Secondhand car price crash? (Vol. 2)

[AceRockatansky]

Also in the market to replace our school run stbox. But, well, I'm a PH'er so it's going to be a hot hatch.

Started off looking at polo GTi's, now onto golf R's.

They seem to be moving quickly in the right spec. Put a deposit on a car through AT, but it had already sold, but that dealer has a better one coming in this week, so might get that. Fingers crossed.

And yes, noticed the same with private sellers. "Fully loaded" then look at the pics and there's loads missing. Got a mind to call and ask them.

HUD, no
Leather seats, no
HK, erm, no
Performance pack, no

... Not really fully loaded then is it...

Edited by AceRockatansky on Sunday 26th May 08:10

[alfasud1]

If there is a "bubble" to be burst, a lot of people have yet to catch on. I am unsure if the market is moving, if dealers are selling at specific points etc, however I am currently shopping for an interesting dog wagon, the caveats being auto and AWD and over 2000cc

Now I know that that this brings you into a specific area, but there is very very little sub/circa 10k and sub 100,000 miles.

Now I am fully aware I like werthers these days and a pint isnt 30p etc etc, but I will run my older shed until it dies at this rate

[defblade]

alfasud1 said:

I am currently shopping for an interesting dog wagon, the caveats being auto and AWD and over 2000cc

Now I know that that this brings you into a specific area, but there is very very little sub/circa 10k and sub 100,000 miles.

There are 15 Subaru Leggie estates within that price/miles on AT to choose from

[Deep Thought]

alfasud1 said:

If there is a "bubble" to be burst, a lot of people have yet to catch on. I am unsure if the market is moving, if dealers are selling at specific points etc, however I am currently shopping for an interesting dog wagon, the caveats being auto and AWD and over 2000cc

Now I know that that this brings you into a specific area, but there is very very little sub/circa 10k and sub 100,000 miles.

Now I am fully aware I like werthers these days and a pint isnt 30p etc etc, but I will run my older shed until it dies at this rate

I think the bubble that has been burst is the bubble of when cars were very hard to get and values were particularly high therefore people could list their car privately at dealer price / close to dealer price and get it sold.

That aspect of the market has definitely gone.

[Theoldguard]

We also had that period where people had accumulated quite a bit of money that was burning a hold during the lockdowns. Money was still cheap to borrow and existing debts were still low to service.

Inflation had started to creep up but IR did not follow, so assets were being sold at higher prices and there was still cheap money to buy them, this along side pots of savings and acute shortages fueled asset price inflation.

The mindset was advertise it even if you did not really need to sell and you never know, someone may pay it.

We have now passed the peak and it's reversing where supply is alot better so those shortages have subsided, money is no longer as cheap, existing debt is more expensive to service and money pots have dried up, with inflation falling back it's making it more difficult to justify and sell that notion that prices are rocketing so buy now before it's too late and someone else snaps it up, it's now more likely that prices will fall on second hand goods and even new goods will need discount. IR still remain elevated and likely to do so for another couple of months and when all is said and done unlikely to ever return to those ultra cheap rates of the last decade or more. But there are those who have still not got their head around this new reality and may have bought at the peak buying into the idea that prices only ever go up.

[Deep Thought]

On the note of private sellers asking dealer prices..

Private Sale - 2020 Audi TT RS, , Black Edition, blue 41,854 miles £29,950

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202404088...

Approved Used - 2020 Audi TT RS, , Black Edition, blue 41,901 miles, £29,990

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202405159...

[Summit_Detailing]

Deep Thought said:

On the note of private sellers asking dealer prices..

Private Sale - 2020 Audi TT RS, , Black Edition, blue 41,854 miles £29,950

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202404088...

Approved Used - 2020 Audi TT RS, , Black Edition, blue 41,901 miles, £29,990

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202405159...

The private seller initially advertised at 27950 on 8/4/24 and put the price up to 29950 on the same day.

The dealer car was initially advertised for 30990 on 15/5/24 and reduced to 29990 on the same day.

IMO both have a little way to fall to find a buyer, especially the private sale.

[av185]

Theoldguard said:

it's now more likely that prices will fall on second hand goods and even new goods will need discount.

And yet Porsche have just increased the price of the new (announced yesterday) gen 2 911 GTS by a rather eye watering 15% to £135k basic.

[Deep Thought]

Summit_Detailing said:

Deep Thought said:

On the note of private sellers asking dealer prices..

Private Sale - 2020 Audi TT RS, , Black Edition, blue 41,854 miles £29,950

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202404088...

Approved Used - 2020 Audi TT RS, , Black Edition, blue 41,901 miles, £29,990

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202405159...

The private seller initially advertised at 27950 on 8/4/24 and put the price up to 29950 on the same day.

The dealer car was initially advertised for 30990 on 15/5/24 and reduced to 29990 on the same day.

IMO both have a little way to fall to find a buyer, especially the private sale.

Yeah, saw that.

It was more in relation to the previous discussion here about private sellers asking retail money.

[AceRockatansky]

Bought a golf R this week. Bit of budget creep and swayed but the low mileage and warranty with wife spec. I was looking for the R performance pack and HUD, but she's going to like HK and pan roof in blue and, well it's for her at the end of the day. So she can blast her tunes out with the roof up this summer!

Pick it up Friday, 5k miles, 23 plate, 37.5k.

(And yes, if it really was just for the wife it probably wouldn't be an R )

[av185]

New 2025 model could well be around £50k new.

[Auto810graphy]

I think next week will see quite a few reductions in the retail prices of £15k + mainstream cars. CAP prices have been dropping quite hard this month and this is being reflected in trade pricing, especially auctions this week however being a bank holiday and half term did not help.

[MB140]

ACCYSTAN said:

Disagree, manufacturers have a big mark up on EVs, but that was when supply was limited and demand was healthy.

Now there are lots of EV offerings and moderate demand, and EV list price correction has been underway for the past 6 months and will continue.

When one of the new Chinese manufacturers (not including MG) sets down a proper dealer network and car support in the UK, then we will really see some competition.

I expect it will be BYD , if they are serious about the UK they could be a real force and push the other manufacturers to continue to compete on price.

Won’t the UK government, EU slap massive import taxes on them. The USA has already slapped 100% import tariffs on all Chinese EV.

I mean the government couldn’t possibly let us have something at a reasonable price (especially a car) when they can slap a st load of tax on it and bring it up to the same price as all the other EU made cars.

[Sheepshanks]

MB140 said:

Won’t the UK government, EU slap massive import taxes on them. The USA has already slapped 100% import tariffs on all Chinese EV.

I mean the government couldn’t possibly let us have something at a reasonable price (especially a car) when they can slap a st load of tax on it and bring it up to the same price as all the other EU made cars.

Tariffs probably won’t make much difference - EVs in China can cost $10K but they don’t sell them for that here. They’ll continue to sell them for just under the cost of the locally produced competitors.

[Barrie c 66]

Are electric vans a hard sell at the moment ? A Vivaro, Expert etc would suit my needs perfectly as I only do about 4,000 miles a year and have solar panels and a charger. Generally work in about a 5 mile radius, occasionally go about 25 miles. The difference between asking prices and WBAC is massive. Every one I've put in they have come back about half the asking price.

[Theoldguard]

Hard to look beyond some of the used EVs at the 2-3 year point in terms of value, at the 4-5 year point they are only circa 15% less depending on make / model and price bracket, making them a decent option for 2-3 years of ownership that are often still covered under warranty.

There certainly feels like a floor to these EV price falls and a biting point once they get to the lower teens where prices then seem to sit after big falls in those early years.

A 4 year old EV with 200+ miles of range with under 40k on the clock costing £36k new and now accessible for £14k with far lower running costs makes it ideal for large number of potential buyers, especially when comparing to an ICE in a similar bracket.

[Sheepshanks]

Theoldguard said:

Hard to look beyond some of the used EVs at the 2-3 year point in terms of value, at the 4-5 year point they are only circa 15% less depending on make / model and price bracket, making them a decent option for 2-3 years of ownership that are often still covered under warranty.

There certainly feels like a floor to these EV price falls and a biting point once they get to the lower teens where prices then seem to sit after big falls in those early years.

A 4 year old EV with 200+ miles of range with under 40k on the clock costing £36k new and now accessible for £14k with far lower running costs makes it ideal for large number of potential buyers, especially when comparing to an ICE in a similar bracket.

There just don't seem to be any decent (ie without quirks) ones.

For general purpose use Kia Niro and Hyundai Kona seem the obvious choices but they'be both been replaced recently and old ones look very old already. The new versions are still too expensive as nearly-new - they're going to take a massive 3yr hit.

I thought Vx Mokka might be OK but there are too many horror stories about issues with them and appalling real-world range.

[Greenmantle]

Theoldguard said:

Hard to look beyond some of the used EVs at the 2-3 year point in terms of value, at the 4-5 year point they are only circa 15% less depending on make / model and price bracket, making them a decent option for 2-3 years of ownership that are often still covered under warranty.

There certainly feels like a floor to these EV price falls and a biting point once they get to the lower teens where prices then seem to sit after big falls in those early years.

A 4 year old EV with 200+ miles of range with under 40k on the clock costing £36k new and now accessible for £14k with far lower running costs makes it ideal for large number of potential buyers, especially when comparing to an ICE in a similar bracket.

How about the price brackets above that?

I'm looking at EVs with RRP of say £50K
Replaced with a newer model in 2024
A few cars from Nov 2023 all around £33k to £36K with main dealers.
Would be happy to pull the trigger at £30.5K
WBAC is saying £28K

[macron]

Auto810graphy said:

I think next week will see quite a few reductions in the retail prices of £15k + mainstream cars. CAP prices have been dropping quite hard this month and this is being reflected in trade pricing, especially auctions this week however being a bank holiday and half term did not help.

That's interesting, do you think those with these on the forecourt will be pricing down? Or will that take a while as it's new stock that should be cheaper, so it's when people think they have stuff hanging around they'll re-price?

I'm about to pay over the odds for something with no roof, stupid idea at this time of year, but at least I know I'm getting screwed!

[BishBosh]

Barrie c 66 said:

Are electric vans a hard sell at the moment ? A Vivaro, Expert etc would suit my needs perfectly as I only do about 4,000 miles a year and have solar panels and a charger. Generally work in about a 5 mile radius, occasionally go about 25 miles. The difference between asking prices and WBAC is massive. Every one I've put in they have come back about half the asking price.

I just bought a 2 year old Combo-e with less than 2000 miles on the clock for £16k + vat. That’s about half new price. Did the same as you with WBAC prices coming in around £5k less than I paid however you just can’t buy them for that price….
It’s brilliant, does exactly what I need no tax and as it’s only 50kw very cheap to charge from home. I wanted the lwb with twin side load doors and a load through, most of what’s advertised is wrong so be careful what you look for.
Bottom line is you just have to negotiate as best you can and pay up. Or wait another 6 months to be in the same position.