Andy Palmer - gone
Discussion
Well I guess it’s no surprise really. I would like to think that he must have had the foresight to see this coming. As previously mentioned, it does open up a lot of questions regarding the future, but hopefully with a good outcome. The fact that it’s a senior AMG/Mercedes person now in the role should be encouraging for the employees who have probably been through a difficult time recently, as it may also ensure a financial backstop for the business. As much as he has been vilified at times on here, I think that by and large AP has his heart in the right place. However his previous methods at Nissan were probably not appropriate for a niche manufacturer like AM, and of course he will always be held partially accountable for some of the IPO shambles. Here’s hoping that this could be the start of a new and profitable age for AM going forward, as surely we all want the company to succeed. Fingers crossed.
Best Regards
Minglar
Best Regards
Minglar
lukeharding said:
As for Andy Palmer.................... I don't have the correct education or insight to know if IPO was solely his fault or a whole multitude of people
You dont need education or insight to ask yourself two questions.....1. Was the IPO a success ?
2. Who was in charge when the IPO took place ?
Answers on a postcard please.
ps are you Andy's son ?
lukeharding said:
I'm sure everyone will be thrilled if/when AM becomes AMG Premium. If they ditch the V6, which seems entirely possible, then it'll surely be AMG engines for everyone which no doubt everyone here will love. I think everyone has been so concerned with if AM will survive, that they've not really considered what it might turn into if it does when in the shadow of a brand like AMG.
Not sure if serious? AM as “AMG Premium” wouldn’t really do it for me on many levels. Indeed it’s some of the Merc content that puts me off the DBSS. Sure there’s more development money in systems at a Mercedes group level, which in theory makes them better (I say”in theory” as our last merc was a disaster) but I’ve always found them underwhelming. If AM does go down that route, hopefully it’ll be more successful than Maybach.
Lots of 2 + 2 = 5 here. The movement of a senior executive doesn’t denote AML becoming AMG. It could of course happen but it’s still a degree removed. Daimler doesn’t need another brand and Mr Moers is an ambitious individual in his own right.
This outcome has been clear for some time - arguably from the Pre-IPO Geneva show where the hubris and oversell became obvious. Mr Palmer shouldn’t be held primarily responsible for the IPO though - that was shareholder led. Investindustrial specifically with backing from the Kuwaitis. Private Equity ownership comes with caveats...
This outcome has been clear for some time - arguably from the Pre-IPO Geneva show where the hubris and oversell became obvious. Mr Palmer shouldn’t be held primarily responsible for the IPO though - that was shareholder led. Investindustrial specifically with backing from the Kuwaitis. Private Equity ownership comes with caveats...
People seem to forget that when AP took the job, the writing was somewhat on the wall - he inherited a very difficult job. The business simply hadn't/doesn't generate enough cash to fund development. They signed a deal with the devil in the PE money from Invest Industrial. Who knows what would have happened without their cash injection, but it seemed clear from the start that he was tasked by his employers with 'polishing a turd' in order for the cynical, inappropriate IPO. As has been said before, the fact no capital was raised by the IPO spoke volumes about their short term approach. There is an awful lot to criticise, but AP did a lot of good and I believe he was right to instigate an SUV and the introduction of mid engined models. That said, history will not be kind.
Tobias Moers must have known about this for some time.
His staff car has already been painted in Aston Martin Racing colours.
https://youtu.be/OfdNHYjXoAg
pschlute said:
lukeharding said:
As for Andy Palmer.................... I don't have the correct education or insight to know if IPO was solely his fault or a whole multitude of people
You dont need education or insight to ask yourself two questions.....1. Was the IPO a success ?
2. Who was in charge when the IPO took place ?
Answers on a postcard please.
ps are you Andy's son ?
Soleith said:
Harsh. Undoubtedly AP needs to shoulder some of the responsibility for the IPO but these things are not at the sole discretion of the CEO.
If he disagreed he had the option of resigning. I know honour may be an outdated concept these days, but he cannot have his cake and eat it.Well I’m glad I own one of the last NA V12 manuals ever built by AML, because if Merc get their grips on it then future cars will be as faceless as the s
te Mercedes currently build......
They build great sales rep cars, but sorry they haven’t got a fking clue when it come proper hand built sports cars.
If Merc honestly get their grips into a AML, then they keep it. The V12SMR will possibly be the last modern AML I’d buy.
te Mercedes currently build......They build great sales rep cars, but sorry they haven’t got a f
king clue when it come proper hand built sports cars.If Merc honestly get their grips into a AML, then they keep it. The V12SMR will possibly be the last modern AML I’d buy.
pschlute said:
Soleith said:
Harsh. Undoubtedly AP needs to shoulder some of the responsibility for the IPO but these things are not at the sole discretion of the CEO.
If he disagreed he had the option of resigning. I know honour may be an outdated concept these days, but he cannot have his cake and eat it.
Soleith said:
pschlute said:
Soleith said:
Harsh. Undoubtedly AP needs to shoulder some of the responsibility for the IPO but these things are not at the sole discretion of the CEO.
If he disagreed he had the option of resigning. I know honour may be an outdated concept these days, but he cannot have his cake and eat it.One of his jobs was the voice of all that nonsense about, 'we are not a car manufacturer, but a luxury goods business and therefore should be given an appropriately higher valuation.'
A car enthusiast, racer and Interesting to talk to. Gave the go ahead to many wonderful (possibly fantasy) projects, but boy, did he know how to spend, borrow more and keep spending, until the cash was literally all gone. His successors are now faced with repaying almost £1 billion in just 23 months time. His so called business plan was, well let's just say, far too ambitious for an historically struggling, low volume sports car maker.
There presumably must be a secret plan now. Mercedes would certainly provide financial security, but should we be concerned about a future AML model line-up? There own recent philosophy has gradually changed from their traditional premium only position, to offering a car for every sector, each one being indistinguishable from the front. Remember when they bought Chrysler and that did not last long, but in that time, they did manage to put a Chrysler body on an SLK and called it a sports car.
If AML does become part of Daimler, perhaps it depends how much control is applied.
Looking back, the Ford ownership era is considered by many, to have been a succesful period for the Company. Sales had never been better and their car designs were popular.
It appears that Ford provided the money and technical guidance, but left AML surprisingly free to make their own decisions.
By the end of that era, AML had probably benefited more than Ford.
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