AML Share price fall
Discussion
Very sad to see this news this morning. Disappointing 2Q sales numbers in the UK and Europe, plus full year forecasts have been cut too. Feels like the future is reliant on BJ delivering and the necessity of success of the DBX too. Fingers crossed for AM that things work out.
Best Regards
Minglar
Best Regards
Minglar
Its not just Aston that are having a hard time of it . I understand McLaren are really struggling with loads of unsold stock at dealers. I recently been aware of 2 unsold Zag Shooting Brakes in the dealer network - both cancelled orders . Perhaps some reality setting in that the market for top end cars has overheated with too many models and too much volume and pricing under serious pressure .Speculators are running for the hills and private buyers waiting to see what falls out the other end . I'm sure Aston will come through - the business plan has credibility however I do think they need to concentrate on core product more with a really good offering that gets people hooked in to the brand - at the moment the focus seems more on limited production runs / specials with prices to match .
Edited by silverspeed on Wednesday 24th July 10:14
XXXAngelXXX said:
Shares are a long term investment..... 
Very true. If you're going to buy shares at or near to the IPO of a century old company that has lost money virtually every year it has existed then you should be prepared for some short-term losses.However as Aston enthusiasts, rather than shareholders, this isn't what we want to hear. I want Aston to be able to keep producing world class cars that I can go out and buy, but they can't do that unless they make money. Now they are a public company they need a path to sustainable profitability, rather than relying on the deep pockets of their private owners. I have faith that this will all blow over though.
The pricing of these new cars is way high imo...new DBS Volante almost 300k with options Not sure how many people are willing to take 80-100k bath for 12 months ownership of something like that regardless of your wealth. Mclaren Hatfield offering 43k contribution on new 570GT which has a list of £189k, again the list price is simply too high. Tough environment for all lux and sports car makers I feel but the aggressive pricing isn't helping.
raceboy said:
Do those considerably more financially savvy than me think they could be a good buy at £8 
Can they drop much lower?
Is in at £8 and out at £11 over a couple of months realistic?
I was tempted at £10 but £8 seems cheap to me.....obviously prices can go down aswell as up.
Nobody really knows, I expected the IPO to drop to the £6-8 mark given it was a bit of a hype machine. I have bought quite a bit more today though as it seems a massive over reaction. Can they drop much lower?
Is in at £8 and out at £11 over a couple of months realistic?
I was tempted at £10 but £8 seems cheap to me.....obviously prices can go down aswell as up.
RSbandit said:
The pricing of these new cars is way high imo...new DBS Volante almost 300k with options Not sure how many people are willing to take 80-100k bath for 12 months ownership of something like that regardless of your wealth. Mclaren Hatfield offering 43k contribution on new 570GT which has a list of £189k, again the list price is simply too high. Tough environment for all lux and sports car makers I feel but the aggressive pricing isn't helping.
I have long argued that AM have lost their way as regards where they sit in the market with pricing.I have thought of AM as being a competitor of Porsche and Maserati and not Ferrari and Lamborghini.
At the moment they sit in the middle between the two ,not imo where they should be.
All their competitors, except McLaren, are a division of much larger companies with very deep pockets that allow them to spend a lot on r and d , hence AM having to buy in technology from Mercedes albeit tweaking it to their own requirements.
It appears that AM are depending on customers from China ,India and the US and most of their hopes are pinned on the success of the DBX.
There is fierce completition in this sector and with Range Rover offering a very good vehicle at a substancially lower price point plus the current Bentley and Rolls Royce alternatives it's arguably an overcrowded sector already.
As an aside .....the new Chevvy at circa $60K.
Edited by avinalarf on Wednesday 24th July 11:44
The other factor is whilst new prices are too high, they're discouraging people from buying new by offering low (insulting ?) trade-in offers. So they can discount new prices all they like, but most buyers will have a premium car to dispose off, and if they can't offload them (or the cost to upgrade is too excessive), the whole process stalls.
Also, as much as I love my Vantage, if I was in the market to spend £140k-£150k on a new car, the new Vantage wouldn't be on my list. Driven one (very very quick), seen a few close up / on the road, and still can't bring myself to like the looks. Appreciate the market isn't great right now, but if you have a very desirable product, it will still sell.
Also, as much as I love my Vantage, if I was in the market to spend £140k-£150k on a new car, the new Vantage wouldn't be on my list. Driven one (very very quick), seen a few close up / on the road, and still can't bring myself to like the looks. Appreciate the market isn't great right now, but if you have a very desirable product, it will still sell.
Edited by S1-NOS on Wednesday 24th July 13:34
S1-NOS said:
The other factor is whilst new prices are too high, they're discouraging people from buying new by offering low (insulting ?) trade-in offers. So they can discount new prices all they like, but most buyers will have a premium car to dispose off, and if they can't offload them (or the cost to upgrade is too excessive), the whole process stalls.
Also, as much as I love my Vantage, if I was in the market to spend £140k-£150k on a new car, the new Vantage wouldn't be on my list. Driven one (very very quick), seen a few close up / on the road, and still can't bring myself to like the looks. Appreciate the market isn't great right now, but if you have a very desirable product, it will still sell.
The jump to upgrade is too much for most. Not wishing to bash the current product lineup but if they could produce a quality car for less than £100k, be lightweight, normally aspirated, fun to drive, etc, etc... I think it would sell like hotcakes.Also, as much as I love my Vantage, if I was in the market to spend £140k-£150k on a new car, the new Vantage wouldn't be on my list. Driven one (very very quick), seen a few close up / on the road, and still can't bring myself to like the looks. Appreciate the market isn't great right now, but if you have a very desirable product, it will still sell.
Edited by S1-NOS on Wednesday 24th July 13:34
As much as I thought the Cygnet was a bit tongue in cheek, why could they not do some work on an MX5 and create a sub-brand to punt it from? Too "low end" perhaps? It would at least get the punters buying into the brand.
Also if the DBX is supposed to save AML, I hope they have got the price right.
Totally agree with the comments, I had a late old shape Vantage and would have traded to a new one, but the price hike on the new vs old makes that impossible. Also the looks on the new one seem compromised to me, ugly at the front and back. Even if I had the money spare to change I don't think I would. It's easy to see why sales are suffering.
They should be competing with 100k price bracket, not 150k. There's hardly much space between the Vantage and DB11, not like the old vantage and DB9. DBX is going into a very crowded market. I won't be buying shares anytime soon.
Yes, there might be a short term rebound, but the long term doesn't look good in my opinion. The new Vantage was a major lost opportunity.
They should be competing with 100k price bracket, not 150k. There's hardly much space between the Vantage and DB11, not like the old vantage and DB9. DBX is going into a very crowded market. I won't be buying shares anytime soon.
Yes, there might be a short term rebound, but the long term doesn't look good in my opinion. The new Vantage was a major lost opportunity.
Edited by Snozzer on Wednesday 24th July 15:50
I think that with £150-250k sports cars, particularly once people have bought and sold a couple in that price range, many will not look at the cost price without looking at the depreciation too
The big depreciation problems for astons core range cannot be helping new sales
DBS has been very well received, but it's not a £250k car unless it shows strong residuals (which it doesn't).
Everything else filters down from there, right down to the horrifying offer Bins has had on his V12VR which as a former owner of that model, made me shudder slightly ! Especially so given that mine had a similar number of miles on it and I'm going to be passing 10k miles by the end of the summer in my AMR
Add to all of this a general softening in the market, I suspect a step too far on some of the specials (which I'd guess in the case of DB5 Bond, DBZ/DB4GT and even Valhalla despite what they say publicly, aren't sold out) and no DBX production yet and it's probably not the best time to be looking at AML PLC. Really needs waiting until next year to see how these issues pan out and in the meantime, presumably a bumpy ride
The big depreciation problems for astons core range cannot be helping new sales
DBS has been very well received, but it's not a £250k car unless it shows strong residuals (which it doesn't).
Everything else filters down from there, right down to the horrifying offer Bins has had on his V12VR which as a former owner of that model, made me shudder slightly ! Especially so given that mine had a similar number of miles on it and I'm going to be passing 10k miles by the end of the summer in my AMR
Add to all of this a general softening in the market, I suspect a step too far on some of the specials (which I'd guess in the case of DB5 Bond, DBZ/DB4GT and even Valhalla despite what they say publicly, aren't sold out) and no DBX production yet and it's probably not the best time to be looking at AML PLC. Really needs waiting until next year to see how these issues pan out and in the meantime, presumably a bumpy ride
The US is Astons 2nd largest market. The US economy is the best it's ever been and car sales are booming. Luxury and high end cars sales are doing very well.
Aston can blame themselves for poor sales. When they released the new (hideous) Vantage at a ridiculous price, they shot themselves in the foot. I doubt Palmer will ever admit it.
Unfortunately now it's like the Titanic trying to avoid the iceberg.
Aston can blame themselves for poor sales. When they released the new (hideous) Vantage at a ridiculous price, they shot themselves in the foot. I doubt Palmer will ever admit it.
Unfortunately now it's like the Titanic trying to avoid the iceberg.
Bobajobbob said:
New Vantage is too ugly and too expensive. If I don’t want one, then Aston do have a problem.
Do you remember the open day at St Athan, when AML 'received the keys'?
Marek Reichman introduced me to one of the designers, with the comment, -?-?- has done a lot of the design work.
A three quarter view pencil sketch was on to the table, and it revealed a shark look front design.
Improving on the design of the original Vantage was obviously going to be extremely difficult, but I did make the comment, "You might have a problem if that front goes into production". They appeared to have followed the DB10, but I could not see any of the traditional horizontal bars.
About a year later, we saw the result. It was so disappointing for me, because I wanted to buy one, so I am with you Bob.
A few weeks after the unveiling, a dealer who had experience of the clamour to order following the original 2003 launch, said to me, "We won't have a repeat of the two year waiting list". Presumably it must have been obvious to many people, so how was it given the go ahead? Good sales of the 'starter' model, must be so very important to Aston Martin.
An Aston Martin has to capture us with its beauty at the very first sight.
Edited by Dewi 2 on Wednesday 24th July 17:07
AstonV said:
The US is Astons 2nd largest market. The US economy is the best it's ever been and car sales are booming.
In the first half of 2019 automotive sales in the US are down 2 percent year-on-year. Passenger cars, excluding trucks, are down 8.9 percent.That's a very interesting definition of "booming"
https://www.marklines.com/en/statistics/flash_sale...
Dewi 2 said:
Bobajobbob said:
New Vantage is too ugly and too expensive. If I don’t want one, then Aston do have a problem.
Do you remember the open day at St Athan, when AML 'received the keys'?
Marek Reichman introduced me to one of the designers, with the comment, -?-?- has done a lot of the design work.
A three quarter view pencil sketch was on to the table, and it revealed a shark look front design.
Improving on the design of the original Vantage was obviously going to be extremely difficult, but I did make the comment, "You might have a problem if that front goes into production". They appeared to have followed the DB10, but I could not see any of the traditional horizontal bars.
About a year later, we saw the result. It was so disappointing for me, because I wanted to buy one, so I am with you Bob.
Edited by Dewi 2 on Wednesday 24th July 17:07
There is a 4 month waiting list to get one. Its a tragedy that Aston didn't listen to its loyal core customers (including the 500 pages of criticism on Pistonheads) I guess the chickens are coming home to roost.Gassing Station | Aston Martin | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff