lamborghini, Bentley or Aston I've owned before. My Morgan (for example) has had more MOT fails than passes and it hasn't done 20,000 miles yet. I have 4 mates with Model 3's and they have also been totally reliable.... I am doing around 17,000 miles a year in mine.
Enjoy your ICE cars, you're not a dinosaur.
TheDeuce said:
This thread has ended up in the weird situation where other people are trying harder to explain the basics to you than you seem to be trying to understand.
You've been told ways to calculate your future electricity usage, you've been told what kit is required to give you a clear and easy to read breakdown and it's been pointed out to you that none of it is worth worrying about anyway because it will definitely be cheaper than fuel for your ICE.
What more do you want from us!?
TBH nothing - I've been reading and inwardly digesting said information to enable me to carry on my research in a more enlightened fashion, understanding how it works etc, I'm in no rush, and if I'm honest i didn't realise it was such an emotive subjectYou've been told ways to calculate your future electricity usage, you've been told what kit is required to give you a clear and easy to read breakdown and it's been pointed out to you that none of it is worth worrying about anyway because it will definitely be cheaper than fuel for your ICE.
What more do you want from us!?
Edited by Delboy_trotter on Friday 4th March 15:53
Max_Torque said:
As an engineer if you can't work out the cost of your EV, god help us all:
1) go look at your electricity bill, and see how much you are paying for a kWh of lecy;
2) Divide that number by 3, that's how much you pay per mile
3) multiply that by your weekly, monthly, or yearly driven distance.
Here is an example
1) i pay 12 pence per kwh
2) 12 divided by 3 is 4 pence (EVs do about 3 ml/kWh)
3) i drive 100 miles a week, so 4pence per mile x 100 miles is £4 a week in lecy
Really not either hard or "worrying" in any way to work out
Not disagreeing with you at all - just a reality check - wholesale price of electricity for April is 37p/kwh for the commodity + 10p grid charges and green taxes - before any supplier margin.1) go look at your electricity bill, and see how much you are paying for a kWh of lecy;
2) Divide that number by 3, that's how much you pay per mile
3) multiply that by your weekly, monthly, or yearly driven distance.
Here is an example
1) i pay 12 pence per kwh
2) 12 divided by 3 is 4 pence (EVs do about 3 ml/kWh)
3) i drive 100 miles a week, so 4pence per mile x 100 miles is £4 a week in lecy
Really not either hard or "worrying" in any way to work out
Once the current deals expire we are all in for a nasty shock.
JonnyVTEC said:
Volvolover said:
I am aware of all of it, i was merely critiquing the scenario presented to me by the poster i quoted........why the fk he'd want to pop out in his pajamas every night at bed time is beyond me and way more of a pain in the ass than my one visit a fortnight to a pump (to me)
As i said it will be different for different people. The usual BEVtards are doing their usual thing and forcing it down our throats that its perfect for everybody and anyone who says different is wrong because they cant see further than the end of their nose.
For my lifestyle currently a BEV car as my primary would be a royal pain in the ass. That's a fact, and until the charging infrastructure is way better it will remain so.
The usual BEV tards have had both, you haven’t. Yet you are the one discrediting the other views?k he'd want to pop out in his pajamas every night at bed time is beyond me and way more of a pain in the ass than my one visit a fortnight to a pump (to me) As i said it will be different for different people. The usual BEVtards are doing their usual thing and forcing it down our throats that its perfect for everybody and anyone who says different is wrong because they cant see further than the end of their nose.
For my lifestyle currently a BEV car as my primary would be a royal pain in the ass. That's a fact, and until the charging infrastructure is way better it will remain so.
Bizarre.
TX.
coetzeeh said:
Max_Torque said:
As an engineer if you can't work out the cost of your EV, god help us all:
1) go look at your electricity bill, and see how much you are paying for a kWh of lecy;
2) Divide that number by 3, that's how much you pay per mile
3) multiply that by your weekly, monthly, or yearly driven distance.
Here is an example
1) i pay 12 pence per kwh
2) 12 divided by 3 is 4 pence (EVs do about 3 ml/kWh)
3) i drive 100 miles a week, so 4pence per mile x 100 miles is £4 a week in lecy
Really not either hard or "worrying" in any way to work out
Not disagreeing with you at all - just a reality check - wholesale price of electricity for April is 37p/kwh for the commodity + 10p grid charges and green taxes - before any supplier margin.1) go look at your electricity bill, and see how much you are paying for a kWh of lecy;
2) Divide that number by 3, that's how much you pay per mile
3) multiply that by your weekly, monthly, or yearly driven distance.
Here is an example
1) i pay 12 pence per kwh
2) 12 divided by 3 is 4 pence (EVs do about 3 ml/kWh)
3) i drive 100 miles a week, so 4pence per mile x 100 miles is £4 a week in lecy
Really not either hard or "worrying" in any way to work out
Once the current deals expire we are all in for a nasty shock.
And yes, 'lecy costs are going up for sure, and driving any car is going to get very much more expensive (wait till the Giv introduce road charging...) which is precisely why i have had an EV for seven years! Seven years of insanely cheap motoring, which won't likely ever be repeated in my lifetime. If you are onyl now jumping on the EV bandwagon, sorry, you are too late....... ;-)
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