You know what I hate....
Discussion
Ive lurked on this one so far but Id just like to say when Ive been looking round for 911s I visited Henry and his merry men (even made the gf and me a cuppa!) and I also visited Paragon, Cridfords, RSJ, Portiacraft and a few others. I didnt buy a used 911 in the end (sorry bought a Griff and now a Sag and have a 997tt on order) but I keep my eye on the market and frankly I need to buy a proper 911Turbo at some point...because lets face it, all those of us of a certain age and petrol in our blood have to! Anyway, my rambling pt is, of the lot I visited only Henry and Paragon instilled much faith in me and in all honesty Henry's website is the one I visit most often. It is also where Ive directed another Boxster looking friend to. If the fiancee (different girl to the above) has much to do with it, the Sagaris may get sold sooner than I want and have to be replaced with a 911, the first and possibly only place I will go is to Henry. Paragon are equally good guys but they seem a touch more expensive. Er no offence Henry but with a bit of luck I dont *really* want to visit you guys for another cpl of yrs yet, but erm, *ahem*...Lapis Blue 3.6Turbo if I do OK? 
I've also been lurking and have a few points to add / agree with.
First of all colour - I had a slightly unusual colour, but the real thrill was driving it. Once I got used to it and knew its character and oddities I then realised that I loved the colour. Perhaps because it was mine? Don't know... but to me, it looked special, and fantastic!
Some pics of it here www.pikeynet.com/05/07/08/nurburg.htm
Secondly, regarding selling and the trouble it can cause (even though between James and Al its been resolved ), I do hate selling cars. I prefer to buy and sell through dealers and am prepared to pay the extra for the advantages you get. However, when I come to buy or sell cars privately I tend only to do it through mates. This isn't by choice, but more of a character thing where you know the chap buying/selling and one feels less at risk. I've bought 5 cars from mates and sold 3. Actually 2 of the cars I sold I didn't get the cash in my bank until after they took the car! I think it's safe to say I'm a cr*p car salesman (but a good judge of character?!)
Ok, so the above depends on whether you have a mate selling a car you want to buy... but thats just been an opportunity thing "oooh, you're selling your Trabant.."
First of all colour - I had a slightly unusual colour, but the real thrill was driving it. Once I got used to it and knew its character and oddities I then realised that I loved the colour. Perhaps because it was mine? Don't know... but to me, it looked special, and fantastic!
Some pics of it here www.pikeynet.com/05/07/08/nurburg.htm
Secondly, regarding selling and the trouble it can cause (even though between James and Al its been resolved
), I do hate selling cars. I prefer to buy and sell through dealers and am prepared to pay the extra for the advantages you get. However, when I come to buy or sell cars privately I tend only to do it through mates. This isn't by choice, but more of a character thing where you know the chap buying/selling and one feels less at risk. I've bought 5 cars from mates and sold 3. Actually 2 of the cars I sold I didn't get the cash in my bank until after they took the car! I think it's safe to say I'm a cr*p car salesman (but a good judge of character?!) Ok, so the above depends on whether you have a mate selling a car you want to buy... but thats just been an opportunity thing "oooh, you're selling your Trabant.."
Cor! This is the longest thread I've ever started!
Me an' Al are now tight! I didn't receive the email he sent saying the car was too leggy and wasn't interested...
As with above poster and Henry commented - I've bought and sold many times with friends, the 964 in question is from a friend who owned it for 3 yrs, the reason this works for me is that I know how the car has been looked after - obviously far beter than a service history would tell. I'm such a fastidious idiot that I spend far more than needs to be to keep the thing up together, and so are most of my mates.
Comments on Henry's place: I came down a couple of years ago, full of enthusiasm and found the cars to look generally a bit rough actually, the folks there couldn't really be bothered to talk to me and the car I came to see was misdescribed, well dogggy I thought, so I'm surprised to hear the glowing references - maybe they're mates.. Mind you, I've been to a few other dealers where 'immaculate' cars had marks on every panel. Not to sound too negative - I called in at Paul Devyeras (sp?) a few months ago and his stock was great - a bit dear, but very well described, slightly offish bedside manner though I thought - a bit tooo business like - Show me the money before you can test-drive attitude...
Me an' Al are now tight! I didn't receive the email he sent saying the car was too leggy and wasn't interested...
As with above poster and Henry commented - I've bought and sold many times with friends, the 964 in question is from a friend who owned it for 3 yrs, the reason this works for me is that I know how the car has been looked after - obviously far beter than a service history would tell. I'm such a fastidious idiot that I spend far more than needs to be to keep the thing up together, and so are most of my mates.
Comments on Henry's place: I came down a couple of years ago, full of enthusiasm and found the cars to look generally a bit rough actually, the folks there couldn't really be bothered to talk to me and the car I came to see was misdescribed, well dogggy I thought, so I'm surprised to hear the glowing references - maybe they're mates.. Mind you, I've been to a few other dealers where 'immaculate' cars had marks on every panel. Not to sound too negative - I called in at Paul Devyeras (sp?) a few months ago and his stock was great - a bit dear, but very well described, slightly offish bedside manner though I thought - a bit tooo business like - Show me the money before you can test-drive attitude...
What a great website ! [url]www.pikeynet.com[/url] and no relation !
Tell me who dealt with you and I`ll have them sacked !
when you say couldn`t be bothered to talk to you that surprises me, all we do is spend the day chatting to people 1 on 1. Or did you come on a Saturday ?
Henry
>> Edited by henry-f on Friday 2nd December 14:57
Tell me who dealt with you and I`ll have them sacked !
when you say couldn`t be bothered to talk to you that surprises me, all we do is spend the day chatting to people 1 on 1. Or did you come on a Saturday ?
Henry
>> Edited by henry-f on Friday 2nd December 14:57
DJC, I have dealt with Joel at RSJ on a couple of occasions and bought a lovely, very well priced 996 Targa off him and would have no hesitation buying from him again.
As for Henry's place sure there are some cars a little on the tatty side there are also some immaculate ones but I have always enjoyed my visits and have been very well looked after (seem to talk to Tom as much as anyone).
As for Henry's place sure there are some cars a little on the tatty side there are also some immaculate ones but I have always enjoyed my visits and have been very well looked after (seem to talk to Tom as much as anyone).
hey slider, i know what you mean about paul devyea. I treked all the way to Seven Oaks on the train to see one of his 993's.
I looked round the thing in his factory unit, and was quite interested in it. But when I asked if he could pull it outside so I could see it in daylight he looked at me like I'd asked if a night with his daughter was included in the deal! Then he muttered something about not wanting to get any rain on it! It had been raining (not unheard of in UK November) So there I was peering at this dark blue 993 in the semi darkness. When I protested he eventually rolled it outside the doors (just). On that basis I assumed that the chances of a test drive were nil. So I just headed back to town on the next train and bought one from someone else 5 days later.
I did phone 911virgin at one stage but the guy who answered the phone was so cocky at telling me what I wanted and what I didn't want, and was then so vague about whether he could get me collected from the local station that i never bothered to go there.
And as for Portiacraft, they had a 993 described on there site as 'simply superb'. Quite frankly it was the worst of the 9 I went to see.
It makes me wonder how these so called 'specialist dealers' do any trade. The only dealer I visited that had a car matching the description was Cridfords. The guy there was very helpful, let me have a good test drive, and the car looked very well prepared.
Another thing that bugged me was the fact that in almost all instances the dealers were well aware of a whole host of things that needed sorting on cars that they had all had in stock for often for weeks or even months. When I pointed these out they all seemed to have a standard patter along the lines of "well we pride ourselves on our preparation and we expect to get it serviced plus any other bits you spot sorted out once you say you want it". As somebody who sells £6m worth of services to customers a year I found it totally bizzarre that a vendor would put a product in front of a customer which was obviously not in top shape and then offer to sort them if you committed to buy it. It would be like going into the meat dept at Tescos and finding a load of cows, sheep and pigs milling around and the guy saying "I know it's not actually the steak you were hoping to buy, but once you put your money down it won't take us long to get it butchered up". Tesco know what people expect their meat to look like, so they have it ready before you get there!!!
My money was in the bank ready to spend. It was quite frustrating seeing a load of cars that were only half ready to buy.
I looked round the thing in his factory unit, and was quite interested in it. But when I asked if he could pull it outside so I could see it in daylight he looked at me like I'd asked if a night with his daughter was included in the deal! Then he muttered something about not wanting to get any rain on it! It had been raining (not unheard of in UK November) So there I was peering at this dark blue 993 in the semi darkness. When I protested he eventually rolled it outside the doors (just). On that basis I assumed that the chances of a test drive were nil. So I just headed back to town on the next train and bought one from someone else 5 days later.
I did phone 911virgin at one stage but the guy who answered the phone was so cocky at telling me what I wanted and what I didn't want, and was then so vague about whether he could get me collected from the local station that i never bothered to go there.
And as for Portiacraft, they had a 993 described on there site as 'simply superb'. Quite frankly it was the worst of the 9 I went to see.
It makes me wonder how these so called 'specialist dealers' do any trade. The only dealer I visited that had a car matching the description was Cridfords. The guy there was very helpful, let me have a good test drive, and the car looked very well prepared.
Another thing that bugged me was the fact that in almost all instances the dealers were well aware of a whole host of things that needed sorting on cars that they had all had in stock for often for weeks or even months. When I pointed these out they all seemed to have a standard patter along the lines of "well we pride ourselves on our preparation and we expect to get it serviced plus any other bits you spot sorted out once you say you want it". As somebody who sells £6m worth of services to customers a year I found it totally bizzarre that a vendor would put a product in front of a customer which was obviously not in top shape and then offer to sort them if you committed to buy it. It would be like going into the meat dept at Tescos and finding a load of cows, sheep and pigs milling around and the guy saying "I know it's not actually the steak you were hoping to buy, but once you put your money down it won't take us long to get it butchered up". Tesco know what people expect their meat to look like, so they have it ready before you get there!!!
My money was in the bank ready to spend. It was quite frustrating seeing a load of cars that were only half ready to buy.
That's why I do not mind buying privately, because then at least you meet the owner and get a feel for how they might have treasured the car, or not.
I paid £40k for the Ferrari last year, didn't even have a PPI done. But the car had been recommended by the guys on FerrariChat, the owner was a FOC regional organiser, and the history was complete. The car was also mint.
I sold it last week to another private guy, who also, even though it was a Ferrari, never had a PPI done. He even paid the funds into my bank nearly a week before he even came up to see the car! He knew of the car, knew of me through the forums, knew I had done two 3,000 mile European trips in the last year in it, but had only seen it once before at the Nat Concours meet this summer (not entered I hasten to add). He got a great car for a very good price.
So good private cars are out there, that have been mainly used as a weekend car so don't have huge mileage ... it is just a matter of finding them!
I don't expect a stupid bargain price, just a fair price for a fair car.
I paid £40k for the Ferrari last year, didn't even have a PPI done. But the car had been recommended by the guys on FerrariChat, the owner was a FOC regional organiser, and the history was complete. The car was also mint.
I sold it last week to another private guy, who also, even though it was a Ferrari, never had a PPI done. He even paid the funds into my bank nearly a week before he even came up to see the car! He knew of the car, knew of me through the forums, knew I had done two 3,000 mile European trips in the last year in it, but had only seen it once before at the Nat Concours meet this summer (not entered I hasten to add). He got a great car for a very good price.
So good private cars are out there, that have been mainly used as a weekend car so don't have huge mileage ... it is just a matter of finding them!
I don't expect a stupid bargain price, just a fair price for a fair car.
It isn`t pink, it`s Cassis which is lovely !!
We are quite happy to pick people up from Uxbridge tube station, Heathrow, and indeed this week Luton. Twice. If however you want to come on a Saturday it can be hard. We can usually manage Uxbridge Tube but if we are 6 deep in the yard you will appreciate it can be a struggle.
In terms of vehicle preparation it might be you who has the upper hand in arrogence rather than ourselves. Why should cars be presented just how you like to the detriment of other buyers. From our side of the fence different people want different things from their cars. Some people are buying on a very limited budget and so are looking for ways to save money and possibly do jobs as funds permit. A London buyer might not appreciate £1,000 spent on correcting minor bumper marks or light alloy wheel marks only to have the hard work undone in the first week of their ownership.
Do we replace low rear tyres with our choice of rubber when the next owner would have preferred to specify his or her own choice. And do we prepare cars now and have them sit around or do the work so it is fresh for collection.
It`s not like Tescos showing you a field of cows, it`s like Tescos handing you a bag of Fillet and saying we decided you were having a steak tonight rather than the stew you actually wanted.
If we take a deposit one weekend we can usually have the car fully prepared by the following weekend addressing any particular pet hates you might have.
In terms of arrogance - The customer is not always right, my thoughts and views, (formed over 20 years of buying and selling old cars), are well documented. Indeed on this particular thread even. If I think you`re going about the job wrongly I`ll tell you. In your instance for example if there were little jobs that you wanted to see sorted why the hell not give the man his deposit, (subject to their being sorted to your satisfaction), and pick the car up a week or so later lovely and fresh from it`s service, brake pads, tyres etc.
Finally don`t confuse "not interested in selling me a car", with not wanting to be pushy and allowing the customer space and time to think about the purchase. That doesn`t mean simply throwing them the keys and saying have a look round that. It means talking with the customer, spending as much time with them as they want, (Other than a Saturday when as we quite clearly say on the website it can get a bit busy), talking them through the cars, answering questions and then letting them go away and think. If you want to be "sold to" let me know before you arrive and I`ll give you a ride you`ll never forget that would be the envy of any self respecting timeshare rep !!
As with all things in life it`s different strokes for different folks. We are not the only people out there selling used Porsches, I could tell you how I think we differ from other people in the industry and there are times when other dealers will get on better with individual customers. That`s life. But there are some people, (not necessarily posters here), who seem to find fault in every single supplier of services or goods and that sometimes reflects their approach to the table.
As always keep smiling !
Henry
We are quite happy to pick people up from Uxbridge tube station, Heathrow, and indeed this week Luton. Twice. If however you want to come on a Saturday it can be hard. We can usually manage Uxbridge Tube but if we are 6 deep in the yard you will appreciate it can be a struggle.
In terms of vehicle preparation it might be you who has the upper hand in arrogence rather than ourselves. Why should cars be presented just how you like to the detriment of other buyers. From our side of the fence different people want different things from their cars. Some people are buying on a very limited budget and so are looking for ways to save money and possibly do jobs as funds permit. A London buyer might not appreciate £1,000 spent on correcting minor bumper marks or light alloy wheel marks only to have the hard work undone in the first week of their ownership.
Do we replace low rear tyres with our choice of rubber when the next owner would have preferred to specify his or her own choice. And do we prepare cars now and have them sit around or do the work so it is fresh for collection.
It`s not like Tescos showing you a field of cows, it`s like Tescos handing you a bag of Fillet and saying we decided you were having a steak tonight rather than the stew you actually wanted.
If we take a deposit one weekend we can usually have the car fully prepared by the following weekend addressing any particular pet hates you might have.
In terms of arrogance - The customer is not always right, my thoughts and views, (formed over 20 years of buying and selling old cars), are well documented. Indeed on this particular thread even. If I think you`re going about the job wrongly I`ll tell you. In your instance for example if there were little jobs that you wanted to see sorted why the hell not give the man his deposit, (subject to their being sorted to your satisfaction), and pick the car up a week or so later lovely and fresh from it`s service, brake pads, tyres etc.
Finally don`t confuse "not interested in selling me a car", with not wanting to be pushy and allowing the customer space and time to think about the purchase. That doesn`t mean simply throwing them the keys and saying have a look round that. It means talking with the customer, spending as much time with them as they want, (Other than a Saturday when as we quite clearly say on the website it can get a bit busy), talking them through the cars, answering questions and then letting them go away and think. If you want to be "sold to" let me know before you arrive and I`ll give you a ride you`ll never forget that would be the envy of any self respecting timeshare rep !!
As with all things in life it`s different strokes for different folks. We are not the only people out there selling used Porsches, I could tell you how I think we differ from other people in the industry and there are times when other dealers will get on better with individual customers. That`s life. But there are some people, (not necessarily posters here), who seem to find fault in every single supplier of services or goods and that sometimes reflects their approach to the table.
As always keep smiling !
Henry
los angeles said:
Come on guys, hands up, seriously, how many of you would drive a PINK, not crimson like yours Pikey, a PINK Porsche.
I did...but no as everyday transport...Although what's the problem with the colour?
Al, you're trying to find a car that doesn't exist - far better to buy a car with over 6 figures on it - say 130k and stick a few more on the clock. Stick to a colour combination and spec that will make it easier to sell on - e.g. silver metallic, black/grey leather and do make sure you buy an RHD car. The car ought to have full service history, no need for it all to be OPC and yes, the fewer owners the better...buy a car like that and you'll be maximising your possible sell-on/dealer market when you do come to sell it on.
Oh can I also add that there are traders mentioned in this thread that I have dealt with and the comments prove that old adage that "there are always two sides to a story"...or "one man's meat is another man's poison".
...and another thing - I sell stuff for a living - some of it looks great but is a bit flakey under the skin - the punters know that - it's expected in our industry and we tell them that we may need to to do some work on it to make it fit for their purpose. They accept that fact, just as I'd accept the fact that a trader may show me a car that's not mint...in fact I'd prefer it that way to be honest.
A question for Henry - often the spread between your bug prices and retail is large. This cwould concern me as a buyer - would a £3k spread suggest a gearbox problem for example, or a top end rebuild?...does a £1k spread suggest that the car just needs a couple of tyres and a 12,000 miles service?...If I were buying on that basis, I'd want to know how you arrived at the spread and would expect an honest answer - would I get one?
>> Edited by rubystone on Saturday 3rd December 11:29
...and another thing - I sell stuff for a living - some of it looks great but is a bit flakey under the skin - the punters know that - it's expected in our industry and we tell them that we may need to to do some work on it to make it fit for their purpose. They accept that fact, just as I'd accept the fact that a trader may show me a car that's not mint...in fact I'd prefer it that way to be honest.
A question for Henry - often the spread between your bug prices and retail is large. This cwould concern me as a buyer - would a £3k spread suggest a gearbox problem for example, or a top end rebuild?...does a £1k spread suggest that the car just needs a couple of tyres and a 12,000 miles service?...If I were buying on that basis, I'd want to know how you arrived at the spread and would expect an honest answer - would I get one?
>> Edited by rubystone on Saturday 3rd December 11:29
993driver, you sound exactly like me! I dont think some dealers appreciate how much time effort and genuine excitement is involved with us visiting them. I dont buy your comments on prep Henry, - I want to buy a car that looks good and looks like its owner has cherished it and has taken enough pride in it to prepare it for sale properly. Rather I think that you dont want to spend a penny on the car until its sold, and in doing so I think you are doing yourself a great disservice. If I'm going to pay dealer prices I want showroom quality, I dont want knackered tyres, scuffs and scrapes, worn out seat bolsters missing bits of rubber seals etc, 'cos I wont part with folding stuff to the tune of mid 20K's and more for anything less than mint, OK the car is likely to be 10 years old but it can still be clean. tidy and look like its been properly cared for. If any of my cars get bumps or scrapes I repair 'em, and I wouldnt pay that sort of dosh for any that weren't - end of story. Whenever I buy new cars I expect to be given the keys of a demo or if nearly new the actual car for an extended test drive. I recently persuaded a VW dealer to lend me their Touareg v10 for 2 days. Paul D's midnight Targa was a lovely car to look at but I didnt fall in love because I didn't get the chance to drive it...
Henry, I didnt come at the w/e I called on the phone during the week and arranged a time to visit, called up again on the way to get better directions - you obviously knew very well when I was coming, but when I got there I did not get very much interest in me as a person and the car was nowhere near as nice as described over the phone. I think if your salesguy had been more honest I would have been better prepared and would'nt have basically taken 1 look, turned on my heel and driven straight back to Milton Keynes, very fed up!
Another time, I seem to remember offering you my '72 RS for £29K and you offered me £24K, which I thought was derisory - Somebody from America bought it 3 weeks later for £36K and shipped it off sight-unseen.
Henry, I didnt come at the w/e I called on the phone during the week and arranged a time to visit, called up again on the way to get better directions - you obviously knew very well when I was coming, but when I got there I did not get very much interest in me as a person and the car was nowhere near as nice as described over the phone. I think if your salesguy had been more honest I would have been better prepared and would'nt have basically taken 1 look, turned on my heel and driven straight back to Milton Keynes, very fed up!
Another time, I seem to remember offering you my '72 RS for £29K and you offered me £24K, which I thought was derisory - Somebody from America bought it 3 weeks later for £36K and shipped it off sight-unseen.
I don`t know the first thing about 2.7 RS values. I`ve only ever sold 2 pre-impact bumper 911`s in 18 years of buying and selling Porsches ! Did I see the car ? Did I qualify my offer with, "but I`m not an expert in pre-impact bumper cars", or "but I`d need to see it as there is a huge variation in cars that are out there". I am not a pre-impact bumper Porsche 911 specialist and so am going to be fairly cautious with my money in that arena.
Our spread between the bug and retail price is almost always £2k. That`s our norm. Occasionally if there is something large specifically wrong or the car is a particularly high / low maintenance such as a 959 or Ford Focus then the bug price will vary accordingly.
We aim to sell to an educated buyer and are more than happy to talk someone round a car pointing out both bad as well as good.
In terms of preparation we obviously make descisions before we show cars. Sometimes we do work, other times not. Certainly we show a lot more cars than other dealers exactly as they come in. That is not however how they necessarily go out. If someone wants a job doing we`ll do it. We aren`t into covering over the cracks or doing "mobile" touch ins. If we get things like paint done it goes to a specialist, the same as all our other work and we get it done properly. There are times when we offer what people might consider "scruffy" cars for sale, but they will be priced accordingly, (and usually stated on the site - who else describes cars as "looking like they`ve been painted by a money with a vacuum cleaner". We`ve got one going on the site next week, a circa £13k RHD 964 cab. We could send it away for 4 weeks and put it up for £18k but this way someone on a budget can have a basically sound 964 and do bits as they go along. If someone wants a "better" one that`s fine, we have them in stock but they are more expensive.
Ultimately you pay your money and take your choice. Both price and condition are subject rather than objective but I think we`ve got a pretty good handle on the level different cars need to be to be considered good / bad/ indifferent. We sell a lot of Porsches, probably 300 or so in a year and that involves thousands of telephone conversations, I hope we get it right more times than we get it wrong. Certainly we try and do care but ultimately some peoples expectaions aren`t commercially viable and we do have to make a living!
Henry
Our spread between the bug and retail price is almost always £2k. That`s our norm. Occasionally if there is something large specifically wrong or the car is a particularly high / low maintenance such as a 959 or Ford Focus then the bug price will vary accordingly.
We aim to sell to an educated buyer and are more than happy to talk someone round a car pointing out both bad as well as good.
In terms of preparation we obviously make descisions before we show cars. Sometimes we do work, other times not. Certainly we show a lot more cars than other dealers exactly as they come in. That is not however how they necessarily go out. If someone wants a job doing we`ll do it. We aren`t into covering over the cracks or doing "mobile" touch ins. If we get things like paint done it goes to a specialist, the same as all our other work and we get it done properly. There are times when we offer what people might consider "scruffy" cars for sale, but they will be priced accordingly, (and usually stated on the site - who else describes cars as "looking like they`ve been painted by a money with a vacuum cleaner"
. We`ve got one going on the site next week, a circa £13k RHD 964 cab. We could send it away for 4 weeks and put it up for £18k but this way someone on a budget can have a basically sound 964 and do bits as they go along. If someone wants a "better" one that`s fine, we have them in stock but they are more expensive. Ultimately you pay your money and take your choice. Both price and condition are subject rather than objective but I think we`ve got a pretty good handle on the level different cars need to be to be considered good / bad/ indifferent. We sell a lot of Porsches, probably 300 or so in a year and that involves thousands of telephone conversations, I hope we get it right more times than we get it wrong. Certainly we try and do care but ultimately some peoples expectaions aren`t commercially viable and we do have to make a living!
Henry
I bet he bit your arm off - just how long ago was this?...Spot on slider. Just what I meant.
Henry, your suggestions don't hold water with me.
It was never a case of the dealers I visited holding cars in an unprepared state so they could tailor the price to match a buyers budget. In every instance the cars were on offer with obvious faults that the dealers either acknowledged or in some cases even pointed out to me. And in every instance they were not willing to move on the asking price much but said they fully expected to rectify the faults before handing the car over to a buyer. I found this bizarre.
It wasn't just Paul Devyea or Portiacraft I visited.
I drove all the way to Coventry to see a 993 at Autobahn described as 'excellent condition' or something like that. As I started lookng round it I started spotting scratches and marks on just about every body panel. The o/s door had a bloody great scratch right across it. And before I had said a word to the salesman he said 'of course it obviously needs a bit of attention to the paintwork and we're happy to get that sorted in the asking price'. Well this car ad been on their website stock list for the entire month I had been looking for a 993 so it baffles me why they would expect a punter to agree to buy and then sit back and wait.
Most of the cars I saw were due a service. Again each dealer said they would include a service in the price. In that case why not get it done anyway.
And in the case of 911virgin I could agree with Henry if the circumstances he outlined tallied with my experience. I'd expect a dealer to be busy on a Saturday just as he says, but I phoned on a Wednesday lunchtime. When I explained what I was looking for I got quite a bit of 'advice' on why that might not be what I wanted after all. But once it was finally identified that they had one car that might fit my criteria it was then only a 'possibility' that someone might be able to collect me from the local station.
I don't think you need to get defensive over these points Henry. At the end of the day I was a cash buyer looking for a 993 who didn't visit your place because of the way I was dealt with on the phone. You and the other dealers can either take on board my points or ignore them as you see fit.
The other thing that pissed me off was the attitude the dealers had to mileage. They seem to flip the arguement around to suit the stock they have. When I said I was looking for a relatively low mileage car with few owners most of them said that mileage isn't important, it's all about condition and history. But when they got their hands on a low mileage car they all whacked a massive premium on it and said it was a 'once in a lifetime' opportunity.
I knew exactly what I was looking for from the outset and immediately purchased the first one that met my criteria. But I wasted a lot of time visiting the 'specialist' dealers beforehand looking at things that in my view were mis-described and badly presented.
Only time will tell if I made the right choice, but I'm happy at the moment.
Henry, your suggestions don't hold water with me.
It was never a case of the dealers I visited holding cars in an unprepared state so they could tailor the price to match a buyers budget. In every instance the cars were on offer with obvious faults that the dealers either acknowledged or in some cases even pointed out to me. And in every instance they were not willing to move on the asking price much but said they fully expected to rectify the faults before handing the car over to a buyer. I found this bizarre.
It wasn't just Paul Devyea or Portiacraft I visited.
I drove all the way to Coventry to see a 993 at Autobahn described as 'excellent condition' or something like that. As I started lookng round it I started spotting scratches and marks on just about every body panel. The o/s door had a bloody great scratch right across it. And before I had said a word to the salesman he said 'of course it obviously needs a bit of attention to the paintwork and we're happy to get that sorted in the asking price'. Well this car ad been on their website stock list for the entire month I had been looking for a 993 so it baffles me why they would expect a punter to agree to buy and then sit back and wait.
Most of the cars I saw were due a service. Again each dealer said they would include a service in the price. In that case why not get it done anyway.
And in the case of 911virgin I could agree with Henry if the circumstances he outlined tallied with my experience. I'd expect a dealer to be busy on a Saturday just as he says, but I phoned on a Wednesday lunchtime. When I explained what I was looking for I got quite a bit of 'advice' on why that might not be what I wanted after all. But once it was finally identified that they had one car that might fit my criteria it was then only a 'possibility' that someone might be able to collect me from the local station.
I don't think you need to get defensive over these points Henry. At the end of the day I was a cash buyer looking for a 993 who didn't visit your place because of the way I was dealt with on the phone. You and the other dealers can either take on board my points or ignore them as you see fit.
The other thing that pissed me off was the attitude the dealers had to mileage. They seem to flip the arguement around to suit the stock they have. When I said I was looking for a relatively low mileage car with few owners most of them said that mileage isn't important, it's all about condition and history. But when they got their hands on a low mileage car they all whacked a massive premium on it and said it was a 'once in a lifetime' opportunity.
I knew exactly what I was looking for from the outset and immediately purchased the first one that met my criteria. But I wasted a lot of time visiting the 'specialist' dealers beforehand looking at things that in my view were mis-described and badly presented.
Only time will tell if I made the right choice, but I'm happy at the moment.
rubystone said:
Come on guys, hands up, seriously, how many of you would drive a PINK, not crimson like yours Pikey, a PINK Porsche.
I did...but no as everyday transport...Although what's the problem with the colour?
Al, you're trying to find a car that doesn't exist - far better to buy a car with over 6 figures on it -
Ruby! you're supposed to be helping me here, I'm sure you meant "No No don't get a pink one, I did and I have never had a moments piece!" Henry, last time I looked, a healthy splash of cassis turns a glass of Bolly a lovely shade of pink. The only buyer you'll find for a pink Porsche is someone who is er, er,
totally at ease with their femine side! Yeah, that's it ... oh, and doesn't mind being called a puff 
or someone who has an obsession with odd coloured cars and doesn't give a stuff! .... any chance of getting it for £13k?
Anyway, after having even more chats with various people it is definately, absolutely, unarguably, a 3.2 RHD Carrera Coupe that I want, can be slightly over 100k if condition and history is right. Now please, don't anyone put a once in a lifetime low mileage 964 under my nose or my head will probably explode!
Lime green or pink preferred but most colours considered
burriana said:
Come on guys, hands up, seriously, how many of you would drive a PINK, not crimson like yours Pikey, a PINK Porsche.
I did...but no as everyday transport...Although what's the problem with the colour?
Al, you're trying to find a car that doesn't exist - far better to buy a car with over 6 figures on it -
Henry, last time I looked, a healthy splash of cassis turns a glass of Bolly a lovely shade of pink. The only buyer you'll find for a pink Porsche is someone who is er, er,
or someone who has an obsession with odd coloured cars and doesn't give a stuff! .... any chance of getting it for £13k?
Anyway, after having even more chats with various people it is definately, absolutely, unarguably, a 3.2 RHD Carrera Coupe that I want, can be slightly over 100k if condition and history is right. Now please, don't anyone put a once in a lifetime low mileage 964 under my nose or my head will probably explode!
Lime green or pink preferred but most colours considered
Tee-Hee! You've almost talked yourself back into buying mine! - Not for that money though :-)
henry-f said:
Welcome to my world boys.
After 20 years we`ve finally managed to get it sorted !
Henry
oh yes!!!??? On CONDITION -I saw a slate grey 964C2 on a G plate the other day, excellent interior and exterior, used daily driver, all the usual stone chips etc., but deep look to the paint even under the dirt, no top end overhaul done, and then I saw the mileage: 160,000 -I tell you, it looked more like 60,000 -looked after, these cars are true peaches.
So don't lose heart!!
>> Edited by Melv on Sunday 4th December 12:29
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