Fuel pipe replacement, engine bay

[andy43]

Can of worms well and truly opened.
That E85 hose looks like it's good stuff - 280 psi instead of 140psi, and ok to 257 degrees F. plus they do stainless fuel hose clamps. I've seen the braided hose kit before but didn't realise it was, erm, not quite ideal for long term use. Does look good though...
Thread hi-jack... I have AC so three underbonnet hoses on mine - can anyone confirm they're all 8mm dia?

[ray von]

Good post COG. I never clicked on that link, ffs there are some right nimrods get on here. What a shocking attitude. Hopefully anyone looking for fuel hoses will do a search and find this thread.
As someone who has had an underbonnet fire I can tell you it doesn't half give you a brown trouser moment.

[bobfather]

Interesting post on the chim owners fb group. I won't be fitting braided fuel hoses on my car after all

[ChimpOnGas]

bobfather said:

Interesting post on the chim owners fb group. I won't be fitting braided fuel hoses on my car after all

Just seen it, that's absolutely shocking

[bobfather]

The fb user posted this:

Investigating a fuel leak, the braided hoses fitted approximately three years ago in a Chimaera engine bay, braiding pulled back to reveal this

[KateV8]

That was our short length of high pressure fuel hose between the pump and the filter, luckily the leak was spotted before the car went out on the road. The hose was fitted by a Northern specialist three years ago, thankfully Kate's recent visit to Powers has seen all the engine bay fuel hose replaced by a good quality non-braided product. I was shocked when I pulled the braiding back!

[ChimpOnGas]

KateV8 said:

That was our short length of high pressure fuel hose between the pump and the filter

That's not even a area that's subject to heat, TBH looking at those pictures and knowing it got that way in just three years I would say the hose under that braid isn't even proper fuel hose.

The issue wasn't really the braid but the quality of hose under it, the braid did however mean you couldn't see the horrors underneath which creating a fatal combination.

Let's face it didn't suddenly fail like that exactly at year three either, it was probably already in very poor shape after just a few weeks of use by the look of it.

One can only imagine how hose of this quality would cope trapped between the bulkhead and the back of the engine where the main rail feed runs, even with proper fuel hose we all know this is where hose failures are very very common indeed due to the very high levels of hose cooking heat in that area.

E85 hose and proper 360 fuel injection clips are the way forward, along with frequent inspections and no complacency!

You were lucky there KateV8, if you'd had spray back over the rather exposed fuel pump contacts you could well have lost the car to a catastrophic fire, worst still.. well lets not go there!

That Northern TVR specialist should be ashamed of themselves.

[KateV8]

Quite agree on all counts Dave and the main lesson learnt is not to sheathe safety critical hose in something that prevents it's regular inspection. Although that area of the car isn't really subject to much heat (the exhaust should be fairly cool by then) the first thought I had when I changed it was the proximity of the spraying fuel to the pump terminals. You can even see a bald spot in the Dinitrol (on the chassis rail) where it has been cleaned off by the spraying unleaded. And directly beneath the tank too, not good.

[ray von]

looks like you made a wise decision there Bob. This has turned into a good thread for anyone considering changing fuel hoses, and I suppose acts as a reminder owners should keep an eye on the condition of their hoses. Although it's a bit disconcerting a garage fitted the pipe to Marks' car

[Richard 858]

Just an observation, heat resistance aside there seems to be alot of concern voiced about the "low" pressure rating of some of the hose being used / advertised. I'm all for a belt and braces approach but whoever is running a standard fuel regulator (2.5 bar) their fuel pressure is only 36.75 psi, even with an uprated reg. at 3 bar this still only amounts to 44.1 psi. On that basis I would not think the failure of these hoses is likely to be pressure related but straight forward perishing accelerated by excess heat, all IMHO of course.

[KateV8]

To reiterate Bobfathers' post above we, owners of KateV8, have never heard of John Zubak let alone bought any of his products. The failed hose came from a specialist who in accordance with our usual policy shall remain nameless.

[KateV8]

To reiterate Bobfathers' post above we, owners of KateV8, have never heard of John Zubak let alone bought any of his products. The failed hose came from a specialist who in accordance with our usual policy shall remain nameless.

[x works]

We just hope you guys have them checked every year at least,.. by you service agent.its on the tvr service scedule
we have tried ... Gates .. multi fuel .. R9 ...R6 ... POSSIBLY ABOUT 6 OR SO SUPPLIERS

so i think evry 2-3 year BIN THEM and fit new . Put a marker date of your own on / if you service your own motor
More effected at the engine end , heat , pressure etc

Think the American spec with the liner inside was the best

Hope someone comes back with a good fuel hose supplier

[frenchie TVR]

Guys,

Do not delay replacing the fuel lines if you believe they might be knackered…

Here is why: a couple of years ago while looking in my engine bay my friend David (a former mechanic and car restorer, who knows the Chimaera so well that it looks like he was part of the design team ;-0 and has a Chimaera too and helps me to do a few bits and pieces on mine outside my yearly service at Str8six) and I decided that my fuel line needed changing at some point… we kept on saying “we need to change the fuel lines at some point…

Well, last year a friend of mine and I were going to go for a drive in the Chimaera, I got the car out of the garage, let the engine running while closing the garage door, Mark and I sat in and locked out seat belts and mark went “what’s those flames” (flames where coming out from the grille between the top of the bonnet and the windscreen, I went “jump out of the car” which he did, I switched of the engine, got hold of the extinguisher (on the rear shelf) and with the bonnet closed sprayed in the vent, opened the bonnet and killed the last little flame, which was extremely lucky as my extinguisher was empty after that….

I guess a mix of luck, having and extinguisher on hand, knowing where to spray (I knew where the fuel pipe was and has read a couple of similar mishaps before) and sheer luck, saves my car.

I was extremely lucky as inside my engine bay nothing was damaged, except the fuel pipes and the grille could do with being taken off and re-sprayed, but it is hardly visible… and the whole car needed a good clean inside the bay and the body works as the extinguisher power went everywhere… Had this happened while driving (and we were literally about to do so…), the fire would have propagated more and by the time I had noticed it would have been too late.

So basically:
- Do not delay changing the fuel lines if you believe yours need changing (cheaper and less messy that having a burnt TVR)
- Carry an extinguisher (or maybe 2: 1 in the cabin and 1 in the boot)
- The really small ones (mines was approximatively 60 x 80 mm in diameter and 200 m long) do not last long
- Always take a Mark with you as he will see the flames before you… ;-)
- Remember TVRs burn really well as they are made of plastic ;-)

Have now new fuel lines in the engine bay and also from the fuel tank to the engine (all replaced by the right stuff by Str8six…).

Good luck and please do not burn your TVRs…

Frenchie

[KateV8]

Thanks to x-works for the contribution and just to clear up any confusion the 'Northern Specialist' that supplied our hose was NOT them! We have had excellent service from Heath and Paul recently and can highly recommend them. The North is a big place, many specialists!

[andy43]

Just to bump this back up, I've now bought some Codan fuel hose, along with some proper stainless 13-15mm fuel hose clamps. Will be fitted by a garage! Simple job but I'm not going to risk it. Plus I'm not double jointed.
Hose bought from ebay (I know, I know...) here - it's R9 spec high pressure injection hose and will operate up to 130 degrees C. and 7 bar.
Codan as far as I can tell is one of the better manufacturers out there.
Seller is sending me a certificate of conformity as the text on the hose as supplied doesn't match the picture - it only states it's class 1A as here which does tie in with SAE J 30 R9 - I'll stick the cert on here when I get it

[andy43]

Update - having had proof of correct material from the seller I had at the same time also emailed Codan for confirmation it's the right stuff - they have confirmed "Codan ref 3133 SAEJ30R9 fuel hose is branded as per your mail in the dimension 7.3mm. Up until now most of this is made for OEM like JLR and the 1A is their spec for the R9 type."