E46 as an investment

[Mr Tidy]

aka_kerrly said:

My uncle has a X reg (2000) 330ci SE auto cabriolet in topaz blue with beige leather that he has owned from new and although not 100% to my taste it is a superb specification (loads of options) & has aged very well. It's in great condition yet to many worth barely a few grand

I had a 52 plate E46 325ti Sport Manual in Imola Red with full black leather for a few years that I sold for less than £1,500 in February this year.

330ci (Great) - SE (No) - Auto (No) - Cab (No) - sadly I can't see an 18 year old cabriolet being worth much more than a grand.

[aka_kerrly]

Mr Tidy said:

I had a 52 plate E46 325ti Sport Manual in Imola Red with full black leather for a few years that I sold for less than £1,500 in February this year.

330ci (Great) - SE (No) - Auto (No) - Cab (No) - sadly I can't see an 18 year old cabriolet being worth much more than a grand.

I know , you sold it a week after I'd bought a Civic Type R after getting inpatient trying to find a facelift sport 325TI in Red or black

My point is exactly that, to most car enthusiasts who tend to be the ones who will pay more for the right car it is a bum spec but in terms of what the general public get told in dealerships about avoiding bright colours and going for safer colours & having leather plus auto box it's exactly what people want when actually it's the opposite which is now more desirable in the second hand market.

[survivalist]

sparks_E46 said:

Mr Whippy said:

Bodywork care starts early.

I’ve just bought a 10yr old 50k mile car and priority number 1 is getting the underneath and arch areas cleaned and protected before winter sets in.

So many people ignore it, but it’s those bits that need doing from 10yrs onwards (if not from new) that’ll be the ones that are eventually the decent value ones later.


On a monocoque car there is no way to avoid the rust just ruining everything... fixable but at big cost.
Again that’s why old cars in great nick are worth £££... not because they’re old and desirable, but because they’re old and in great nick, which cost money...!

What’s a big cost though? Circa £500 to sort out a rear arch (cut out and weld) isn’t a “big cost” in my opinion and something I’ll be paying shortly to sort out one of the the rear arches of my ~£2k E46 330ci. Definitely not cheap, and I guess expensive compared to the value of the car and about a third of my monthly take home, but we’re not talking untold thousands here. The front arches can just be replaced quite cheaply too. I had a similar repair carried out to my 530i Sport drivers rear arch and 4 years later it was perfect still. I guess I could get it “cheaply done” but quality is remembered long after cost has been forgotten!

I am under no illusion though in 2/3 years when I will likely sell the 330ci it will likely be worth no more than a grand but whilst I have it I want to look after it properly.

I think it’s the ‘expensive compared to the value of the car’ that puts most people (eg non petrol heads) off.

Even if you’re an enthusiast you have to be sure that you’re keeping the car for a reasonable amount of time as in my experience you don’t get your money back at re-sale time.

This, combined with expensive parts is why we are now hitting the point where many E46s are worth more in parts and being broken rather than repaired. There’s a For Sale thread for a manual M3 convertible in what looks to be decent condition - still worth more in parts apparently.

[Mr Tidy]

aka_kerrly said:

I know , you sold it a week after I'd bought a Civic Type R after getting inpatient trying to find a facelift sport 325TI in Red or black

My point is exactly that, to most car enthusiasts who tend to be the ones who will pay more for the right car it is a bum spec but in terms of what the general public get told in dealerships about avoiding bright colours and going for safer colours & having leather plus auto box it's exactly what people want when actually it's the opposite which is now more desirable in the second hand market.

Sorry! But I didn't know you were looking for one then! :

[C70R]

aka_kerrly said:

iSore said:

it would have to be a good spec - so no sub 3.0 toss or saloons, no silver grey or beige interiors or nasty greens/golds or SE's but 330Ci Sport Coupes and maybe Convertibles in a nice colour (black, silver, Imola red, Topaz blue) with black leather. Top of the range desirable-when-new, basically. Clubsports will fetch a significant premium with facelift Estoril blue manuals being the cream. Such a car is worth buying now if you can find one that doesn't immediately need a shedload of £££ throwing at it. A friend has a 40k from new 330Ci Sport Convertible in silver with (yuk) grey leather and it's absolutely box fresh. That's already a £5000+ car now.
.

This is pretty much my view to. My ideal E46 (non M) would be a manual 330sport coupe, in Imola red, estoril blue, velvet blue or with the alcantara sport interior, although I was close to buying a black 330ci that had a blackcurrant leather interior which actually looked really good... shame the rest of the car was a let down. Sadly my ideal specification probably equates to about 5% of E46s sold hence I've searched but yet to find the right one.

My uncle has a X reg (2000) 330ci SE auto cabriolet in topaz blue with beige leather that he has owned from new and although not 100% to my taste it is a superb specification (loads of options) & has aged very well. It's in great condition yet to many worth barely a few grand

Your uncle's car is worth less than £3k, unless it's ridiculously low mileage. How much do you think a 20-year old, mass-market car should be worth?

[aka_kerrly]

C70R said:

Your uncle's car is worth less than £3k, unless it's ridiculously low mileage. How much do you think a 20-year old, mass-market car should be worth?

i think we are in agreement regarding values!

my uncles is on sub 40k miles 1 owner full bmw service history and i wouldn't pay 2k for it but others most definitely would pay a bit more maybe 3k is around the right area even if i spent a weekend detailing it which represents about 10% of its original cost.

this is exactly why i think anything over 5k for a non m3 is staggering expensive as its still around 20-25% of the as new price yet there are some already being advertised for nearer 10k on the promise of investment value which on a mass market old car is ludicrous.

[Toltec]

Given people collect Marinas and Allegros I don't think being a mass market model has anything to do with it.

[aka_kerrly]

Toltec said:

Given people collect Marinas and Allegros I don't think being a mass market model has anything to do with it.

That's a fair point, people do collect them an they are upwards of 40years old.

im starting to wonder if a generation of people who think a Iphone 6 is old and an IPhone 3 is ancient when its barely a decade old are whats screwing things as they think a 10year old car is some kind of rare antique.

[Mr Tidy]

aka_kerrly said:

Toltec said:

Given people collect Marinas and Allegros I don't think being a mass market model has anything to do with it.

That's a fair point, people do collect them an they are upwards of 40years old.

im starting to wonder if a generation of people who think a Iphone 6 is old and an IPhone 3 is ancient when its barely a decade old are whats screwing things as they think a 10year old car is some kind of rare antique.

Maybe, but that can only be good news for those of us that know better!

[Toltec]

Mr Tidy said:

Maybe, but that can only be good news for those of us that know better!

Better hang on to the 2002 325 Ti Sport for now then, it even has the original rear Lexus style lights and is an auto so even more rare than the manuals.

[Mr Tidy]

Toltec said:

Better hang on to the 2002 325 Ti Sport for now then, it even has the original rear Lexus style lights and is an auto so even more rare than the manuals.

Lexus lights may be a good thing, but I don't see an Auto being a bonus - they are rare for a reason!

[Toltec]

Mr Tidy said:

Toltec said:

Better hang on to the 2002 325 Ti Sport for now then, it even has the original rear Lexus style lights and is an auto so even more rare than the manuals.

Lexus lights may be a good thing, but I don't see an Auto being a bonus - they are rare for a reason!

I may not have been entirely serious.

[nxh66]

I can't help looking at that 3k mile 330i clubsport and thinking thats crazy money.....but the other side of my brain is thinking you can't buy a new N/A 6 cylinder BMW anymore and you probably can't buy a 3k mile bmw of any variety for 16k normally, never mind a 3.0.

Assuming it has been well stored and is literally like new I'd be tempted to buy it and use it as a daily driver! Do 120k in 10 years for some cheap motoring. Look after it well and it will still be one of the best E46s out there in 10 years time.

[danp]

I’m more familiar with compact prices but to me the E46 is significantly undervalued as a “modern classic” ;-)

I’ve a late, very low mileage 325ti Sport and it’s worth about half to a third of a comparable mk5 Golf GTI or 130i (perhaps they’re over valued)

I don’t suppose I’ll keep it that long but given time I’m sure prices of decent E46s will go the way of the E30/E36, especially manual 6 pot Sports.

Edit: to me they’re also the last of the old school 3 series in a few ways, which for me is good.

They feel small and low, they didn’t come on runflats, they have a water temperature gauge within a driver angled dash and you can change the battery without needing BMW to code it to the car. And they even start with a key! Yet still new enough to scrape 4* NCAP if you care about such things.

Edited by danp on Tuesday 29th May 19:41

[Mr Tidy]

Nicely put "danp".

But as much as I loved my 325ti, having an E86 with the 3 litre N52 engine makes me realise why 130is command such a premium!

As great as the 325ti may drive, another 73 bhp in a similar sized hatchback does have strong appeal!

If only they had made an E46 330ti.

[Maxus]

I think prices will stabalise and then when the poor examples disappear through rust/mechanical issues the remaining good examples will slowly rise like the E30 and E36 has. The E46 is well regarded as a classic BMW design with a superb 6 cylinder engine. I personally have always preferred it to the E36.

Most importantly, I love owning and driving them (mine is a 330 sport convertible/facelift/individual/manual). Old enough to be engaging to drive yet new enough to just work as long as it is maintained properly.

[GreatGranny]

Look on Atrader and try finding a low mileage 330Ci for less than £4k.

There aren't any and the low mileage Sports are in at £5k+.

There's a lovely estoril blue CS on 94k miles in Lincoln for £4,950.

Black leather, looks very nice.

[iSore]

danp said:

I’m more familiar with compact prices but to me the E46 is significantly undervalued as a “modern classic” ;-)

I’ve a late, very low mileage 325ti Sport and it’s worth about half to a third of a comparable mk5 Golf GTI or 130i (perhaps they’re over valued)

I don’t suppose I’ll keep it that long but given time I’m sure prices of decent E46s will go the way of the E30/E36, especially manual 6 pot Sports.

Edit: to me they’re also the last of the old school 3 series in a few ways, which for me is good.

They feel small and low, they didn’t come on runflats, they have a water temperature gauge within a driver angled dash and you can change the battery without needing BMW to code it to the car. And they even start with a key! Yet still new enough to scrape 4* NCAP if you care about such things.

Edited by danp on Tuesday 29th May 19:41

I take the opposite view. Going back 10 years, I thought the E92 330i was a vastly better car and wondered who the hell would want an E46.

[Mr Tidy]

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[Mr Roper]

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