Discussion
Mikeeb said:
You’re right the map may not be the fault. But the mapper was100% at fault for not supplying the RR data you paid for. And has stolen the map you paid him to write for you.
True. I guess the lesson there is a) I need to specify what I want / expect from the outset and with regard to the map itself, for whatever reason he feels convinced I wanted to give this to his competitors and were this true, which it most certainly is not, I guess I might feel the same. I think what set the tone for our email / message exchange was the assumption that my asking a few questions was an attempt to lay blame at his door. That and the disappointment / surprise of his not knowing what power my engine made or his being able to give me a print-out. I had just assumed both of these were the minimum anyone would expect when having an engine mapped.RichardM5 said:
So if he's taken the map back, do you get your money back too?
Evidently not. 
The response was that ARM were happy with his work and as it was they that had asked him to map my car, a refund ''wasn't appropriate''. He hasn't grasped that in taking that map back (without permission I might add) he has deprived me of my property and it is that which should entitle me to a refund. I'm just tired of the whole thing now though. I've been accused of tampering with settings, wanting to undermine his business and blatantly telling lies, none of which were true. Maybe in time he'll see that for himself but meanwhile, I need to write a letter to Santa and see if he can help me out? helix402 said:
I’m fairly sure the mapper is named earlier in the thread. However the failure isn’t necessarily due to his map.
A big end bearing failure is very unlikely to be the map yes but im more thinking for along the lines of what Mike has said. He doesnt sound like the sort of person that id want near my car with such a bad attitude and an unwillingness to help, or even provide the bare minimum you'd expect when paying him for his services.I'm surprised the engine builder hasnt offered to help in some way, even though as you say, Mark, its hard to see where the blame lies.
We are on the same path where the cars we are building take up a very large percentage of our incoming money and any unforeseen's become very testing! So i've got to applaud your attitude towards this, like i say i just hoped you had been closer and i'd have tried to help in some way.
e30m3Mark said:
Evidently not. The response was that ARM were happy with his work and as it was they that had asked him to map my car, a refund ''wasn't appropriate''. He hasn't grasped that in taking that map back (without permission I might add) he has deprived me of my property and it is that which should entitle me to a refund. I'm just tired of the whole thing now though. I've been accused of tampering with settings, wanting to undermine his business and blatantly telling lies, none of which were true. Maybe in time he'll see that for himself but meanwhile, I need to write a letter to Santa and see if he can help me out?
Think you need to write him a letter saying you'll go to the small claims court for your mapping costs as once the engine is rebuilt you can't use it without the goods (map) you have paid him for and has since been taken back by him without your permission. There is no argument for removing good/services that have been paid for without a refund. The response was that ARM were happy with his work and as it was they that had asked him to map my car, a refund ''wasn't appropriate''. He hasn't grasped that in taking that map back (without permission I might add) he has deprived me of my property and it is that which should entitle me to a refund. I'm just tired of the whole thing now though. I've been accused of tampering with settings, wanting to undermine his business and blatantly telling lies, none of which were true. Maybe in time he'll see that for himself but meanwhile, I need to write a letter to Santa and see if he can help me out? If he is a recommend mapper for ARM I can't imagine they will be happy with his conduct either. If the are I would have to question them too I'm afraid.
Thanks for the support chaps. I'm just going to leave the experience in the past and hopefully just learn a few lessons.
The bottom end should hopefully just need the crank to be reground, bores to be honed, new rods from Arrow, the CP pistons are OK to go again and obviously all new bolts / studs etc from ARP. I also want to run a larger oil cooler and possibly a larger capacity rad? If anyone has any advice? I want to make certain that track work doesn't mean the engine runs any hotter.
I have also been checking out the Stack dash display and intend going for the ST8100 below. Obviously they're not exactly cheap but they come with the loom, sensors etc and will mean I have both visual and audible alarms to help me keep an eye on things in future.
An added bonus is that I will also have a speedo once again come MOT time.
https://www.demon-tweeks.co.uk/motorsport/dash-dis...
I'm about the split one of the front wheels after buying a new front lip to replace the repaired one. I was never really happy with it and it'll be good to have a go at splitting and rebuilding the wheel myself. I still need to get a set of one piece winter wheels too.
The bottom end should hopefully just need the crank to be reground, bores to be honed, new rods from Arrow, the CP pistons are OK to go again and obviously all new bolts / studs etc from ARP. I also want to run a larger oil cooler and possibly a larger capacity rad? If anyone has any advice? I want to make certain that track work doesn't mean the engine runs any hotter.
I have also been checking out the Stack dash display and intend going for the ST8100 below. Obviously they're not exactly cheap but they come with the loom, sensors etc and will mean I have both visual and audible alarms to help me keep an eye on things in future.
An added bonus is that I will also have a speedo once again come MOT time.
https://www.demon-tweeks.co.uk/motorsport/dash-dis...
I'm about the split one of the front wheels after buying a new front lip to replace the repaired one. I was never really happy with it and it'll be good to have a go at splitting and rebuilding the wheel myself. I still need to get a set of one piece winter wheels too.
I can't personally comment on the oil cooler or oversized rad but it's not a bad shout to over engineer the parts that need to keep it lubed and cooled.
I'm surprised by the fact that you didn't go for big power and yet still experienced a failure like this. Still, it's all lessons to be learned one way or another. So long as the engine didn't completely lunch itself, that's the main thing. Got to be thankful for that.
Just imo Mark, but I would definitely be threatening small claims in order to get a refund on that map. That guy sounds like a right cowboy muppet of a clown and shouldn't be let off with treating a customer in the way he did.
I'm surprised by the fact that you didn't go for big power and yet still experienced a failure like this. Still, it's all lessons to be learned one way or another. So long as the engine didn't completely lunch itself, that's the main thing. Got to be thankful for that.
Just imo Mark, but I would definitely be threatening small claims in order to get a refund on that map. That guy sounds like a right cowboy muppet of a clown and shouldn't be let off with treating a customer in the way he did.
Mark,
Stock radiators were used in DTM until 1991 I believe and I (with 275bhp) don't have any water temp issues on track regardless of ambient temps.
Oil temps can get high on E30 M3s when used on track, but it is specific to normal circumstances. Usually lots of acceleration in low gears with high ambient temps. Obviously the faster you go he more airflow you get.
I would leave the oil cooling as stock for now. Monitor oil temps on track and if you start breaking 125degC regularly, you might want to consider doing something.
1, The cheapest thing you can do is slow down for a lap, otherwise consideration should be given to the airflow through the stock oil cooler.
2, make sure you fill oil up to the first kink on the dipstick. More oil capacity has the capacity to absorb more heat.
3, As stock, it sits too close to the lower cross member, restricting exit flow. Space it away and fit some ducting to better manage air flow goes a long way.
4, You can use a M635CSi oil cooler. You need to modify/change the mounting brackets and get some new hoses made, but point 3 still applies.
5, Use a GrpA type sump for more capacity. £1000 though!!!!
6, Lastly, you can get a Grp A oil filter head, or a thermostat delete for yours. This improves oil flow through the cooler at the expense of a slow oil warm up.
LIke I said, you should try it first and see what you need. You can always slow down or use a higher gear to keep the revs down.
It is interesting to see how driving faster/better reduces oil temps. On my first Oulton Park trackday, I was getting to know the circuit and slowing too much for some of the bends, therefore using a gear lower in some corners than I needed. This increased revs at a lower speed and oil temps were in the 115-120deg C range. As I got better and started carrying more speed through the bends and in some bends using a higher gear because of the higher speed, oil temps dropped to 110degC despite the ambient rising throughout the day,
Stock radiators were used in DTM until 1991 I believe and I (with 275bhp) don't have any water temp issues on track regardless of ambient temps.
Oil temps can get high on E30 M3s when used on track, but it is specific to normal circumstances. Usually lots of acceleration in low gears with high ambient temps. Obviously the faster you go he more airflow you get.
I would leave the oil cooling as stock for now. Monitor oil temps on track and if you start breaking 125degC regularly, you might want to consider doing something.
1, The cheapest thing you can do is slow down for a lap, otherwise consideration should be given to the airflow through the stock oil cooler.
2, make sure you fill oil up to the first kink on the dipstick. More oil capacity has the capacity to absorb more heat.
3, As stock, it sits too close to the lower cross member, restricting exit flow. Space it away and fit some ducting to better manage air flow goes a long way.
4, You can use a M635CSi oil cooler. You need to modify/change the mounting brackets and get some new hoses made, but point 3 still applies.
5, Use a GrpA type sump for more capacity. £1000 though!!!!
6, Lastly, you can get a Grp A oil filter head, or a thermostat delete for yours. This improves oil flow through the cooler at the expense of a slow oil warm up.
LIke I said, you should try it first and see what you need. You can always slow down or use a higher gear to keep the revs down.
It is interesting to see how driving faster/better reduces oil temps. On my first Oulton Park trackday, I was getting to know the circuit and slowing too much for some of the bends, therefore using a gear lower in some corners than I needed. This increased revs at a lower speed and oil temps were in the 115-120deg C range. As I got better and started carrying more speed through the bends and in some bends using a higher gear because of the higher speed, oil temps dropped to 110degC despite the ambient rising throughout the day,
Thanks for that Steve. I was going to mail and ask for your advice but figured you could use a break! 
I have a Mishimoto rad fitted (have had them in a couple of previous stock M3) and although I know some folk have had issues, mine has been OK. I did consider replacing it though, just to be sure, so had figured something like a 20% capacity increase wouldn't hurt? I'll certainly look at spacing it out and ducting though. At least I will be able to keep a more accurate and detailed record of temperatures with the Stack dash and I'd planned to specify the replay feature.
I have a bigger capacity sump already but was thinking of going with this cooler in addition.
https://store.vacmotorsports.com/vac-performance--...
Can I ask what tyres you run? I'm looking at what to get to replace the current 215/40 & 235/40 x 17's.
I have a Mishimoto rad fitted (have had them in a couple of previous stock M3) and although I know some folk have had issues, mine has been OK. I did consider replacing it though, just to be sure, so had figured something like a 20% capacity increase wouldn't hurt? I'll certainly look at spacing it out and ducting though. At least I will be able to keep a more accurate and detailed record of temperatures with the Stack dash and I'd planned to specify the replay feature.
I have a bigger capacity sump already but was thinking of going with this cooler in addition.
https://store.vacmotorsports.com/vac-performance--...
Can I ask what tyres you run? I'm looking at what to get to replace the current 215/40 & 235/40 x 17's.
It is the oil cooler airflow you need to consider, not the rad. Stock rad is ample in the UK environment. Southern Europe ad the States, yeah it might be marginal. I did Croft in July, with 27-28degC air temps without issue.
Do a search on s14.net and s14power.com for ideas on oil cooler airflow.
I wouldn't throw any significant money at it yet. Sort the airflow and try it. If it is not good enough on the day, slow down when temps get too high and make some steps for the next time.
Personally, with the power you have and the rpm you will use, I can't see you having any problems.
Do a search on s14.net and s14power.com for ideas on oil cooler airflow.
I wouldn't throw any significant money at it yet. Sort the airflow and try it. If it is not good enough on the day, slow down when temps get too high and make some steps for the next time.
Personally, with the power you have and the rpm you will use, I can't see you having any problems.
Well thanks to someone on here, I have another set of ITB's which are sat here waiting on the courier to take them to JC Racing in Thirsk. All being well they'll be 'as new' in a couple of weeks and the new TPS can go on with the correct adaptor.
The engine is still off being rebuilt. Hopefully it won't be too much longer till it comes back but am currently searching for +75 main bearings. If anyone knows a supplier please shout.
The engine is still off being rebuilt. Hopefully it won't be too much longer till it comes back but am currently searching for +75 main bearings. If anyone knows a supplier please shout.
e30m3Mark said:
Well thanks to someone on here, I have another set of ITB's which are sat here waiting on the courier to take them to JC Racing in Thirsk. All being well they'll be 'as new' in a couple of weeks and the new TPS can go on with the correct adaptor.
The engine is still off being rebuilt. Hopefully it won't be too much longer till it comes back but am currently searching for +75 main bearings. If anyone knows a supplier please shout.
Tried these for bearings ?The engine is still off being rebuilt. Hopefully it won't be too much longer till it comes back but am currently searching for +75 main bearings. If anyone knows a supplier please shout.
https://fpsdistribution.com/products/engine-and-fu...
e30m3Mark said:
Well thanks to someone on here, I have another set of ITB's which are sat here waiting on the courier to take them to JC Racing in Thirsk. All being well they'll be 'as new' in a couple of weeks and the new TPS can go on with the correct adaptor.
The engine is still off being rebuilt. Hopefully it won't be too much longer till it comes back but am currently searching for +75 main bearings. If anyone knows a supplier please shout.
Ask Russ at JC Racing or Alistair at Amac Engineering (01609779600), should be able to sort you bearings out, i've had to run them in mine.The engine is still off being rebuilt. Hopefully it won't be too much longer till it comes back but am currently searching for +75 main bearings. If anyone knows a supplier please shout.
Thanks guys. In fact, thanks to all who've offered advice and apologies if have been a nuisance.
Rods and ITB are all now with JC Racing and new mains are on route from Germany.
Just waiting on a call from Stack re the dash I plan to run with. It's not exactly ideal timing, being just 5 weeks till Christmas, so looks like I'll be doing plenty of overtime.
Rods and ITB are all now with JC Racing and new mains are on route from Germany.
Just waiting on a call from Stack re the dash I plan to run with. It's not exactly ideal timing, being just 5 weeks till Christmas, so looks like I'll be doing plenty of overtime.
Well I owe a massive thank you to the good folk at STACK and Autometer in the USA, who are supplying one of their ST8100 dash display kits for my car. The intention is to put together an installation video on their behalf and show the benefit of running an accurate display and sensors.
Unfortunately, there was a bank holiday in Germany last week and I am still waiting on the new main bearings but hopefully they'll arrive any day now. C3 always come through with their parts supply. The OE rods are being shot peened, balanced etc at JCR and should also be here within another day or two.
I'm going to take the split rim alloys off for the next few months and re fit the Compomotive TH. They need powder coating and some new tyres fitting first though, as they're currently white and I don't like them on a red car. I'm undecided re tyres, although Federal 595 have always been pretty good for the money and I'll stick with staggered 235/40 and 215/40, although I know lots of people don't approve of staggered wheel and tyre combinations on the E30 M3.
Realistically I can't see the car being back this side of the New Year though.
Unfortunately, there was a bank holiday in Germany last week and I am still waiting on the new main bearings but hopefully they'll arrive any day now. C3 always come through with their parts supply. The OE rods are being shot peened, balanced etc at JCR and should also be here within another day or two.
I'm going to take the split rim alloys off for the next few months and re fit the Compomotive TH. They need powder coating and some new tyres fitting first though, as they're currently white and I don't like them on a red car. I'm undecided re tyres, although Federal 595 have always been pretty good for the money and I'll stick with staggered 235/40 and 215/40, although I know lots of people don't approve of staggered wheel and tyre combinations on the E30 M3.
Realistically I can't see the car being back this side of the New Year though.
e30m3Mark said:
Yes, I must admit I do love the look myself.
I'd hoped to have my con rods back from JC Racing by now. Unfortunately DHL appear to have lost them! How unlucky can one person be?
I'd hoped to have my con rods back from JC Racing by now. Unfortunately DHL appear to have lost them! How unlucky can one person be?
not good! Im hoping DHL will be reimbursing somehow! I'm sure youll have a good turn sometime soon matey!Well there's still no sign of my con rods so I am hoping that DHL will throw some cash my way. Arrow have there's in stock so they would be an acceptable replacement.
I'm still looking at tyres but they may well have to wait if I'm covering the cost of the replacement rods. DHL want a few weeks to allow mine to turn up but I simply refuse to delay the engine build for so long.
Stack have been fantastic and hopefully my dash display will be ready to ship this week. I want to get a carbon fibre panel to mount it within the dash board and mount buttons to scroll through the various functions. It will be great to have a functioning fuel gauge again!
I'm still looking at tyres but they may well have to wait if I'm covering the cost of the replacement rods. DHL want a few weeks to allow mine to turn up but I simply refuse to delay the engine build for so long.
Stack have been fantastic and hopefully my dash display will be ready to ship this week. I want to get a carbon fibre panel to mount it within the dash board and mount buttons to scroll through the various functions. It will be great to have a functioning fuel gauge again!
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