Mercedes W124 E300D estate - progress, or not...
Discussion
Right: some updates.
- Front anti roll bar bushes have arrived.
- Rev counter has become sentient, and is in the Terrible Twos.
- Had to put some oil in!
- Passenger side wing needs to be replaced somewhen.
- Glow plugs need doing (although not quite as bad in the warmer weather).
- Exhaust back box ish is rattling on bumps & tight corner reversing, so I think it needs new hangers. (I think the exhaust has come off recently, so maybe something was missed putting it back on)
Fuel lines are starting to give issues - the car starts up first time, albeit with the smoke and missing which I hope is the glow plugs - but, after about a minute, the car splutters to a halt and is a bugger to get running again. Once that's cleared, it feels like there's some occasional hesitation and dropping of revs for maybe 5 mins, then all is fine. Starts and runs fine after a couple of hours of standing.
I think this points to a bad O ring somewhere further back from the engine, causing fuel to drain back into the tank from that point backwards, so it's using up the fuel that's in the closer lines then starving when it hits an air pocket.
I'm hoping the replacement clear fuel lines will fix the problem. Not sure what to do if they don't!
- Front anti roll bar bushes have arrived.
- Rev counter has become sentient, and is in the Terrible Twos.
- Had to put some oil in!
- Passenger side wing needs to be replaced somewhen.
- Glow plugs need doing (although not quite as bad in the warmer weather).
- Exhaust back box ish is rattling on bumps & tight corner reversing, so I think it needs new hangers. (I think the exhaust has come off recently, so maybe something was missed putting it back on)
Fuel lines are starting to give issues - the car starts up first time, albeit with the smoke and missing which I hope is the glow plugs - but, after about a minute, the car splutters to a halt and is a bugger to get running again. Once that's cleared, it feels like there's some occasional hesitation and dropping of revs for maybe 5 mins, then all is fine. Starts and runs fine after a couple of hours of standing.
I think this points to a bad O ring somewhere further back from the engine, causing fuel to drain back into the tank from that point backwards, so it's using up the fuel that's in the closer lines then starving when it hits an air pocket.
I'm hoping the replacement clear fuel lines will fix the problem. Not sure what to do if they don't!
Northbrook said:
- Exhaust back box ish is rattling on bumps & tight corner reversing, so I think it needs new hangers. (I think the exhaust has come off recently, so maybe something was missed putting it back on)
Might just be the heat shield above the back box. The holes through which it is affixed to the floor tend to rot out. Nothing a 10p repair washer can't fix. Got to get that fuel issue sorted. I'm seeing Baister in the morning, I'll ask him and do my best to interpret his strange Geordie/Caveman dialect.A little update:
Ramps are too tall to fit under the car! I took some paint off the underside during an ill-advised first attempt. Rethink required (and a couple of short thick planks).
Exhaust heat shield is, indeed, not fully secured. But it's not causing the exhaust knock. Or, at least, not the one I'm hearing. The rear box is on new rubbers, but moving it around does result in a couple of knocks, and one of them sounds familiar. Something for when I can get the car in the air.
Likewise the propshaft bearing, which is suspect is past its best. Not expensive to buy, so it's on the one-day list.
Most pressing is to resolve the fuelling issue. Not impressive today at all, with various stumbles and some cutting out en route (thrice on my way to work, including once at the car park barrier, 8 miles & 25 mins into the trip). Unless I'm very dim, there's a fair amount of air getting into the lines, and it's getting worse. I think (hope) that's more an age thing, rather than a new fault introduced by the recent mechanicking. I'm currently considering my options for speedy but cost-effective replacement of the clear lines - I'm happy to get stuck in, but not hugely experienced, and location is also a consideration.
Ramps are too tall to fit under the car! I took some paint off the underside during an ill-advised first attempt. Rethink required (and a couple of short thick planks).
Exhaust heat shield is, indeed, not fully secured. But it's not causing the exhaust knock. Or, at least, not the one I'm hearing. The rear box is on new rubbers, but moving it around does result in a couple of knocks, and one of them sounds familiar. Something for when I can get the car in the air.
Likewise the propshaft bearing, which is suspect is past its best. Not expensive to buy, so it's on the one-day list.
Most pressing is to resolve the fuelling issue. Not impressive today at all, with various stumbles and some cutting out en route (thrice on my way to work, including once at the car park barrier, 8 miles & 25 mins into the trip). Unless I'm very dim, there's a fair amount of air getting into the lines, and it's getting worse. I think (hope) that's more an age thing, rather than a new fault introduced by the recent mechanicking. I'm currently considering my options for speedy but cost-effective replacement of the clear lines - I'm happy to get stuck in, but not hugely experienced, and location is also a consideration.
I used the car yesterday as my band-gear carrier - my double bass fits comfortable in the back with the seats down, albeit on a slant to clear the rear window. Nice and easy, and without having the bass in my ear as in my Skoda Roomster (although that car is fantastic for interior space).
The W124 is also very relaxing on my way home after gigs.
.... but... that running issue is becoming a significant problem. I'm going to have to get spannering at the weekend, and see how I get on. Glow plug reamer is incoming, and there's an ECP not far away. I just hope the weather is okay for it.
The W124 is also very relaxing on my way home after gigs.
.... but... that running issue is becoming a significant problem. I'm going to have to get spannering at the weekend, and see how I get on. Glow plug reamer is incoming, and there's an ECP not far away. I just hope the weather is okay for it.
Right then. The day has come.
The day when I (hopefully) help my engine to run better, without making it run worse (or not at all).
The clear fuel lines need to be replaced, to see if that resolves the air-in-fuel issue that's getting worse. I have new MB lines, with viton O rings.
Glow plug #1 isn't connected, because the connector fell to pieces when the mechanic removed it. I have a new connector to be soldered on.
While I'm in there, I'd like to change the glow plugs as, while the basic check didn't flag up any obvious issues, they haven't been done recently (and I believe they can show as okay even if the glow performance isn't what it should be). I have a set of Beru GN860s to go in, if I cam get the old ones out!
If I can get the car on my ramps and have the time, I'm going to look at the propshaft bearing as possible cause for a rumbling under acceleration.
I've also got the front ARB bushes I could do, although I believe that's a wheels-off job so not a while-I'm-there job.
Here's what I think I'm going to be doing:
- Car run up to temperature (picking up final bits, topping up with diesel) and finagled onto my ramps.
- #1 plug sprayed with <whatever release fluid I have>
- Intake crossover pipe removed (unsure whether that means the EGR valve needs to come off), accelerator linkage removed if I must, plastic cover removed, CCV pipework disconnected from intake manifold (and I have most bits to renew if they break).
- Fluid onto all glow plugs, try to loosen them.
- Remove clear fuel lines one at a time, fit new lines, pipette in diesel to reduce air in the new lines. (I'm a little hazy on how the lines R&R - I believe there are plastic clips to pull out, or push in, on most ends. Banjo bolts on the rest)
- Continue to try to loosen glow plugs, remove, ream & replace with copper greased new plugs if they come out.
- Solder new end onto #1 plug wire.
-Replace everything in the order I removed it.
- Try not to bugger anything up.
- Cross fingers.
- Drink. One way or the other, there will be booze at the end of it!
I'm in no particular rush, although it'd be nice to have finished - successfully! - by Sunday evening. I have a reasonable number of what should be the right tools, sufficient pizza, and the wine I brought back from my r129sl jaunt in case I need to drown myself.
I'm a little unclear as to how wise it is to start the engine with the intake manifold off. Obviously I'll need to plug the ports when working in the engine bay, and remove the plugs when trying to start the car!
I'll see you when I'm wiser....
The day when I (hopefully) help my engine to run better, without making it run worse (or not at all).
The clear fuel lines need to be replaced, to see if that resolves the air-in-fuel issue that's getting worse. I have new MB lines, with viton O rings.
Glow plug #1 isn't connected, because the connector fell to pieces when the mechanic removed it. I have a new connector to be soldered on.
While I'm in there, I'd like to change the glow plugs as, while the basic check didn't flag up any obvious issues, they haven't been done recently (and I believe they can show as okay even if the glow performance isn't what it should be). I have a set of Beru GN860s to go in, if I cam get the old ones out!
If I can get the car on my ramps and have the time, I'm going to look at the propshaft bearing as possible cause for a rumbling under acceleration.
I've also got the front ARB bushes I could do, although I believe that's a wheels-off job so not a while-I'm-there job.
Here's what I think I'm going to be doing:
- Car run up to temperature (picking up final bits, topping up with diesel) and finagled onto my ramps.
- #1 plug sprayed with <whatever release fluid I have>
- Intake crossover pipe removed (unsure whether that means the EGR valve needs to come off), accelerator linkage removed if I must, plastic cover removed, CCV pipework disconnected from intake manifold (and I have most bits to renew if they break).
- Fluid onto all glow plugs, try to loosen them.
- Remove clear fuel lines one at a time, fit new lines, pipette in diesel to reduce air in the new lines. (I'm a little hazy on how the lines R&R - I believe there are plastic clips to pull out, or push in, on most ends. Banjo bolts on the rest)
- Continue to try to loosen glow plugs, remove, ream & replace with copper greased new plugs if they come out.
- Solder new end onto #1 plug wire.
-Replace everything in the order I removed it.
- Try not to bugger anything up.
- Cross fingers.
- Drink. One way or the other, there will be booze at the end of it!
I'm in no particular rush, although it'd be nice to have finished - successfully! - by Sunday evening. I have a reasonable number of what should be the right tools, sufficient pizza, and the wine I brought back from my r129sl jaunt in case I need to drown myself.
I'm a little unclear as to how wise it is to start the engine with the intake manifold off. Obviously I'll need to plug the ports when working in the engine bay, and remove the plugs when trying to start the car!
I'll see you when I'm wiser....
Good luck - I think you have the right number of 'try to unscrew glow plug' stages in there!
These kind of long term quirks are incredibly satisfying to work through, even if they are continuously annoying whenever you want to actually drive the car. Another bonus is you become a revered authority on such issues - I can see a Sith-style 'master and apprentice' with r129l developing. Good stuff.
These kind of long term quirks are incredibly satisfying to work through, even if they are continuously annoying whenever you want to actually drive the car. Another bonus is you become a revered authority on such issues - I can see a Sith-style 'master and apprentice' with r129l developing. Good stuff.
Thanks, chaps. I'm now at the point of being completely mystified by how the clear lines come off. It's taken me a while to get the manifold off, and I'm sure I've taken off more of the car than was necessary, but - after nearly four hours of taking things to bits (not to mention queuing at ECP) I'm a bit stumped.
Time to sit in the shade, rehydrate, and research.
Time to sit in the shade, rehydrate, and research.
Clear lines are on!
I've had a fiddle with the glow plugs, too. Can't get the connector off #3 & #6, #2 & #5 test okay, #1 is toast, as (I think) is #4.
Can't really get clear access to #1, and #4 started moving, but is moving in a not-fully-circular way, and I can't tell what's going on.
Any suggestions much welcomed!
Going to clean up the manifold gasket surface next.
I've had a fiddle with the glow plugs, too. Can't get the connector off #3 & #6, #2 & #5 test okay, #1 is toast, as (I think) is #4.
Can't really get clear access to #1, and #4 started moving, but is moving in a not-fully-circular way, and I can't tell what's going on.
Any suggestions much welcomed!
Going to clean up the manifold gasket surface next.
Planning on stopping for today, but the car won't start... Not sure how quickly the lines should become air-free when cranking, but I've been cranking on and off for a while, and I still have a lot of air in one line, and the short line from the left of the fuel filter looks empty. Hmm.
I was very methodical with the removal of parts to get to things. I.... may not have been as methodical once I'd got the manifold off, but I don't think I have any on the wrong way - I was mainly working line by line.
A mistake I made (because I wasn't sure I could run the engine without the IM, and/or vacuum lines connected) was that I could have started up between each line replacement, to make sure that line was feeding fine before moving to the next.
The line I'm struggling with is the nearest on in this pic - right-hand line on the fuel filter down to the inner port of two on the right side of the pump. I believe it's the feed pump to fuel filter line, and it's routed correctly but hopefully seated badly at the lower end. I'm finding it hard to get off, just as I did with the old line (which ended up mangled).
On the glow plug angle, I don't think my fiddling has voided compression on #4 - it started turning (spinning) quite easily when I started, so I think the plug has sheared between hex and thread, so the hex portion is just spinning (I assume it's held in place by something, otherwise it would have come out).
The resistance testing I did yesterday suggested that #1 and #4 are toast, possibly #6 too. I'll try testing again.
My priority for today is the fuel lines and getting the car running again. If I can do that, the weekend will have been a success, and the glow plugs will be on my list for the next couple of months.
A mistake I made (because I wasn't sure I could run the engine without the IM, and/or vacuum lines connected) was that I could have started up between each line replacement, to make sure that line was feeding fine before moving to the next.
The line I'm struggling with is the nearest on in this pic - right-hand line on the fuel filter down to the inner port of two on the right side of the pump. I believe it's the feed pump to fuel filter line, and it's routed correctly but hopefully seated badly at the lower end. I'm finding it hard to get off, just as I did with the old line (which ended up mangled).
On the glow plug angle, I don't think my fiddling has voided compression on #4 - it started turning (spinning) quite easily when I started, so I think the plug has sheared between hex and thread, so the hex portion is just spinning (I assume it's held in place by something, otherwise it would have come out).
The resistance testing I did yesterday suggested that #1 and #4 are toast, possibly #6 too. I'll try testing again.
My priority for today is the fuel lines and getting the car running again. If I can do that, the weekend will have been a success, and the glow plugs will be on my list for the next couple of months.
Clips should be out... Problem #1.
Problem #2: the short line from fuel thermostat/heater to the pre-filter is empty. That seems to be the way diesel enters the fuel lines from the tank, so the main entry point is empty. I guess that's why the car won't start!
Nose is up on ramps, and I don't have any assistance to get it down. Hmm.
Problem #2: the short line from fuel thermostat/heater to the pre-filter is empty. That seems to be the way diesel enters the fuel lines from the tank, so the main entry point is empty. I guess that's why the car won't start!
Nose is up on ramps, and I don't have any assistance to get it down. Hmm.
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