BMW Throttle Delay
Discussion
Thanks very much Marco, I look forward to your brother's response.
My car was made in December 2000. I can't believe BMW allowed many more cars to be built with this serious flaw, so I am hoping that a later car wouldn't do it.
I'm changing the car ASAP, so I will indeed try and find a newer 330 (preferably a sport) and test drive it. If there's no delay, I'm buying one!
I did approach my local BMW sales centre and ask to try a 325i to compare with mine and they were very odd with me, and refused to co-operate. After a few minutes of persuasion, I managed to get them to let me sit in a 325i and blip the throttle at a standstill. It seemed fine to me at a standstill, but they wouldn't let me drive it. I told them I was investigating the fault with my car, which may have been the wrong way to go about it. Explicitly stating that I have £20k to spend on a car may prove more fruitful!
I look forward to your brother's response.
My car was made in December 2000. I can't believe BMW allowed many more cars to be built with this serious flaw, so I am hoping that a later car wouldn't do it.
I'm changing the car ASAP, so I will indeed try and find a newer 330 (preferably a sport) and test drive it. If there's no delay, I'm buying one!
I did approach my local BMW sales centre and ask to try a 325i to compare with mine and they were very odd with me, and refused to co-operate. After a few minutes of persuasion, I managed to get them to let me sit in a 325i and blip the throttle at a standstill. It seemed fine to me at a standstill, but they wouldn't let me drive it. I told them I was investigating the fault with my car, which may have been the wrong way to go about it. Explicitly stating that I have £20k to spend on a car may prove more fruitful!
I look forward to your brother's response.
Rob,
Interested to read this thread; I'm hopefully going to test drive a 330 Sport saloon in the next few weeks - will certainly watch out for the problem you've described!
Jim
P.S. I see still living at home with no rent to pay works wonders for your legendary car purchasing power..
P.P.S. If you don't recognise my name then my 'p.s.' will probably really confuse you..
Interested to read this thread; I'm hopefully going to test drive a 330 Sport saloon in the next few weeks - will certainly watch out for the problem you've described!
Jim
P.S. I see still living at home with no rent to pay works wonders for your legendary car purchasing power..
P.P.S. If you don't recognise my name then my 'p.s.' will probably really confuse you..
Hi Jim,
Yes, living at home with a low (not no, but low) rent works wonders for car purchasing power. :-)
As for the 330. Everything else about the car is just perfect, and I mean that. The handling is stunning, the damping and body control is first class, and that creamy 6 cyl engine is just lovely to use and listen to. The servicing is cheap and every 30k miles, and at motorway cruising speeds you can whisper to your passengers and still be heard. A fantastic car.
Please do look out for that throttle delay though, as when you factor THAT into the equation, my 330 coupe if far and away the WORST CAR I have ever owned. It is infuriating beyond belief!
I am currently looking at test driving a newer 330 coupe, and I will buy one if the delay has been removed.
ps - look out for the Sport saloon - supposed to be markedly better for us petrolheads than the standard model.
Yes, living at home with a low (not no, but low) rent works wonders for car purchasing power. :-)
As for the 330. Everything else about the car is just perfect, and I mean that. The handling is stunning, the damping and body control is first class, and that creamy 6 cyl engine is just lovely to use and listen to. The servicing is cheap and every 30k miles, and at motorway cruising speeds you can whisper to your passengers and still be heard. A fantastic car.
Please do look out for that throttle delay though, as when you factor THAT into the equation, my 330 coupe if far and away the WORST CAR I have ever owned. It is infuriating beyond belief!
I am currently looking at test driving a newer 330 coupe, and I will buy one if the delay has been removed.
ps - look out for the Sport saloon - supposed to be markedly better for us petrolheads than the standard model.
Hi R..............ob ( a quick 330 "in " joke)
Have just purchased a lovely 330 (jan 2001)touring privately and pound for pound dont think it can be beaten.........except at roundabout or t junctions....when you need a bloody big stick !!!
Yes you guessed it mine hesitates to and the only reason i didnt question it was a/ the price b/ weather conditions on the test drive.
Until reading your posting i didnt realise this problem was going to be such a challenge to rectify, but surely there has to be an answer in view of this great cars credentials and dare i say potentials.
I to have owned an older 325 auto that you could play with the accelerator pedal to your hearts content.
IF B.M.W dont want to know ....is there any independents that can shine the light or has any publications highlighted this problem already prior to my purchase.......
Exit stage left to sit and sulk.
Have just purchased a lovely 330 (jan 2001)touring privately and pound for pound dont think it can be beaten.........except at roundabout or t junctions....when you need a bloody big stick !!!
Yes you guessed it mine hesitates to and the only reason i didnt question it was a/ the price b/ weather conditions on the test drive.
Until reading your posting i didnt realise this problem was going to be such a challenge to rectify, but surely there has to be an answer in view of this great cars credentials and dare i say potentials.
I to have owned an older 325 auto that you could play with the accelerator pedal to your hearts content.
IF B.M.W dont want to know ....is there any independents that can shine the light or has any publications highlighted this problem already prior to my purchase.......
Exit stage left to sit and sulk.
I too am left a bit confused how I have made this mistake. I have been reading Autocar for fifteen years, and EVO since issue one (still have them all on my shelf!), yet I was totally unaware of this fly-by-wire throttle problem.
I had noticed the problem on boring hire cars like Vectras and 407s, but had just assumed that it was one of the many daft 'features' that 'waste of time' cars such as that had.
I am amazed that I've never read about such things in magazines!
Also, BMW - what are you playing at? The 330 is almost perfect in every area - so much care has clearly gone into all the oily bits, switchgear, trim, styling etc - I am amazed that they have totally ruined the car with this small feature! Bizarre!
Even the new ones do it - I drove all variants of the 1 series the other day at a BMW organised day at Rockingham. BMW must have spent thousands on the day - free drinks and food everywhere, amazingly polite and intelligent staff everywhere. The car itself clearly was another example of fine BMW engineering, and had taken years to develop. However, the car was ruined by the throttle delay!!! It was admittedly much smaller than the early 330s, but it ruined it for me.
The 330 is getting off my driveway as fast as I can sell the stupid thing and I'm buying something else!! I'll lose about 3 months pay out of this whole farce :-(
I know of four other people who were going to buy BMWs, but now aren't because I suggested they looked for this problem on their test drive - they found it, and walked away. One is buying a Golf, and the other an A3.
I had noticed the problem on boring hire cars like Vectras and 407s, but had just assumed that it was one of the many daft 'features' that 'waste of time' cars such as that had.
I am amazed that I've never read about such things in magazines!
Also, BMW - what are you playing at? The 330 is almost perfect in every area - so much care has clearly gone into all the oily bits, switchgear, trim, styling etc - I am amazed that they have totally ruined the car with this small feature! Bizarre!
Even the new ones do it - I drove all variants of the 1 series the other day at a BMW organised day at Rockingham. BMW must have spent thousands on the day - free drinks and food everywhere, amazingly polite and intelligent staff everywhere. The car itself clearly was another example of fine BMW engineering, and had taken years to develop. However, the car was ruined by the throttle delay!!! It was admittedly much smaller than the early 330s, but it ruined it for me.
The 330 is getting off my driveway as fast as I can sell the stupid thing and I'm buying something else!! I'll lose about 3 months pay out of this whole farce :-(
I know of four other people who were going to buy BMWs, but now aren't because I suggested they looked for this problem on their test drive - they found it, and walked away. One is buying a Golf, and the other an A3.
Do people really buy cars without driving them far enough to get familiar with the feel of the controls, including throttle response? With ever increasing electronic engine management and pollution control the throttle is being taken away from the driver. Modern fuel management is a mile away from the carburettor "accelerator pump" which dumped large quantities of fuel into the cylinders every time the driver gave a sharp stab on the throttle. The issue now is not the engine's ability to respond but the computer's willingness to allow more fuel into the engine. I demand proper throttle control of any engine and have for this reason walked away from various cars which looked attractive on paper. The golden rule is "try before you buy".
Gaston - yep! I'm that stupid! :-) I won't make that mistake again though. I was completely innocent and uneducated about this problem (previously owned a Caterham and an old E36 325i, and then just a string of sports cars with cable throttles). Magazines don't help - I've never read about this issue at all despite subsribing to EVO, Autocar and Octane.
I just trusted BMW - and it is the last time that I will!!
I just trusted BMW - and it is the last time that I will!!
If anyone's interested in my progress in this saga:
I have now written to BMW GB and the dealer where I bought the car and formally asked for my money back (before it was just over the phone, and a letter of dissatisfaction). I'll let you all know what response (if any) that I get. I also pointed out that I was sold an import at a main dealer, which I'm not sure is usual practice for an official BMW dealer.
Failing that, if anyone wants an immaculate dark blue 330ci with an 8 month BMW warranty and roadside assist, let me know. If you're tempted, I'd reccomend you read this thread before you call me though!
I have now written to BMW GB and the dealer where I bought the car and formally asked for my money back (before it was just over the phone, and a letter of dissatisfaction). I'll let you all know what response (if any) that I get. I also pointed out that I was sold an import at a main dealer, which I'm not sure is usual practice for an official BMW dealer.
Failing that, if anyone wants an immaculate dark blue 330ci with an 8 month BMW warranty and roadside assist, let me know. If you're tempted, I'd reccomend you read this thread before you call me though!
I don't have much of a case - but I'm trying!!
The throttle is fly-by-wire and has a delay, which makes it at best frustrating and at worst dangerous. The car is truly awful to drive. Fly-by-wire doesn't have to be like that - drive a Clio V6 and see! :-)
The fact that it was an import was revealed to me seconds before I shook hands on the deal. I don't think BMW dealers are supposed to sell imports.
The worst they can say to my money back plea is no, so I thought I'd try, otherwise I'm selling it privately and stomaching the loss. I'm about to take a serious pay cut by changing jobs and I really don't need to lose the money right now!
The throttle is fly-by-wire and has a delay, which makes it at best frustrating and at worst dangerous. The car is truly awful to drive. Fly-by-wire doesn't have to be like that - drive a Clio V6 and see! :-)
The fact that it was an import was revealed to me seconds before I shook hands on the deal. I don't think BMW dealers are supposed to sell imports.
The worst they can say to my money back plea is no, so I thought I'd try, otherwise I'm selling it privately and stomaching the loss. I'm about to take a serious pay cut by changing jobs and I really don't need to lose the money right now!
Well, the response is through from BMW and unsurprisingly I'm not getting my money back!! The car does have a few other faults though (200 point check - yeah right!), and they've agreed to fix those for free and give me a courtesy car whilst they do it (big thumbs up to BMW for that).
BMW acknowledged that they have received "several complaints" regarding fly-by-wire throttles since they were introduced, but state that the delay on my car is 'within tolerances for your vehicle'. lol
The dealer that I got the car from have also stated that they "don't have a problem with personal imports, and will stock them just as happily as they would a UK car". Seems a bit off to me, but that's their decision.
I've learnt from the experience - I'm going to be far more careful on test drives in future before spending my hard earned money. I'm just going to stomach the loss (my car will go up for sale as soon as it has had all the faults resolved), and buy something else!
BMW acknowledged that they have received "several complaints" regarding fly-by-wire throttles since they were introduced, but state that the delay on my car is 'within tolerances for your vehicle'. lol
The dealer that I got the car from have also stated that they "don't have a problem with personal imports, and will stock them just as happily as they would a UK car". Seems a bit off to me, but that's their decision.
I've learnt from the experience - I'm going to be far more careful on test drives in future before spending my hard earned money. I'm just going to stomach the loss (my car will go up for sale as soon as it has had all the faults resolved), and buy something else!
Sorry to hear that. I'm hoping the 330 coupe will sell well. It is a very nice looking car, with 18 inch wheels, dark blue metallic paintwork, chrome strips around the windows and it has a nice spec as well. After my experience with the car I should imagine that those are the sorts of things people look for in a modern BMW!!!! so I'm hoping people will pay a reasonable price for it :-)
Our 528i November 1999 has a slight delay and is the only thing that lets the car down. I know what you are exsperiencing. However i would recomend going to a good BMW independent and letting them have a look at the car. They could acess the brain of the car and you never know there could be a fault code comming up. Call me a little cinical, but i am sure if the main dealer found a fault code that was going to cost them a large amount of money to fix they would try and ensure they would not notice it. I rechon the problem is with the ECU.
Our 528 would kangaroo if you did the test mentioned above and is one of the first BMW's with the fly by wire throttle. There is however a slight delay that makes driving at slow speeds in traffic a little difficult. I think the problem stems from BMW being now designed around Automatic gear boxes and not manuals. Generally we don't notice it too much although driving in the snow with the delay makes for very slippy progress.
Our 528 would kangaroo if you did the test mentioned above and is one of the first BMW's with the fly by wire throttle. There is however a slight delay that makes driving at slow speeds in traffic a little difficult. I think the problem stems from BMW being now designed around Automatic gear boxes and not manuals. Generally we don't notice it too much although driving in the snow with the delay makes for very slippy progress.
RobM77,.......I've never owned a BMW and have no experience of them, but bear with me.
My 4.0ltr N/A Jag XJ8 displays the same symptoms.
However, with one small difference........press the: "S" sports mode button and the throttle reaction becomes instantaneous.
Normal mapping mode is for that gentle driving mode and Max MPG........."OK it has a slight lag but hey?"
Pressing the "sports mode" button however changes the homely feline into a raging beast!.... with immediate response from the throttle. But as you say, driving it; "spiritedly" in normal mode is dangerous when throttle response is vital. The Jag obviously has two mappings.
So, it sounds like a question of mapping to me, I'm not having it that BMW can't produce a responsive car. Methinks that someone somewhere has MPG and emissions to the forefront of their minds and perhaps an independent tuning specialist could help. A BMW dealer is unlikely to deviate from the "spec" mapping for warranty reasons?.......
Forgive me but I don't even know if your car has a "sports" mode, although I agree that in the main, this applies more to "auto-boxes" but not always.........
Hope my meandering thoughts help.....8Pack
My 4.0ltr N/A Jag XJ8 displays the same symptoms.
However, with one small difference........press the: "S" sports mode button and the throttle reaction becomes instantaneous.
Normal mapping mode is for that gentle driving mode and Max MPG........."OK it has a slight lag but hey?"
Pressing the "sports mode" button however changes the homely feline into a raging beast!.... with immediate response from the throttle. But as you say, driving it; "spiritedly" in normal mode is dangerous when throttle response is vital. The Jag obviously has two mappings.
So, it sounds like a question of mapping to me, I'm not having it that BMW can't produce a responsive car. Methinks that someone somewhere has MPG and emissions to the forefront of their minds and perhaps an independent tuning specialist could help. A BMW dealer is unlikely to deviate from the "spec" mapping for warranty reasons?.......
Forgive me but I don't even know if your car has a "sports" mode, although I agree that in the main, this applies more to "auto-boxes" but not always.........
Hope my meandering thoughts help.....8Pack
No, that's fine - you're spot on. The M3 version of my car also has such a button. BMW, and several aftermarket tuners that I have spoken to, say that they can't remove the delay on a 330 coupe (strange, but true!). Aftermarket tuners say that they can make the delay smaller, and indeed I have tried such a car with a smaller delay, but they can't remove it. Aftermarket tined cars can have more power, and better mpg, but sadly I've yet to see evidence of the removal of a throttle delay.
Thumbs up to Jaguar for providing the button! :-)
Thumbs up to Jaguar for providing the button! :-)
Gassing Station | BMW General | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff