1985 Citroen BX 19GT overhaul
Discussion
Kitchski said:
I should point out most of the driving in the Mondeo was around town. On the way back from Devon in 2010 we got very excited when it nudged 34mpg! We didn't learn - have a 2.5T S-Max now!
Town driving kills them! My 2.4 Audi manages about 16mpg, I'm expecting little better or worse from the ST...Bet the S-max likes a drink!
Picked the GT back up in the last few days. Next job after getting the engine bay all sorted was to begin refitting everything. Not amazing progress sadly, but then time is in pretty short supply. Plus trying to remember where everything goes, cleaning it and looking for the relevant fixings is massively time-consuming!
One of the first bits to go back on, after a quick clean and brush up:
Luckily, I found a way to give me a guide as to where most of the stuff would have been installed from the factory:
Really handy having the other BX there as I've already found a number of components which have been laid out incorrectly, presumably by garages/owners in the past who were trying to save time. I can get my anal attention to detail kicks from this job!:
Spent time collating all the bits I need to clean up in the parts washer, or blast in the grit blaster. There will be some bits I'll send away for zinc-plating, but I'll try and do as much as I can myself to keep costs low. It's not going to be a show car or anything like that!
The bit I'm not looking forward to:
It doesn't need to look mint, but I don't want it to let the engine bay down either. Problem is the engine's old now, and hasn't been cleaned anytime recently.....or ever, by the look of it. There's grease, oil, Waxoyl (baked on - nice) and lots of alloy corrosion. I'm running behind schedule so I can't justify spending hours cleaning the thing up, and having just spent an hour trying to pretty it up I realised I was fighting a losing battle. Tomorrow it's Gunk and a power washer, and we'll see how it ends up!
Another issue I'm going to have is self inflicted, by my own stupidity. I removed the valves from the head ages ago, mainly to decoke the head but also to renew the valve seals. I removed all the valves, collets, springs, lifters and shims, and placed them all in plastic cups, numbered 1 to 8. I then hid them so they wouldn't get knocked over or the like. Sound sensible? I thought so! And it has been, in terms of storage.
What hasn't been sensible, is the fact that PSA nubmer their cylinders backwards, meaning 1 is at the flywheel end, and 4 at the timing end. And I can't remember whether I numbered in PSA style, or in human style. Me being me, it could easily be either. And genius that I am, I haven't left any clues since stripping the head two years ago. So I'm going to have to refit it all, measure the valve clearances and hope they give me the clues as to whether I've got it all right or not. Great!
I'm such a bellend sometimes!!
One of the first bits to go back on, after a quick clean and brush up:
Luckily, I found a way to give me a guide as to where most of the stuff would have been installed from the factory:
Really handy having the other BX there as I've already found a number of components which have been laid out incorrectly, presumably by garages/owners in the past who were trying to save time. I can get my anal attention to detail kicks from this job!:
Spent time collating all the bits I need to clean up in the parts washer, or blast in the grit blaster. There will be some bits I'll send away for zinc-plating, but I'll try and do as much as I can myself to keep costs low. It's not going to be a show car or anything like that!
The bit I'm not looking forward to:
It doesn't need to look mint, but I don't want it to let the engine bay down either. Problem is the engine's old now, and hasn't been cleaned anytime recently.....or ever, by the look of it. There's grease, oil, Waxoyl (baked on - nice) and lots of alloy corrosion. I'm running behind schedule so I can't justify spending hours cleaning the thing up, and having just spent an hour trying to pretty it up I realised I was fighting a losing battle. Tomorrow it's Gunk and a power washer, and we'll see how it ends up!
Another issue I'm going to have is self inflicted, by my own stupidity. I removed the valves from the head ages ago, mainly to decoke the head but also to renew the valve seals. I removed all the valves, collets, springs, lifters and shims, and placed them all in plastic cups, numbered 1 to 8. I then hid them so they wouldn't get knocked over or the like. Sound sensible? I thought so! And it has been, in terms of storage.
What hasn't been sensible, is the fact that PSA nubmer their cylinders backwards, meaning 1 is at the flywheel end, and 4 at the timing end. And I can't remember whether I numbered in PSA style, or in human style. Me being me, it could easily be either. And genius that I am, I haven't left any clues since stripping the head two years ago. So I'm going to have to refit it all, measure the valve clearances and hope they give me the clues as to whether I've got it all right or not. Great!
I'm such a bellend sometimes!!
Kitchski said:
Luckily, I found a way to give me a guide as to where most of the stuff would have been installed from the factory:
Really handy having the other BX there as I've already found a number of components which have been laid out incorrectly, presumably by garages/owners in the past who were trying to save time. I can get my anal attention to detail kicks from this job!
I'm sorry, but I'm going to fReally handy having the other BX there as I've already found a number of components which have been laid out incorrectly, presumably by garages/owners in the past who were trying to save time. I can get my anal attention to detail kicks from this job!
k with your head now.How do you know which car the bits have been put back in the wrong place on...? Maybe the GT was right and you're now copying somebody else's time-saving bodge...?
TooMany2cvs said:
I'm sorry, but I'm going to fk with your head now.
How do you know which car the bits have been put back in the wrong place on...? Maybe the GT was right and you're now copying somebody else's time-saving bodge...?
Because.........k with your head now.How do you know which car the bits have been put back in the wrong place on...? Maybe the GT was right and you're now copying somebody else's time-saving bodge...?
The red one has only done 17,000 miles and is painfully original!
The odds aren't dead cert, but they're stacked in my favour.
So, where we at? Engine-related stuff at the moment!
Well, I managed to get the head and block looking a bit more respectable. Beaulieu motor museum have got nothing to worry about as really to do it properly, the whole shebang would need stripping of every nut and bolt, glass bead blasting and fully overhauling. Ain't nobody got time fo dat, so a quick brush up, degrease and bullst silver spray was order of the day!
Degreasing took ages:
Pretty thick and grim:
But got there in the end:
Same treatment for the head:
Licked up in silver:
Block painted too, and head plonked on top for pics:
Oil pump chain cover off to clean the sludge off of, and fit a new front crank seal:
So with paint done, time to build the head back up. Valves look a bit......meh:
But a bit of work, and:
Be good for another 190,000!
Renewed valve steam seals. Old ones had almost turned to plastic! Amazing that it wasn't pissing blue smoke everywhere! Should be good now:
Gave the buckets a little redress. They're pretty hard and there wasn't much wear, even with the mileage. Doesn't take 5 mins when you've got a linisher to hand though. No more days of doing 15mins each of figure-8s with 16 valves!:
Valves going in:
Head's a little bit corroded underneath, but had it pressure tested and all ok. Did faff about for a while trying to find another head, but they're seriously thin on the ground now. Had this one refaced and it's good enough, to be honest. I'm going to convert it to waterless coolant too, so it'll halt any further corrosion.
Head gasket in place:
Head bolted down:
How's this for a tightening sequence?!:
Are we sure that's enough stages!?
Remembered the spacer. Many a block have been wrecked by missing that out! I'll let you figure out why....:
The BX valve clearances on the XU (except the 16v - they're proper engines with hydraulic lifters) are dealt with by way of a solid bucket lifter, and a shim placed underneath. Owing to my previous potential mix-up, I was worried I'd clamp the camshaft in place and find that I had all the valve clearances wrong. So first up, I measured all the shim sizes and recorded them as I went:
Not that they really had any wear, but I fitted them upside down to how they were previous fitted in case there was an indent in the shim opening the gap slightly:
All aboard!:
Then it was in with the camshaft....:
...and check the clearances (and keep fingers crossed!):
I have no spare shims, so was hoping I would find all the clearances ok. Inlet range is 0.15mm-0.25mm, and exhaust is 0.35mm-0.40mm. Everything was bob on within range. Happy days!
A bit of blasting and painting to be done over the next day or two, before refitting the belt, timing it up and moving on to the gearbox. Then I can think about refitting it!
Well, I managed to get the head and block looking a bit more respectable. Beaulieu motor museum have got nothing to worry about as really to do it properly, the whole shebang would need stripping of every nut and bolt, glass bead blasting and fully overhauling. Ain't nobody got time fo dat, so a quick brush up, degrease and bulls
t silver spray was order of the day! Degreasing took ages:
Pretty thick and grim:
But got there in the end:
Same treatment for the head:
Licked up in silver:
Block painted too, and head plonked on top for pics:
Oil pump chain cover off to clean the sludge off of, and fit a new front crank seal:
So with paint done, time to build the head back up. Valves look a bit......meh:
But a bit of work, and:
Be good for another 190,000!
Renewed valve steam seals. Old ones had almost turned to plastic! Amazing that it wasn't pissing blue smoke everywhere! Should be good now:
Gave the buckets a little redress. They're pretty hard and there wasn't much wear, even with the mileage. Doesn't take 5 mins when you've got a linisher to hand though. No more days of doing 15mins each of figure-8s with 16 valves!:
Valves going in:
Head's a little bit corroded underneath, but had it pressure tested and all ok. Did faff about for a while trying to find another head, but they're seriously thin on the ground now. Had this one refaced and it's good enough, to be honest. I'm going to convert it to waterless coolant too, so it'll halt any further corrosion.
Head gasket in place:
Head bolted down:
How's this for a tightening sequence?!:
Are we sure that's enough stages!?
Remembered the spacer. Many a block have been wrecked by missing that out! I'll let you figure out why....:
The BX valve clearances on the XU (except the 16v - they're proper engines with hydraulic lifters) are dealt with by way of a solid bucket lifter, and a shim placed underneath. Owing to my previous potential mix-up, I was worried I'd clamp the camshaft in place and find that I had all the valve clearances wrong. So first up, I measured all the shim sizes and recorded them as I went:
Not that they really had any wear, but I fitted them upside down to how they were previous fitted in case there was an indent in the shim opening the gap slightly:
All aboard!:
Then it was in with the camshaft....:
...and check the clearances (and keep fingers crossed!):
I have no spare shims, so was hoping I would find all the clearances ok. Inlet range is 0.15mm-0.25mm, and exhaust is 0.35mm-0.40mm. Everything was bob on within range. Happy days!
A bit of blasting and painting to be done over the next day or two, before refitting the belt, timing it up and moving on to the gearbox. Then I can think about refitting it!
Blue Oval84 said:
Awesome work! I'd love to have the time and space to be able to do something like this!
(I would start with welding up a certain old rustbucket obviously...)
I haven't really got the time, to be honest! It started off as a job at work, but I massively underestimated how much work was involved! That was partly because there was more to do underneath than I'd planned, and partly because every little job I'd do I'd go one step further, just out of enthusiasm. Stuff like the engine, which didn't need stripping and painting/cleaning up, or even the engine bay! It was MoT-able, but I wanted it better. I feel bad that it's taken so long (due to the lack of time) but I'm determined when my Dad gets it back that it's of a certain standard. Ideally I'd have loved to go nuts on it, and get every little fixing and bracket looking new, but time just isn't there and I've got loads of other work to do.(I would start with welding up a certain old rustbucket obviously...)
S10GTA said:
Well done mate, your dad will be chuffed when he gets it back. You'll need to find a home for whatever is in his garage however, I reckon he'll be a tart about it now.
Careful! That sounded like a compliment!It always used to live in the garage anyway, more out of practicality than anything else. He's not the polishy-showy type, so I suspect it'll get lightly used and washed maybe once or twice a year with a sponge and some cheap Asda wash & wax
But it'll still look ok for a few years yet 
Edited by Kitchski on Thursday 4th February 09:10
BuzzBravado said:
That torque sequence was the same for my Subaru engine, a lot of tightening the loosening.
Funnily enough one of the cars we're building up is a Nova kit car, which is based on a Beetle. We're fitting a Legacy 2.5 n/a lump to that (EJ25?) and the guy who put the heads on said exactly the same thing.BuzzBravado said:
I'm not sure on the science behind it, but it feels like the end result is way slacker than i thought it should be. 10k miles later though and its still solid.
I know with this one I thought it was going to be too slack, until I got to the end of stage 5. Then I thought i was going to snap a bolt!A BX featured on a BBC programme?:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b07025h9/holi...
Yup! One of the guys on the Facebook group had his TZD Turbo used recently. Makes me want to get one on the road and drive it again!
http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b07025h9/holi...
Yup! One of the guys on the Facebook group had his TZD Turbo used recently. Makes me want to get one on the road and drive it again!
MOAR progress, mostly engine related:
Cleaned up the exhaust manifold:
Prepped a load of little bits and got various components painted:
Manifold coated in VHT spray, the rest of the engine's just in bullst silver 
Blasted the sump pan too. This was particularly grotty and greasy. Took ages to clean up! Has now been handpainted with Galvafroid, a sort of galvanised-ish zinc-based paint. No idea how good it is, I've heard good and bad! So I did a particularly vulnerable bit of engine with it before dusting over with the standard silver, and I can monitor how it goes:
They say French cars are st. I think French cars are the best engineered, and it's for reasons like this....
Last time I had to remove the dowels from a flywheel, I had to grip them with mole-grips and work them out on a Rover V8. Two of them sheered. PSA, decided to take the hole all the way through for you, and just step it. This way you can punch them out from behind:
Sorted! They've been in there 190,000 miles, and 30 years. Out with next to no bother! And the reason for taking them out? The flywheel is pretty grotty! Nicely scored, been pretty hot in the past, and I'm going to the trouble of fitting a new clutch. Last thing I want is clutch judder, so I had the flywheel refaced:
The clutch was supplied by my Dad way back when I first took the BX in. He found some NOS Motaquip units. Pretty sure Motaquip were (originally) PSA's factor brand back in the day, much like Motorcraft for Ford:
Looks like that may be the case....:
When I was stripping the engine down, I made a bit of a balls-up. The crankshaft sprocket was well and truly stuck onto the crankshaft! I had to try to lever it off, as there's nothing from a puller to grip. In doing this, I managed to damage the thin metal disc on the back of the sprocket, which prevents the belt from touching the oil pump casing. Bugger! I dressed it up like this:
But when fitted, the belt tried to jump every time it went by. Part of me thought to keep going with the smoothing etc, but the other part was worried a belt would get chewed. I stopped by eBay and found a used 205 GTi lower sprocket for £18. Took a punt:
It paid off!
Timing belt all fitted:
More bits bolted together:
One issue I've had is that the exhaust manifold heat shield was held on by some M7 bolts. M7 bolts that I cannot locate. M7 bolts that were not something I've got in stock, and I wanted to get the engine refitted. Solution? Trusty, thrusty drill!:
Followed by trusty, twisty tap:
Leading to:
Resulting in:
Verdict:
So just time to fit the new clutch:
And give the gearbox a spruce up:
And a powertrain package is complete:
And after a bit of heaving and fro'ing, and a remarkable lack of scratched freshly applied paint, both of body and engine variety....
Engine back in BX. I've actually refitted something!!
Plan now is to continue fitting up the front end, right up to things like wings, lights, bumper etc. Then move onto interior in early to mid March, get electrics back online, seats and dash back in etc, before April brings the rear end. LOTS of work to be done there still.
For now, I have some wiring to improve (30 years old, and crusty in places), suspension to refit and and engine to plumb in. Going well though
Cleaned up the exhaust manifold:
Prepped a load of little bits and got various components painted:
Manifold coated in VHT spray, the rest of the engine's just in bulls
t silver Blasted the sump pan too. This was particularly grotty and greasy. Took ages to clean up! Has now been handpainted with Galvafroid, a sort of galvanised-ish zinc-based paint. No idea how good it is, I've heard good and bad! So I did a particularly vulnerable bit of engine with it before dusting over with the standard silver, and I can monitor how it goes:
They say French cars are s
t. I think French cars are the best engineered, and it's for reasons like this....Last time I had to remove the dowels from a flywheel, I had to grip them with mole-grips and work them out on a Rover V8. Two of them sheered. PSA, decided to take the hole all the way through for you, and just step it. This way you can punch them out from behind:
Sorted! They've been in there 190,000 miles, and 30 years. Out with next to no bother! And the reason for taking them out? The flywheel is pretty grotty! Nicely scored, been pretty hot in the past, and I'm going to the trouble of fitting a new clutch. Last thing I want is clutch judder, so I had the flywheel refaced:
The clutch was supplied by my Dad way back when I first took the BX in. He found some NOS Motaquip units. Pretty sure Motaquip were (originally) PSA's factor brand back in the day, much like Motorcraft for Ford:
Looks like that may be the case....:
When I was stripping the engine down, I made a bit of a balls-up. The crankshaft sprocket was well and truly stuck onto the crankshaft! I had to try to lever it off, as there's nothing from a puller to grip. In doing this, I managed to damage the thin metal disc on the back of the sprocket, which prevents the belt from touching the oil pump casing. Bugger! I dressed it up like this:
But when fitted, the belt tried to jump every time it went by. Part of me thought to keep going with the smoothing etc, but the other part was worried a belt would get chewed. I stopped by eBay and found a used 205 GTi lower sprocket for £18. Took a punt:
It paid off!
Timing belt all fitted:
More bits bolted together:
One issue I've had is that the exhaust manifold heat shield was held on by some M7 bolts. M7 bolts that I cannot locate. M7 bolts that were not something I've got in stock, and I wanted to get the engine refitted. Solution? Trusty, thrusty drill!:
Followed by trusty, twisty tap:
Leading to:
Resulting in:
Verdict:
So just time to fit the new clutch:
And give the gearbox a spruce up:
And a powertrain package is complete:
And after a bit of heaving and fro'ing, and a remarkable lack of scratched freshly applied paint, both of body and engine variety....
Engine back in BX. I've actually refitted something!!
Plan now is to continue fitting up the front end, right up to things like wings, lights, bumper etc. Then move onto interior in early to mid March, get electrics back online, seats and dash back in etc, before April brings the rear end. LOTS of work to be done there still.
For now, I have some wiring to improve (30 years old, and crusty in places), suspension to refit and and engine to plumb in. Going well though
hidetheelephants said:
Shirley every dedicated Citroen fondler should have a tub of assorted M7 fasteners? I've still got a dozen or so left over from running a Lomax, and I sold that 8 years ago. Every other fastener on a 2CV is M7, it seemed to be their default fastening size.
Indeed.And that's why any half-decent 2cv parts supplier carries M7 nuts, washers and a variety of length of bolts...
http://www.ecas2cvparts.co.uk/-c-57_96.html
A few years back I asked a specialist paint supplier about galvafroid and (forget the name) another brand of similar. They reckoned that they were the dog's for blast-cleaned metal, but not recommended for mechanically-cleaned. It'll be interesting to see the result.
And there can't be many BXs sharing a garage with an RS200!
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