Bring that Beat back... 1991 Honda Beat
Discussion
My search for pre 2000, roof down, cheap driving thrills is over. I've been lucky enough to have some fairly focussed drivers cars over the years and have been looking for a cheap small toy ever since selling my very temperamental Honda'd Elise.
Ideally I would love something classic like a Frogeye Sprite or a Westfield 11 but current funds just don't allow a classic toy in that price range. Also don't get me wrong I love faster exciting cars but like many I now hanker for a real back to basics driving experience that is involving and feels fast but actually isn't, I'm after the sensations without the license losing potential and something which will work well on small Essex B roads, I have other options if I want to get somewhere in a hurry or a speed fix.
A mk.1 MX5 is the obvious choice or maybe MR2 roadster but both just a tad predictable ? Sheddy MG midgets almost just in budget, but I wanted something different.
Whilst walking through Pimlico in my lunch break I spotted this tiny car parked up, it was as they say a bit of a eureka moment, next was back to the office and on to Google, Youtube, Autotrader and subsequently the UK Honda Beat forum for sale section, interestingly Pistonheads search shows up very little about them.
Like many on here I consider myself quite knowledgable on 90's sports cars but truth is I had all but forgotten about the Honda Beat, to me the Suzuki Cappuccino is the small Japanese kei sporty car that springs to mind and I am a fan. After some Youtubing, mostly of excited Americans thrashing the little 3 cylinder 660cc n/a Honda to 9,000 rpm I was getting further drawn in, then someone mentioned 'mini NSX' and at that point I had to have one !
So I have ended up with a very tired looking 1991 Honda Beat with 179,000 kilometers on the clock which has sat for 4 years outside and unloved, little or no history and apparently smoked like a trooper before being laid up. I paid £550 for the car and £200 for new hood which has never been fitted. At this point no doubt someone will point out I could have bought a half decent one for circa. £3-4k, well maybe soon I will wish I had ! But where's the fun in that ? As always with my man maths the initial low outlay won out plus I feel like I am saving it from the scrap heap.
I now have to hands up that I will not be doing the work, sadly I just do not have the room, the time or most importantly the talent, so enter a mate who among other things is just about to finish restoring a lovely little 70's Innocenti Mini and in need of another project, he may regret saying that last bit...
The car was picked up last week and sent to Peters place for thorough examination, intention is to check it for rot and then repair, engine out and rebuild with new valve stem seals and piston rings, suspension and brake refresh. I had toyed with chopping the windscreen off and going for aero screens to really enhance the experience but actually I'd like to try it as is first so that maybe a job for another day when I get bored.
The good news is Honda have started to make some spares again for the Beat which should help a lot, but in the meantime anyone on here speak or read japanese or know about buying 2nd spares off japanese auction sites ?
So here it is, the last car signed off by the late great Soichiro Honda.
Further updates coming soon...
Ideally I would love something classic like a Frogeye Sprite or a Westfield 11 but current funds just don't allow a classic toy in that price range. Also don't get me wrong I love faster exciting cars but like many I now hanker for a real back to basics driving experience that is involving and feels fast but actually isn't, I'm after the sensations without the license losing potential and something which will work well on small Essex B roads, I have other options if I want to get somewhere in a hurry or a speed fix.
A mk.1 MX5 is the obvious choice or maybe MR2 roadster but both just a tad predictable ? Sheddy MG midgets almost just in budget, but I wanted something different.
Whilst walking through Pimlico in my lunch break I spotted this tiny car parked up, it was as they say a bit of a eureka moment, next was back to the office and on to Google, Youtube, Autotrader and subsequently the UK Honda Beat forum for sale section, interestingly Pistonheads search shows up very little about them.
Like many on here I consider myself quite knowledgable on 90's sports cars but truth is I had all but forgotten about the Honda Beat, to me the Suzuki Cappuccino is the small Japanese kei sporty car that springs to mind and I am a fan. After some Youtubing, mostly of excited Americans thrashing the little 3 cylinder 660cc n/a Honda to 9,000 rpm I was getting further drawn in, then someone mentioned 'mini NSX' and at that point I had to have one !
So I have ended up with a very tired looking 1991 Honda Beat with 179,000 kilometers on the clock which has sat for 4 years outside and unloved, little or no history and apparently smoked like a trooper before being laid up. I paid £550 for the car and £200 for new hood which has never been fitted. At this point no doubt someone will point out I could have bought a half decent one for circa. £3-4k, well maybe soon I will wish I had ! But where's the fun in that ? As always with my man maths the initial low outlay won out plus I feel like I am saving it from the scrap heap.
I now have to hands up that I will not be doing the work, sadly I just do not have the room, the time or most importantly the talent, so enter a mate who among other things is just about to finish restoring a lovely little 70's Innocenti Mini and in need of another project, he may regret saying that last bit...
The car was picked up last week and sent to Peters place for thorough examination, intention is to check it for rot and then repair, engine out and rebuild with new valve stem seals and piston rings, suspension and brake refresh. I had toyed with chopping the windscreen off and going for aero screens to really enhance the experience but actually I'd like to try it as is first so that maybe a job for another day when I get bored.
The good news is Honda have started to make some spares again for the Beat which should help a lot, but in the meantime anyone on here speak or read japanese or know about buying 2nd spares off japanese auction sites ?
So here it is, the last car signed off by the late great Soichiro Honda.
Further updates coming soon...
Thanks for all the comments. Regarding the styling it was by Pininfarina I think.
The seats are staying they were part of what sold it to me, I mean come on 90's zebra/ tiger print ! Sadly they are in a bit of a state so will need some work.
Thanks for all advice on buying from Japan, I've found a few of the proxy websites to buy on my behalf so will give one a try.
UK Honda dealers can source parts too, I am led to believe that an exhaust is £165 but with a 3 month wait...
Prices vary a lot, a decent looking yellow Beat sold a few weeks ago on ebay for sub £3k, I prefer silver and wanted the pepperpot alloys.
Anyway back to some pics and what we have discovered so far...
In it's new home
Dread to think what's in here, hopefully brake fluid
New hood in dark blue
Boot is more of a glove box and a third of it is lost to battery !
Air filter off shows been breathing a bit of oil, 3 inlets for the MTREC individual throttle bodies
Up front under the spare wheel are rad and aircon condenser which I think we will ditch to save weight, oh and lots of snails...
First job is remove the boot lid and roof to make access a little easier
The seats are staying they were part of what sold it to me, I mean come on 90's zebra/ tiger print ! Sadly they are in a bit of a state so will need some work.
Thanks for all advice on buying from Japan, I've found a few of the proxy websites to buy on my behalf so will give one a try.
UK Honda dealers can source parts too, I am led to believe that an exhaust is £165 but with a 3 month wait...
Prices vary a lot, a decent looking yellow Beat sold a few weeks ago on ebay for sub £3k, I prefer silver and wanted the pepperpot alloys.
Anyway back to some pics and what we have discovered so far...
In it's new home
Dread to think what's in here, hopefully brake fluid
New hood in dark blue
Boot is more of a glove box and a third of it is lost to battery !
Air filter off shows been breathing a bit of oil, 3 inlets for the MTREC individual throttle bodies
Up front under the spare wheel are rad and aircon condenser which I think we will ditch to save weight, oh and lots of snails...
First job is remove the boot lid and roof to make access a little easier
Edited by Rocket. on Wednesday 26th September 18:54
best one so farPeter has been busy removing the brake calipers in a bid to free up the brakes to make the car easier to move and they will need a refurb too.
Suspension is rock hard at the moment, these are potentially 27 years old so will replace with a set of adjustable coilovers probably Gaz
The worst of the visible rust is on the bonnet.
Like the way bonnet is also the top of the wings.
I've been testing out japanese auction sites and made 1st purchase of an oil filler cap ! Will be interesting to see how much on top of the £7 purchase price it ends up costing delivered to UK, also bought a Beat book and a magazine about Beat engine rebuilds, in japanese...
Front now de-snailed
Suspension is rock hard at the moment, these are potentially 27 years old so will replace with a set of adjustable coilovers probably Gaz
The worst of the visible rust is on the bonnet.
Like the way bonnet is also the top of the wings.
I've been testing out japanese auction sites and made 1st purchase of an oil filler cap ! Will be interesting to see how much on top of the £7 purchase price it ends up costing delivered to UK, also bought a Beat book and a magazine about Beat engine rebuilds, in japanese...
Front now de-snailed
Ha yeah is a bit, tbh not sure how else we would have got car out so quick, was down a very narrow lane with brakes pretty much all bound on.
Pete has been busy today, 1st tested the electrics
Proper 90's graphics on Stereo, but both temp and fan speed circular switches broken apparently.
Lights work including little fogs
Radiator is toast.
Front A/C stuff removed.
Now with rad, a/c and undertray removed, some rust here, not sure what is best to do with bodywork in this area but it needs tidying.
Not keen on the usual UK style full length number plate which was on it so test fitted rear rectangular one which suits better as per japanese plate in it's recess. Also started rubbing down front of bonnet and bumper, both have been repaired before hardly surprising on a car of this age I guess.
Pete showing off his newly acquired English wheel skills, he's desperate to stick his bonnet scoop somewhere. Er no you can't
Pete has been busy today, 1st tested the electrics
Proper 90's graphics on Stereo, but both temp and fan speed circular switches broken apparently.
Lights work including little fogs
Radiator is toast.
Front A/C stuff removed.
Now with rad, a/c and undertray removed, some rust here, not sure what is best to do with bodywork in this area but it needs tidying.
Not keen on the usual UK style full length number plate which was on it so test fitted rear rectangular one which suits better as per japanese plate in it's recess. Also started rubbing down front of bonnet and bumper, both have been repaired before hardly surprising on a car of this age I guess.
Pete showing off his newly acquired English wheel skills, he's desperate to stick his bonnet scoop somewhere. Er no you can't
Peter been busy rubbing down bonnet and front bumper
Passenger seat in all it's zebra print glory and some stains.... Drivers side has more a lot more holes and heavily worn bolsters. Same seat can be bought in Japan for £35 but shipping is crazy at £250 ! Hopefully can just get the cover taken off and shipped.
First look of the floor needs work but could be worse.
Cam cover off and all looks good in here, so far...
If only
Behind rear seat and a cover sits the ECU apparently these get hot and cook resistors and circuits overtime so will be checked by a specialist.
Passenger seat in all it's zebra print glory and some stains.... Drivers side has more a lot more holes and heavily worn bolsters. Same seat can be bought in Japan for £35 but shipping is crazy at £250 ! Hopefully can just get the cover taken off and shipped.
First look of the floor needs work but could be worse.
Cam cover off and all looks good in here, so far...
If only
Behind rear seat and a cover sits the ECU apparently these get hot and cook resistors and circuits overtime so will be checked by a specialist.
Ref bonnet rust from Peter
'The rust on the Beat bonnet is actually not to bad, rubbing it out with coarse wet and dry got rid, once the tip is done I will wire brush the back and it will be bright and shiny for when the Bonda primer is applied'
Love the Mugen Beats, especially Mugen wheels in silver, must be like hens teeth though sadly.
'The rust on the Beat bonnet is actually not to bad, rubbing it out with coarse wet and dry got rid, once the tip is done I will wire brush the back and it will be bright and shiny for when the Bonda primer is applied'
Love the Mugen Beats, especially Mugen wheels in silver, must be like hens teeth though sadly.
More prep work on the bonnet
Cam cover after a stint in Peters dishwasher and now just back from vapour cleaning.
Aircon pump removed and won't be going back on.
Bumper off and rear subframe and lower suspension arms look ok.
Shocks will be replaced.
Rear Bumper needs painting too, we are now contemplating a full respray.
Took of the passenger seat cover and put in the washing machine. Zebratastic.
Cam cover after a stint in Peters dishwasher and now just back from vapour cleaning.
Aircon pump removed and won't be going back on.
Bumper off and rear subframe and lower suspension arms look ok.
Shocks will be replaced.
Rear Bumper needs painting too, we are now contemplating a full respray.
Took of the passenger seat cover and put in the washing machine. Zebratastic.
If we do repaint whole car we will keep it silver I think.
quick update, still more snails !
First snapped bolt from engine mount, oops...
Car up nice and high to aid engine and suspension removal.
2nd small purchase but 1st thing to arrive and probably last to go on.
Side decals for the rear quater panel, my car was missing them.
quick update, still more snails !
First snapped bolt from engine mount, oops...
Car up nice and high to aid engine and suspension removal.
2nd small purchase but 1st thing to arrive and probably last to go on.
Side decals for the rear quater panel, my car was missing them.
Engine and gearbox are out and looking a bit worse for wear.
Passenger side mirror needs fixing, gives Peter a chance to fire up the lathe and make an ali sleeve/collar, no idea what it will do but looks good
I will be having a go at cleaning up rusty bits and repainting them. I've read good things about Por-15, unless anyone has anything better to suggest ?
Passenger side mirror needs fixing, gives Peter a chance to fire up the lathe and make an ali sleeve/collar, no idea what it will do but looks good
I will be having a go at cleaning up rusty bits and repainting them. I've read good things about Por-15, unless anyone has anything better to suggest ?
Edited by Rocket. on Friday 12th October 17:26
Thanks for replies will try the POR-15. In the meantime spent a few hours trying to remove pistons from the calipers in the end tried the grease gun method, messy but worked. As expected pistons are heavily pitted so will be replaced.
Meanwhile Peter has been properly busy with engine now taken apart and shows it definitely in need of some attention. Hardly surprising after 27 years. Off to local machine shop to see what needs to be done.
Meanwhile Peter has been properly busy with engine now taken apart and shows it definitely in need of some attention. Hardly surprising after 27 years. Off to local machine shop to see what needs to be done.
Thanks all.
Ref A/C I can see the point on it in Tokyo etc. but for my purposes, roof off mostly in the summer, to me it's just extra weight on an otherwise light car with a small engine, a chamois is a lot lighter !
Engine swaps are great if you can make them work, however my recent foray into K20 Honda Elise left a lot to be desired even when the work was by a so called specialist. That being said a Hayabusa engined car done properly would be quite bonkers, sadly neither the money nor the patience this time.
Ref A/C I can see the point on it in Tokyo etc. but for my purposes, roof off mostly in the summer, to me it's just extra weight on an otherwise light car with a small engine, a chamois is a lot lighter !
Engine swaps are great if you can make them work, however my recent foray into K20 Honda Elise left a lot to be desired even when the work was by a so called specialist. That being said a Hayabusa engined car done properly would be quite bonkers, sadly neither the money nor the patience this time.
Peter has been busy dismantling the engine and something is not right here...
The old cat and exhaust have seen better days, thinking of removing the cat completely but various sources have said the old ecu wont compensate for it's removal and the car could end up running lean with unwanted results so think we will replace rather than remove.
A piston out and cleaned up, he noticed what looks like a centre mark from blob of braze on each, any ideas ?
Crank is out.
Cranks shells look in pretty good nick but will be replaced.
Handy WD40 holder, he's been getting through a fair bit.
Very cruddy exhaust valve...
Valves next to a 5p.
Inlet manifold will be getting the vapour blasting treatment.
Bottom of the sump showing cooling fins, engine temps in the Beat can be an issue I gather so will look at ways to keep it cooler back there.
The old cat and exhaust have seen better days, thinking of removing the cat completely but various sources have said the old ecu wont compensate for it's removal and the car could end up running lean with unwanted results so think we will replace rather than remove.
A piston out and cleaned up, he noticed what looks like a centre mark from blob of braze on each, any ideas ?
Crank is out.
Cranks shells look in pretty good nick but will be replaced.
Handy WD40 holder, he's been getting through a fair bit.
Very cruddy exhaust valve...
Valves next to a 5p.
Inlet manifold will be getting the vapour blasting treatment.
Bottom of the sump showing cooling fins, engine temps in the Beat can be an issue I gather so will look at ways to keep it cooler back there.
fatharris said:
How has it been to work on/gather spares for? I bought the yellow one and it's due to arrive on Saturday 
Not bad to work on from what Peter has said, for spares most new parts seem available www.amayama.com also bought from rhdjapan.com and fromjapan.co.jp and ordered new suspension from GAZ.
Biggred do caliper kits for front and rear for £65, however Honda dealers here seem a bit clueless so far...
Can I have the exhaust back ? the chap we bought from said mine ended up on your car
Sadly my local dealer just told that after checking with Honda UK the exhaust is no longer manufactured and cannot help. Maybe I need to check another dealer.
eta: confirmed by another Honda dealer, exhaust no longer manufactured, nice one Honda
eta: confirmed by another Honda dealer, exhaust no longer manufactured, nice one Honda
Edited by Rocket. on Wednesday 24th October 11:57
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