2007 Audi A6 (C6) Allroad 4.2 FSI
Discussion
Greetings from Italy,
long time lurker here. pardon me in advance since English is not my native language.
So... afters six years spent driving SUVs (a 4.6 P38 - incredibly faultless! - a 3.0TD6 L322 and a Lexus RX300), sided by a R230 SL500 (the most unreliable car I've ever owned), I decided I wanted something with a bit more grunt.
First idea was to get a L320 Range Rover Sport with the supercharged engine, but there aren't many here because of Italy's absurd taxation, and most have high mileage. Priority was a "real" 4WD since I have a second houe in the mountains and I use it a lot. Fuel consumption was not an issue since I do less than 10.000kms/year. Space was welcome, as was some "usable" power, so I discharged immediately stuff like AMGs, BMW Ms and so on. SUVs and estates were welcome since although me and my wife have no kids, we tend to do long trips in our cars for holidays and bring a lot of stuff with us.
Took my time browsing ads, sold the Lexus, and then, four weeks ago, a friend of mine called me and told me that there was this curio:
What? An Audi? I guess you must own one at some point in your life, and being 43...
Never heard about the fact that the C6 Allroad was equipped with the 4.2FSI lump: I knew that the C5 one and early C6 A6s had the old 4.2 with indirect injection and timing belt, but this one... I was intrigued.
Browsing the net for informations was no joy, though: the car seems to be some sort of unicorn. Not much data about chassis tweaks (more on it later), no reviews.
However I decided to give it a go and have a look: upon inspection it turned out to be a very good one-owner example, and very well serviced: 132.000 kms with Audi FSH, last bill was some 4.000€ (including four discs and both FSI pumps), it had only a couple of cosmetic damages and different tyres front to rear.
The car was owned by a collector of 40 (!) and was sitting unused since January 2017.
I gave it a test and was sincerely impressed (more later). Negotiated a ridicolous price (7.500€) and on september 14th I became her second owner.
So, how is it to drive?
A friend of mine used to own a 3.0 TDI one which I happened to drive a lot, so since the official weight is the same as the 4.2 FSI I can use it as a comparison.
Surely the 4.2 must have undergone some suspension tweaks: compared to the 3.0TDI it feels immensely more connected to the road, and a bit firmer. It still is a greatly comfortable car, very refined?
The biggest surprise comes, of course, from the engine. Compared to the one on the RS4 (the 420hp one), it has a lot more torque on low and mid range. It revs up to circa 6800rpm with no noticeable drop of torque or power up to the redline.
Throttle response is immediate through all of the rev range. Gearbox (6-speed ZF with torque converter) is ok, only slightly slow on downshifts when operated through paddles.
Air suspensions can be loweren and apparently slightly firmed up through MMI, but TBH I didn't notice that much difference.
Fuel consumption was another surprise, at least out of town: a few days ago, on the BC, I was able to read an average 9,6lt/100kms on a long and steady cruise on the highway at an indicated 140km/h.
Next monday the car is scheduled for a major service and new tyres: the only thing I couldn't figure out was the gearbox oil quantity... anyone?
Thanks for reading!
long time lurker here. pardon me in advance since English is not my native language.
So... afters six years spent driving SUVs (a 4.6 P38 - incredibly faultless! - a 3.0TD6 L322 and a Lexus RX300), sided by a R230 SL500 (the most unreliable car I've ever owned), I decided I wanted something with a bit more grunt.
First idea was to get a L320 Range Rover Sport with the supercharged engine, but there aren't many here because of Italy's absurd taxation, and most have high mileage. Priority was a "real" 4WD since I have a second houe in the mountains and I use it a lot. Fuel consumption was not an issue since I do less than 10.000kms/year. Space was welcome, as was some "usable" power, so I discharged immediately stuff like AMGs, BMW Ms and so on. SUVs and estates were welcome since although me and my wife have no kids, we tend to do long trips in our cars for holidays and bring a lot of stuff with us.
Took my time browsing ads, sold the Lexus, and then, four weeks ago, a friend of mine called me and told me that there was this curio:
What? An Audi? I guess you must own one at some point in your life, and being 43...
Never heard about the fact that the C6 Allroad was equipped with the 4.2FSI lump: I knew that the C5 one and early C6 A6s had the old 4.2 with indirect injection and timing belt, but this one... I was intrigued.
Browsing the net for informations was no joy, though: the car seems to be some sort of unicorn. Not much data about chassis tweaks (more on it later), no reviews.
However I decided to give it a go and have a look: upon inspection it turned out to be a very good one-owner example, and very well serviced: 132.000 kms with Audi FSH, last bill was some 4.000€ (including four discs and both FSI pumps), it had only a couple of cosmetic damages and different tyres front to rear.
The car was owned by a collector of 40 (!) and was sitting unused since January 2017.
I gave it a test and was sincerely impressed (more later). Negotiated a ridicolous price (7.500€) and on september 14th I became her second owner.
So, how is it to drive?
A friend of mine used to own a 3.0 TDI one which I happened to drive a lot, so since the official weight is the same as the 4.2 FSI I can use it as a comparison.
Surely the 4.2 must have undergone some suspension tweaks: compared to the 3.0TDI it feels immensely more connected to the road, and a bit firmer. It still is a greatly comfortable car, very refined?
The biggest surprise comes, of course, from the engine. Compared to the one on the RS4 (the 420hp one), it has a lot more torque on low and mid range. It revs up to circa 6800rpm with no noticeable drop of torque or power up to the redline.
Throttle response is immediate through all of the rev range. Gearbox (6-speed ZF with torque converter) is ok, only slightly slow on downshifts when operated through paddles.
Air suspensions can be loweren and apparently slightly firmed up through MMI, but TBH I didn't notice that much difference.
Fuel consumption was another surprise, at least out of town: a few days ago, on the BC, I was able to read an average 9,6lt/100kms on a long and steady cruise on the highway at an indicated 140km/h.
Next monday the car is scheduled for a major service and new tyres: the only thing I couldn't figure out was the gearbox oil quantity... anyone?
Thanks for reading!
Edited by maestronakagata on Thursday 4th October 10:06
Edited by maestronakagata on Thursday 4th October 10:06
Edited by maestronakagata on Thursday 4th October 10:07
OK, I'm officially jealous. Always loved the Allroad, and always hated the largely diesel availability. It is so hard to find one of the newer models with a petrol engine, bar the A4 Allroad with the 2.0 TFSI which, let's face it, is just a tarted up A4 Quattro.
Yours looks extremely clean! What is the rated engine output? Again, very jealous. Keep us updated!
Yours looks extremely clean! What is the rated engine output? Again, very jealous. Keep us updated!
I've got another unicorn! Not an Allroad though.
C6 4.2FSI in SE spec. Not sure how many exist, but can't be many. It's a brilliant car. Fast, comfortable, can take 4 bikes plus camping kit inside, and great in the snow.
Wish it looked a bit more like your Allroad though. I love the grille on yours.
C6 4.2FSI in SE spec. Not sure how many exist, but can't be many. It's a brilliant car. Fast, comfortable, can take 4 bikes plus camping kit inside, and great in the snow.
Wish it looked a bit more like your Allroad though. I love the grille on yours.
Resolutionary said:
OK, I'm officially jealous. Always loved the Allroad, and always hated the largely diesel availability. It is so hard to find one of the newer models with a petrol engine, bar the A4 Allroad with the 2.0 TFSI which, let's face it, is just a tarted up A4 Quattro.
Yours looks extremely clean! What is the rated engine output? Again, very jealous. Keep us updated!
Cheers Resolutionary, thank you!Yours looks extremely clean! What is the rated engine output? Again, very jealous. Keep us updated!
Output (metric) is 257kw/350hp and 440nm.
Agree with you on the A4 Allroad. IIRC it lacks air suspensions which IMHO are a game changer in ride quality, although a bit of a PITA in case of repair.
rayyan171 said:
Absolutely love it. We have a facelift V6 TFSI and are loving it. What MPG are you getting? Would be interesting to see if you get more or less, we average around 16-20mpg in the city and get about 400-450 miles from a full 80L tank on the motorway.
Cheers rayyan,not tried on a full tank but refill-to-refill. Apparently it goes from 9 to 12 liters /100km on highway, and at least half of that in town.
Usget said:
I've got another unicorn! Not an Allroad though.
C6 4.2FSI in SE spec. Not sure how many exist, but can't be many. It's a brilliant car. Fast, comfortable, can take 4 bikes plus camping kit inside, and great in the snow.
Wish it looked a bit more like your Allroad though. I love the grille on yours.
Wow Usget, that is surely more a unicorn than mine! I mean... I always thought that te normal A6 was only equipped with the non-FSI engine! Absolutely a peach?C6 4.2FSI in SE spec. Not sure how many exist, but can't be many. It's a brilliant car. Fast, comfortable, can take 4 bikes plus camping kit inside, and great in the snow.
Wish it looked a bit more like your Allroad though. I love the grille on yours.
How would you describe throttle response and torque/power delivery? Is your car equipped with air suspension?
No, it's coil sprung. I guess this was both a blessing and a curse. It's obviously not as comfortable as the air-sprung model would have been, but there's less to go wrong. I expect yours is a far nicer drive.
I find the power delivery to be smooth and revvy. With the gearbox in S, it revs happily to the red line. It can occasionally be lumpy on cold starts, but it's a 10 year old V8 so I kind of expect that.
Regarding rarity, I have seen a couple of saloon FSIs for sale but this is the only Avant I've ever seen.
I find the power delivery to be smooth and revvy. With the gearbox in S, it revs happily to the red line. It can occasionally be lumpy on cold starts, but it's a 10 year old V8 so I kind of expect that.
Regarding rarity, I have seen a couple of saloon FSIs for sale but this is the only Avant I've ever seen.
Usget said:
No, it's coil sprung. I guess this was both a blessing and a curse. It's obviously not as comfortable as the air-sprung model would have been, but there's less to go wrong. I expect yours is a far nicer drive.
I find the power delivery to be smooth and revvy. With the gearbox in S, it revs happily to the red line. It can occasionally be lumpy on cold starts, but it's a 10 year old V8 so I kind of expect that.
Regarding rarity, I have seen a couple of saloon FSIs for sale but this is the only Avant I've ever seen.
I agree on the rev-happy attitude of the engine, too bad it's a bit muted on the exhaust. What I find annoying, though, is the fact that the cockpit display is definetly unreliable in telling you the actual gear in manual mode.I find the power delivery to be smooth and revvy. With the gearbox in S, it revs happily to the red line. It can occasionally be lumpy on cold starts, but it's a 10 year old V8 so I kind of expect that.
Regarding rarity, I have seen a couple of saloon FSIs for sale but this is the only Avant I've ever seen.
A question: ever experienced problems with central locking? This mornin I opened the car via the remote, and all doors but the front driver side one opened. Had to open it manually with the key. The problem has disappeared.
Time for an update!
Finally yesterday I've been able to take the car to my trusted indy for a full service. It's still there (more later), but the list is quite long:
- full visual inspection (already done, but hey-ho);
- engine oil and oil filter;
- air filter and cabin filters;
- spark plugs;
- gearbox service.
So far, the car has been fine except for a tempermental driver side central locking mechanism and a random limp mode on air suspension. Since both of them seem to disappear once I restart the car, we tend to believe that a full reset on the electronics may cure these glitches. After all the central locking still works and there are no plays in the air suspension level sensors.
We decided, as a precaution, to change engine oil grade from 5W-.30 to 5-W40 and see how it goes.
Upon changhing the plugs, the indy noticed that all of them were not fully tightened, but they wore out correctly.
I also decided to change tyres and opted for all-weather Vredestein Quatrac 5 and a full alignment.
Undercarriage looks good:
Unfortunately, not everything was good: while the indy started to service the gearbox (found an official ZF servicing kit on the bay at a bargain), we found this:
A close inspection to the gearbox oil filter revealed that in was made in... 2006. Yup, although I have an invoice claiming that the gearbox was serviced at 88.000kms, it wasn't. To say I'm f@#king p#@€ed off is an understatement.
I should get the car back later in the afternoon. Stay tuned!
Finally yesterday I've been able to take the car to my trusted indy for a full service. It's still there (more later), but the list is quite long:
- full visual inspection (already done, but hey-ho);
- engine oil and oil filter;
- air filter and cabin filters;
- spark plugs;
- gearbox service.
So far, the car has been fine except for a tempermental driver side central locking mechanism and a random limp mode on air suspension. Since both of them seem to disappear once I restart the car, we tend to believe that a full reset on the electronics may cure these glitches. After all the central locking still works and there are no plays in the air suspension level sensors.
We decided, as a precaution, to change engine oil grade from 5W-.30 to 5-W40 and see how it goes.
Upon changhing the plugs, the indy noticed that all of them were not fully tightened, but they wore out correctly.
I also decided to change tyres and opted for all-weather Vredestein Quatrac 5 and a full alignment.
Undercarriage looks good:
Unfortunately, not everything was good: while the indy started to service the gearbox (found an official ZF servicing kit on the bay at a bargain), we found this:
A close inspection to the gearbox oil filter revealed that in was made in... 2006. Yup, although I have an invoice claiming that the gearbox was serviced at 88.000kms, it wasn't. To say I'm f@#king p#@€ed off is an understatement.
I should get the car back later in the afternoon. Stay tuned!
Time for a sad update.
On saturday 13 I picked up the car at the workshop after having the notorious oil leak at the base of the oil filter casing repaired. We changed some vacuum tubes, the coolant reservoir and a HP fuel pump that literally blew up in front of us when we started the engine after reassembly.
A fwe minutes later I was driving home enjoying the engine smoothness and low-down grunt when all of the car started to shake horribly. "EPC" light on, almost no power and thing that I didn't know existed shaking. Called the mechanic and managed to take the car back to the shop, which was one kilometer away.
What you are looking at is one of the most bizarre forms of harakiri an engine can do:
What happened? Thanks to Audi's "long life" stupid idea, and thanks to Audi workshop that used questionable oil, a lot of sludge formed in the engine during these years. Some of this sludge managed to find it's way to the oil line that goes to the RH bank, cutting off oil feed the head. Consequently, the intake camshaft blocked and ruined part of the head and all of 8 intake valvles.
I'm going to rebuild the engine. The price for a new one is a joke (around € 25.000), and luckily I found a new head with assembled camshafts at the ridiculous price of € 1.000 (versus 6500). The engine is going to be completely disassembled, cleaned and we're going to change all of the ancilliaries like chains, water pump, seals, piston rings and maybe the bearings if we don't like how the old look.
I'm going to spend some 5000€ on it, but I think it's worth it.
On saturday 13 I picked up the car at the workshop after having the notorious oil leak at the base of the oil filter casing repaired. We changed some vacuum tubes, the coolant reservoir and a HP fuel pump that literally blew up in front of us when we started the engine after reassembly.
A fwe minutes later I was driving home enjoying the engine smoothness and low-down grunt when all of the car started to shake horribly. "EPC" light on, almost no power and thing that I didn't know existed shaking. Called the mechanic and managed to take the car back to the shop, which was one kilometer away.
What you are looking at is one of the most bizarre forms of harakiri an engine can do:
What happened? Thanks to Audi's "long life" stupid idea, and thanks to Audi workshop that used questionable oil, a lot of sludge formed in the engine during these years. Some of this sludge managed to find it's way to the oil line that goes to the RH bank, cutting off oil feed the head. Consequently, the intake camshaft blocked and ruined part of the head and all of 8 intake valvles.
I'm going to rebuild the engine. The price for a new one is a joke (around € 25.000), and luckily I found a new head with assembled camshafts at the ridiculous price of € 1.000 (versus 6500). The engine is going to be completely disassembled, cleaned and we're going to change all of the ancilliaries like chains, water pump, seals, piston rings and maybe the bearings if we don't like how the old look.
I'm going to spend some 5000€ on it, but I think it's worth it.
Edited by maestronakagata on Monday 22 April 18:40
What a shame! Sad to see the engine go this way. If you are already going this deep into a repair, bearings would be recommended to do anyway as it would ensure no further issues in the future of the car. Luckily, there can be had a lot of parts for this engine as it was very common in many Audi's in the US, the 4.2 was widespread over there in the A6, A8 and Q7. Would recommend doing that to avoid higher costs for sourcing parts in Europe, albeit be careful as import charges may balance out the savings made.
rayyan171 said:
What a shame! Sad to see the engine go this way. If you are already going this deep into a repair, bearings would be recommended to do anyway as it would ensure no further issues in the future of the car. Luckily, there can be had a lot of parts for this engine as it was very common in many Audi's in the US, the 4.2 was widespread over there in the A6, A8 and Q7. Would recommend doing that to avoid higher costs for sourcing parts in Europe, albeit be careful as import charges may balance out the savings made.
TBH, so far I've been lucky with prices: new head ith cams for €1000 instead of 6500, Febi Bilstein cam chains (4) kit for €500, Dayco fuel pump for €100, and so on (complete gasket kit, OEM, for 250). I think I'll stick for OE stuff when it comes to bearings and rings, and fortunately I have a friend who works in a VAG dealership who can provide me the parts with the same discount they get.maestronakagata said:
TBH, so far I've been lucky with prices: new head ith cams for €1000 instead of 6500, Febi Bilstein cam chains (4) kit for €500, Dayco fuel pump for €100, and so on (complete gasket kit, OEM, for 250). I think I'll stick for OE stuff when it comes to bearings and rings, and fortunately I have a friend who works in a VAG dealership who can provide me the parts with the same discount they get.
Good luck! Too good of a car to lose!
Time for an update. Did anyone mention hypnotic timing chain setup?
So... engine complete and undergoind timing alignment. Needed to source Audi special tools for timing, but so far so good. You may notice that it's a quite over-engineered engine.
Also, decided to treat the girl with new Zimmermann drilled discs and specific pads, plus Goodridge steel braided hoses, and... well... a cruise control retrofit kit (got two speed tickets).
We also decided to switch to Shell Helix Ultra 5W-40 oil as per Robert Sikkens's reccomendation.
I hope to get the hearse back in a couple of weeks (specialist is a friend and takes his time to do things properly and save me some money).
So... engine complete and undergoind timing alignment. Needed to source Audi special tools for timing, but so far so good. You may notice that it's a quite over-engineered engine.
Also, decided to treat the girl with new Zimmermann drilled discs and specific pads, plus Goodridge steel braided hoses, and... well... a cruise control retrofit kit (got two speed tickets).
We also decided to switch to Shell Helix Ultra 5W-40 oil as per Robert Sikkens's reccomendation.
I hope to get the hearse back in a couple of weeks (specialist is a friend and takes his time to do things properly and save me some money).
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