BMW E39 M5 Touring build
Discussion
BSSBMW said:
1. Strip down M5 donor car (completed)
2. Refurbish and assemble complete hybrid rear axle including front and rear brakes
3. Install rear axle, M5 brakes, front suspension and convert from auto to manual transmission but retaining the 540i engine
4. Replace timing chains, guides and rod bearings on engine as well as replacement of any other parts required
5. Refurbish steering box
6. Send car to bodyshop to have M5 boot floor panels and tackle corrosion on the rear jacking points
7. Build up front subframe with steering and complete engine.
8. Swap out 540i engine to M5 engine by dropping out complete front subframe, steering and engine to replace with previously assembled M5 set up and fit M5 quad exhaust, carry out all wiring alterations, swap over instrument cluster and all relevant electrical parts.
This is a simplified break down as there a lots of detail bits and pieces but it should break it down into manageable sections with the only labour doubling up is the removal and refitting of the gearbox which is only a few hours labour but by doing so means keeping the car mobile and out of the workshop as much as possible.
There are some cosmetic items such as the M5 mirrors and front bumper grill to be fitted which will go on somewhere along the line of the stages outlined above but it will not get any M5 badging until the complete conversion is done.
Really looking forward to to seeing this done
AyBee said:
Pleased to see you plan on doing the boot properly. I watched some of those youtube videos last night and the boot floor really did seem to be a bit of a bodge which was a shame.
Transplanting the entire rear floor from one car to another is arguably no better since it is a very large piece to remove and replace, which contributes a not insignificant amount to the overall monocoque rigidity. The way they did it on Speed Academy minimised the surgery. I’d say it’s a 6 of one and half a dozen of the other.Great project OP. Following with interest.
Edited by F20CN16 on Friday 19th March 10:06
LetsTryAgain said:
I assume you own the garage you’re doing the work in?
My work won’t even let us check tyre pressures or wash our cars, never mind service them or swap an engine!
Yes it is my garage so fortunate I have the use of it.My work won’t even let us check tyre pressures or wash our cars, never mind service them or swap an engine!
In the past when I was employed I have been allowed the use of a ramp at work for a week to carry out a project.
When I worked for Renault I reshelled my old S50B30 E30 touring into a mint 2dr shell that I had stripped already.
When I worked for a BMW dealer I had an E34 Alpina B10 3.5 which I converted from auto to manual, did the head gasket, retro fitted AC and swapped the whole interior inc carpets and dash from blue cloth to black leather.
I have heard of other places old banning non customer cars in the workshop in more recent times. The above was all over ten years ago.
F20CN16 said:
AyBee said:
Pleased to see you plan on doing the boot properly. I watched some of those youtube videos last night and the boot floor really did seem to be a bit of a bodge which was a shame.
Transplanting the entire rear floor from one car to another is arguably no better since it is a very large piece to remove and replace, which contributes a not insignificant amount to the overall monocoque rigidity. The way they did it on Speed Academy minimised the surgery. I’d say it’s a 6 of one and half a dozen of the other.Great project OP. Following with interest.
Edited by F20CN16 on Friday 19th March 10:06
You do not need to cut the whole boot floor to fit the relevant M5 parts, the spare wheel well and the right hand boot pocket are all that is cut out and replaced, no chopping of chassis rails etc or large panels so the integrity structure is not effected.
The whole boot floor is cut out of the M5 donor so the required panels can be un picked from the original seams.
d_a_n1979 said:
Tommie38 said:
Great project OP.
Did the E39 M5 come with a steering box or hydraulic rack? I seem to remember the larger V8s coming with a box but I can’t be certain.
All V8s came with a box; the M5 had a better ration box, but still a boxDid the E39 M5 come with a steering box or hydraulic rack? I seem to remember the larger V8s coming with a box but I can’t be certain.
The dervs and I6 engined E39s all came with a rack (for me it's much better and that's why I've personally stuck with 530i E39s); but the M5 box does drive very well too and I certainly wouldn't turn down ownership of one if I got the chance
That said, E39 M5 has got to be up there as one of the best all rounders of all time, and you’d think BMW could get the steering set up properly.
Tommie38 said:
d_a_n1979 said:
Tommie38 said:
Great project OP.
Did the E39 M5 come with a steering box or hydraulic rack? I seem to remember the larger V8s coming with a box but I can’t be certain.
All V8s came with a box; the M5 had a better ration box, but still a boxDid the E39 M5 come with a steering box or hydraulic rack? I seem to remember the larger V8s coming with a box but I can’t be certain.
The dervs and I6 engined E39s all came with a rack (for me it's much better and that's why I've personally stuck with 530i E39s); but the M5 box does drive very well too and I certainly wouldn't turn down ownership of one if I got the chance
That said, E39 M5 has got to be up there as one of the best all rounders of all time, and you’d think BMW could get the steering set up properly.
The box isn't really as bad as the internet makes out, its more a case of that as there are other E39 models with a rack which is better, it automatically makes the ones with a box bad when they really aren't.
As mentioned the M5 uses a quicker ratio box over the standard V8 models and it also has variable assist which weights up the steering a bit when the sport button is pressed.
E28, E24, and E34's all used a box as well.
Looks great! I saw that green touring on ebay and it looked like a lovely buy. The steering boxes in these are great tbh, the rack is even better but the box is still brilliant for what it is and is absolutely not worth turning down for. Are you going to be removing the SLS rear suspension? If not, are you going to relocate the compressor etc if you cut out the boot floor? As far as I understood the saloon rear subframe isnt compatible with the touring but the diff and driveshafts are.
Green over tan/caramel is a fantastic combo. I’d be tempted to put prefacelift clear lights in - there was something very 90s-prototype-cool about them as the launch spec M5s and M5 touring prototype ran them. Would also recommend the OEM optional rear spoiler as well, which helps neaten up the rear profile of the touring.
In terms of the S62 it may be worth doing the rod bearings while the engine is out - whilst S62s aren’t as bad for them as S54s and S65/85s are, its still a known issue and much easier to do when engine is out - the price of S62 cranks is eye watering these days. Can’t wait to see this done and please post a walkaround / exhaust note video when its done!
Green over tan/caramel is a fantastic combo. I’d be tempted to put prefacelift clear lights in - there was something very 90s-prototype-cool about them as the launch spec M5s and M5 touring prototype ran them. Would also recommend the OEM optional rear spoiler as well, which helps neaten up the rear profile of the touring.
In terms of the S62 it may be worth doing the rod bearings while the engine is out - whilst S62s aren’t as bad for them as S54s and S65/85s are, its still a known issue and much easier to do when engine is out - the price of S62 cranks is eye watering these days. Can’t wait to see this done and please post a walkaround / exhaust note video when its done!
Gooly said:
Are you going to be removing the SLS rear suspension? If not, are you going to relocate the compressor etc if you cut out the boot floor? As far as I understood the saloon rear subframe isnt compatible with the touring but the diff and driveshafts are.
I will be keeping the SLS.You are correct, a saloon rear subframe is no use in a Touring as the tourings rear shock absorbers mount to the sub frame instead of the top of the inner rear wheel arches like the saloon.
Gooly said:
Green over tan/caramel is a fantastic combo. I’d be tempted to put prefacelift clear lights in - there was something very 90s-prototype-cool about them as the launch spec M5s and M5 touring prototype ran them. Would also recommend the OEM optional rear spoiler as well, which helps neaten up the rear profile of the touring.
My F82 is green over tan and I ordered it new like that.... I've started to develop a green over tan fetish in older age! The lights will be going back to clears as per all M5's, not sure on going pre facelift.
Gooly said:
In terms of the S62 it may be worth doing the rod bearings while the engine is out - whilst S62s aren’t as bad for them as S54s and S65/85s are, its still a known issue and much easier to do when engine is out - the price of S62 cranks is eye watering these days. Can’t wait to see this done and please post a walkaround / exhaust note video when its done!
We replace rod bearings on M power engines all the time and having rebuilt more than one S62 I know all their issues. If you scroll back through my posts on this thread you will see what I have planned for the engine.Carrying on with the stripping the M5 rear axle was harvested of its LSD, drive shafts, rear brake callipers and hub flanges.
I picked up a complete touring rear axle which was stripped down to the bare subframe, hubs and lower arms.
Above is a pic of what all non M5 rear sub frames are like where the rear of the diff mount is and below is a pic of how an M5 is constructed. The middle section is cut out and the two sections are tied to the main frame by tabs either side.
I had the M5 subframe difference replicated on to the touring subframe as well as having the front diff mount strengthened which is a common thing to do on supercharged M5's, made sense to do it while it was all stripped.
Subframe vapour blasted and all the bushes replaced with new. Touring for the rear pair and saloon for the front pair so I can use the M5's chassis brace struts that link to the transmission tunnel.
On to the LSD.....
Stripped apart to asses what state everything was in to find the bearings and gears ok but the clutch plates clearly worn.
New clutch plates, bearings, seals to build up in to a blasted and painted casing, vapour blasted back plate and electro plated nuts and bolts.
Trial fitting of the LSD into the modified subframe shows the clearance to the diff back plate. After watching various you tube videos and looking at pics on line it seems others have just ground down the bolt heads to allow some clearance which despite being at lot easier, is a bodge in my opinion.
So there we have it, a touring subframe with an M5 LSD fitted the factory way.
I picked up a complete touring rear axle which was stripped down to the bare subframe, hubs and lower arms.
Above is a pic of what all non M5 rear sub frames are like where the rear of the diff mount is and below is a pic of how an M5 is constructed. The middle section is cut out and the two sections are tied to the main frame by tabs either side.
I had the M5 subframe difference replicated on to the touring subframe as well as having the front diff mount strengthened which is a common thing to do on supercharged M5's, made sense to do it while it was all stripped.
Subframe vapour blasted and all the bushes replaced with new. Touring for the rear pair and saloon for the front pair so I can use the M5's chassis brace struts that link to the transmission tunnel.
On to the LSD.....
Stripped apart to asses what state everything was in to find the bearings and gears ok but the clutch plates clearly worn.
New clutch plates, bearings, seals to build up in to a blasted and painted casing, vapour blasted back plate and electro plated nuts and bolts.
Trial fitting of the LSD into the modified subframe shows the clearance to the diff back plate. After watching various you tube videos and looking at pics on line it seems others have just ground down the bolt heads to allow some clearance which despite being at lot easier, is a bodge in my opinion.
So there we have it, a touring subframe with an M5 LSD fitted the factory way.
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