Vixen vs 3000m fast road car
Discussion
Welcome to our world!
I have two thoughts.
1.) HOW FAST?
2.) To begin with, set a budgetary limit. Then, determine if you can build the TVR you want at that cost. Next, try to imagine a timeline. (Now, spend some time contemplating whether you'd be better off buying an existing racing car.)
Best,
B.
I have two thoughts.
1.) HOW FAST?
2.) To begin with, set a budgetary limit. Then, determine if you can build the TVR you want at that cost. Next, try to imagine a timeline. (Now, spend some time contemplating whether you'd be better off buying an existing racing car.)
Best,
B.
geeeman said:
i guess it would be possible to make tuscan v6 replica on an M chassis?
Yes, see Michael Zappa's Tuscan with a 3000m chassis and Rick Wood dry sump Essex V6 in the states: http://www.britishracecar.com/MichaelZappa-TVR-Tus...
Slow M said:
Welcome to our world!
I have two thoughts.
1.) HOW FAST?
2.) To begin with, set a budgetary limit. Then, determine if you can build the TVR you want at that cost. Next, try to imagine a timeline. (Now, spend some time contemplating whether you'd be better off buying an existing racing car.)
Best,
B.
yep, sounds sensible. main problem is that i wont be doing the work myself, and these type of builds always take longer and cost more than what you thinkI have two thoughts.
1.) HOW FAST?
2.) To begin with, set a budgetary limit. Then, determine if you can build the TVR you want at that cost. Next, try to imagine a timeline. (Now, spend some time contemplating whether you'd be better off buying an existing racing car.)
Best,
B.
I got lucky with my G4, found one needing full restoration, but complete. there is a build thread here:
http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...
You built the Ginetta with a very specific goal in mind. That acts as a possible cost limiting factor. Without first determining what the goal is, for how fast you want the TVR to eventually be, the cost can keep creeping up, during the build.
My mistake was letting my enthusiasm for the engine overshadow other considerations. As a result, all drivetrain components had to be selected (and many custom fabricated) to be able to accept those loads. My parts purchase costs hover at a factor of 3-4x, compared to my initial projections with a 300-400HP motor. The effort to make all of those bits fit, is a far, far greater challenge.
For what it's worth, the G4 is stunning. If/when you set your mind to building an M, I'm sure the result will be one to make us all envious, or at least somewhat automotively lascivious.
Best,
B.
My mistake was letting my enthusiasm for the engine overshadow other considerations. As a result, all drivetrain components had to be selected (and many custom fabricated) to be able to accept those loads. My parts purchase costs hover at a factor of 3-4x, compared to my initial projections with a 300-400HP motor. The effort to make all of those bits fit, is a far, far greater challenge.
For what it's worth, the G4 is stunning. If/when you set your mind to building an M, I'm sure the result will be one to make us all envious, or at least somewhat automotively lascivious.
Best,
B.
thanks Bernard, my current thinking so far,
around 250 hp would be ample in the TVR chassis for a road car.
the essex v6 is often quoted as a 'heavy' engine, but figures suggest it weighs less than a 289 ford v8.
250 hp with essex v6 should be fairly achievable
chassis would be M-series or vixen,
if M-series, then basically it would involve a re-body to tuscan v6 shape. But im not sure how my insurer would view the car, and if i would have trouble insuring it. This may be even more of a problem if i go the route of upgrading a vixen to tuscan spec, as then it is heavily modified, as opposed to just re-bodied..!
around 250 hp would be ample in the TVR chassis for a road car.
the essex v6 is often quoted as a 'heavy' engine, but figures suggest it weighs less than a 289 ford v8.
250 hp with essex v6 should be fairly achievable
chassis would be M-series or vixen,
if M-series, then basically it would involve a re-body to tuscan v6 shape. But im not sure how my insurer would view the car, and if i would have trouble insuring it. This may be even more of a problem if i go the route of upgrading a vixen to tuscan spec, as then it is heavily modified, as opposed to just re-bodied..!
geeeman said:
thanks Bernard, my current thinking so far,
around 250 hp would be ample in the TVR chassis for a road car.
the essex v6 is often quoted as a 'heavy' engine, but figures suggest it weighs less than a 289 ford v8.
250 hp with essex v6 should be fairly achievable
chassis would be M-series or vixen,
if M-series, then basically it would involve a re-body to tuscan v6 shape. But im not sure how my insurer would view the car, and if i would have trouble insuring it. This may be even more of a problem if i go the route of upgrading a vixen to tuscan spec, as then it is heavily modified, as opposed to just re-bodied..!
Don't make life complicated if you want to race a TVR buy what you want and make it a car that works in its classaround 250 hp would be ample in the TVR chassis for a road car.
the essex v6 is often quoted as a 'heavy' engine, but figures suggest it weighs less than a 289 ford v8.
250 hp with essex v6 should be fairly achievable
chassis would be M-series or vixen,
if M-series, then basically it would involve a re-body to tuscan v6 shape. But im not sure how my insurer would view the car, and if i would have trouble insuring it. This may be even more of a problem if i go the route of upgrading a vixen to tuscan spec, as then it is heavily modified, as opposed to just re-bodied..!
A Vixen make it a fast one
A M series likewise
or a Tuscan likewise
your Garage shows your not a novice so should know the score each have engines that can be race prepared if that's what you want it.
A
Adrian@ said:
There is such a TVR..Vixen body with an M chassis, the last of the 2500's, I would add that the shell never look happy sitting on it (IMHO), but these were built in 72 and then Vixen S4 (1600), along with 5 1300's in 72-73.
Adrian@
Like this one, just sold.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Other-Makes-2-door-coupe-1972-tvr-2500-/221306429290?forcerrptr=true&hash=item3386e41f6a&item=221306429290&pt=US_Cars_Trucks&afsrc=1Adrian@
Edited by Adrian@ on Sunday 10th November 17:32
Like this one, just sold.
Also, Mike Zappa's car would be worth a look, but that's not a street car, by any stretch of the imagination.
Best,
B.
RV8 from a TVR would do the trick too, a 4.3 or 4.6 or 5.0 
and or maybe a modern V6 from Ford if thats aloud? such 3.7 V6 gives 302hp and the 3.5 ecoboost way more ;-)
http://www.meadowlandford.com/ford-3.7l-engine-spe...
weights 355lb (161kg) Engine weight (without accessory drive components)
http://www.fordservicecontent.com/Ford_Content/pub...
and or maybe a modern V6 from Ford if thats aloud? such 3.7 V6 gives 302hp and the 3.5 ecoboost way more ;-)
http://www.meadowlandford.com/ford-3.7l-engine-spe...
weights 355lb (161kg) Engine weight (without accessory drive components)
http://www.fordservicecontent.com/Ford_Content/pub...
geeeman said:
looking at relative engine weights
ford crossflow 265 lb
RV8 318 lb
essex v6 379 lb
ford 289 v8 460 lb
the essex engine seems quite reasonable, and 250 hp with triple webers would be nice, although expensive
I thought the 289 was lighter that the Essex as a thinner walled casting?ford crossflow 265 lb
RV8 318 lb
essex v6 379 lb
ford 289 v8 460 lb
the essex engine seems quite reasonable, and 250 hp with triple webers would be nice, although expensive
this engine sounds good to by weight etc, at least what this guy says about that, don't know if such engine would fit though
said:
I've weighed probably close to a 100 completed conversions at British V8 events over the years and wondered how much this crate engine weighed in at on its own.
Pulled from the crate it weighs in at only 298 lbs! That includes oil.
Now add in block plate, flywheel, clutch, intake, water pump, carb and distributor, the assembly still only weighs 379 lbs.
Compare that to the stock MGB engine at 360 lbs, its only 19 pounds more!
http://www.mgexp.com/phorum/read.php?40,1890280,page=1Pulled from the crate it weighs in at only 298 lbs! That includes oil.
Now add in block plate, flywheel, clutch, intake, water pump, carb and distributor, the assembly still only weighs 379 lbs.
Compare that to the stock MGB engine at 360 lbs, its only 19 pounds more!
indeed, but the crate engine package was something around 425lb I thought have seen, that sounds more 'right' I guess, so that story of that builder surprised me.
here such new engine 425lb shipping weight, not bad me thinks but I guess some engines are more 'dressed' up then others.
http://www.fordracingparts.com/parts/part_details....
here such new engine 425lb shipping weight, not bad me thinks but I guess some engines are more 'dressed' up then others.
http://www.fordracingparts.com/parts/part_details....
said:
Shipping weight approximately 425 lbs
said:
306 CUBIC INCHES 340 HP CRATE ENGINEM-6007-X302*
Edited by GTRene on Tuesday 12th November 12:10
Edited by GTRene on Tuesday 12th November 12:12
Don't forget...
302 has cast iron heads and intake in std form
A re-furb or crate engine built with alloy heads and intake is considerably lighter than one in standard specification.
A block on its own is relatively light but you still need pretty big b
ks to lift one. block for block a little essex is lighter than a small block, again allow for heads and inlet.
the biggest advantage of the small block ford is the narrow angle and distance between the exhaust manifolds...
What I don't understand though is if anyone is building and modifying a road car and not subject to any racing regs etc then why does everyone seem to want to use such antiquated old crap. There are a lot of modern very powerful 4, 6 and 8 cylinder engines out there very cheaply available..
Duratec V6 powering the current ginettas for example??
even a Duratec 4 cylinder Turbo in a vixen would likely as not trounce a V8 car??
N.
302 has cast iron heads and intake in std form
A re-furb or crate engine built with alloy heads and intake is considerably lighter than one in standard specification.
A block on its own is relatively light but you still need pretty big b
ks to lift one. block for block a little essex is lighter than a small block, again allow for heads and inlet.the biggest advantage of the small block ford is the narrow angle and distance between the exhaust manifolds...
What I don't understand though is if anyone is building and modifying a road car and not subject to any racing regs etc then why does everyone seem to want to use such antiquated old crap. There are a lot of modern very powerful 4, 6 and 8 cylinder engines out there very cheaply available..
Duratec V6 powering the current ginettas for example??
even a Duratec 4 cylinder Turbo in a vixen would likely as not trounce a V8 car??
N.
Edited by heightswitch on Tuesday 12th November 13:15
Edited by heightswitch on Tuesday 12th November 13:22
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