Should i buy a macbook?

[Noger]

LDNrevs said:

Yep, WMM is actually very good for consumer level video editing. As for Cyberface attempting to compare a "£400 Windows shit box" with a Macbook which happens to be double that price.. well.. 'silly little fanboy' springs to mind

Not wishing to speak for cyberface, but the point I think he was trying to make was that a £400 Advent crapmachine from PC World won't come with much in the way of anything useful. And will probably come with a load of stuff pre-installed that you don't want anyway. Whereas an £800 Macbook has a few useful bits and bobs. Absolutely not £400s worth of stuff, but the gap is at least closed somewhat.

Apple kit is no bargain, that is for sure.

But you get what you pay for, and iLife is £50 application. The integration is the thing of course. But if people think they are getting PS CS3, Nuendo and Premiere all rolled into one, then they are probably real fanbois rather than fans.

p.s. I know plenty of people in the "IT industry" who have Apples at home. Seems a sensible choice when less IT literate people are in the house. I do tend to point and laugh at their rather obvious "look at me I am hip" lifestyle choice. And mock when they tell me they can do anything my PC can. But doesn't stop it being a fair choice for most people.

Edited by Noger on Sunday 16th December 17:38

[AndyWoodall]

FunkyNige said:

Buy an Apple if you want to say 'look at my laptop, the apple on the back glows when it's switched on and it's not a Windows PC', the sensible money is on a Windows PC.

Yes, thats exactly why I bought one. Bugger me the cvntyness in this thread is astounding.

[Noger]

AndyWoodall said:

FunkyNige said:

Buy an Apple if you want to say 'look at my laptop, the apple on the back glows when it's switched on and it's not a Windows PC', the sensible money is on a Windows PC.

Yes, thats exactly why I bought one. Bugger me the cvntyness in this thread is astounding.

Although probably lower than the usual oversohelpful "Buy a Mac" threads

[LDNrevs]

FunkyNige said:

Buy an Apple if you want to say 'look at my laptop, the apple on the back glows when it's switched on and it's not a Windows PC', the sensible money is on a Windows PC.

The sensible money is on whatever you need your computer for. If I want to use FinalCut then I buy a Mac. If I want to delve inside the machine or use the vast quantity of both great and shitty freeware / development progs out there then a Windows PC it is.. its just simpleton fanboys who will say otherwise

[cyberface]

Noger said:

LDNrevs said:

Yep, WMM is actually very good for consumer level video editing. As for Cyberface attempting to compare a "£400 Windows shit box" with a Macbook which happens to be double that price.. well.. 'silly little fanboy' springs to mind

Not wishing to speak for cyberface, but the point I think he was trying to make was that a £400 Advent crapmachine from PC World won't come with much in the way of anything useful. And will probably come with a load of stuff pre-installed that you don't want anyway. Whereas an £800 Macbook has a few useful bits and bobs. Absolutely not £400s worth of stuff, but the gap is at least closed somewhat.

Apple kit is no bargain, that is for sure.

Well at least there's someone here with an IQ above room temperature. The whole point (again) that I was making was that even though the hardware inside a £800 Macbook may be the same as a £400 crapmachine (to be honest, I doubt that it will, given that the Macbook has a decent CPU in it) - the integration of the bundled software on the Mac adds value that the £400 PC machine simply won't have.

I'm not talking about the OS here. Getting a Windows laptop with an equal level of usable, full-featured software as a basic Macbook requires, IMO, more than £400. You will have to pay more, and therefore the value argument is diluted somewhat. Apple are more expensive because of branding but don't kid me that you can walk out of PC World having spent £400 and have something that works *just as well* as a Macbook.

The whole question was 'should I buy a Macbook' ??? - the answer is 'yes' if the software package it comes with suits your needs and you can't get equivalent functionality for lower cost without having to piss about. I'm not talking about buying a bare-bones box, compiling your own Linux kernel and installing a load of packages here. If you don't like (or don't need) the stuff that Apple provide then you can get a cheaper laptop quite easily.


And LDNrevs - I've had enough of your personal insults. You pathetic little keyboard warrior - calling *me* a 'simpleton' shows not only how ignorant you are, but also how little you pay attention. Don't insult my intelligence you ing moron. I'm quite happy to disagree about the perceived value-add of OS X's integration in rational terms, but sadly you've resorted to questioning my intelligence, which is a battle you're never going to win. Fool.

[LDNrevs]

cyberface said:

Noger said:

LDNrevs said:

Yep, WMM is actually very good for consumer level video editing. As for Cyberface attempting to compare a "£400 Windows shit box" with a Macbook which happens to be double that price.. well.. 'silly little fanboy' springs to mind

Not wishing to speak for cyberface, but the point I think he was trying to make was that a £400 Advent crapmachine from PC World won't come with much in the way of anything useful. And will probably come with a load of stuff pre-installed that you don't want anyway. Whereas an £800 Macbook has a few useful bits and bobs. Absolutely not £400s worth of stuff, but the gap is at least closed somewhat.

Apple kit is no bargain, that is for sure.

Well at least there's someone here with an IQ above room temperature. The whole point (again) that I was making was that even though the hardware inside a £800 Macbook may be the same as a £400 crapmachine (to be honest, I doubt that it will, given that the Macbook has a decent CPU in it) - the integration of the bundled software on the Mac adds value that the £400 PC machine simply won't have.

I'm not talking about the OS here. Getting a Windows laptop with an equal level of usable, full-featured software as a basic Macbook requires, IMO, more than £400. You will have to pay more, and therefore the value argument is diluted somewhat. Apple are more expensive because of branding but don't kid me that you can walk out of PC World having spent £400 and have something that works *just as well* as a Macbook.

The whole question was 'should I buy a Macbook' ??? - the answer is 'yes' if the software package it comes with suits your needs and you can't get equivalent functionality for lower cost without having to piss about. I'm not talking about buying a bare-bones box, compiling your own Linux kernel and installing a load of packages here. If you don't like (or don't need) the stuff that Apple provide then you can get a cheaper laptop quite easily.


And LDNrevs - I've had enough of your personal insults. You pathetic little keyboard warrior - calling *me* a 'simpleton' shows not only how ignorant you are, but also how little you pay attention. Don't insult my intelligence you ing moron. I'm quite happy to disagree about the perceived value-add of OS X's integration in rational terms, but sadly you've resorted to questioning my intelligence, which is a battle you're never going to win. Fool.

Where specifically did I call you a simpleton? Looks like I already won that battle you ing moron

[Blue Meanie]

It was a battle? Oh dear, how pathetic.

[LDNrevs]

Blue Meanie said:

It was a battle? Oh dear, how pathetic.

Apparently

On that note:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jkrn6ecxthM

[CommanderJameson]

Lookie here, messrs Face and Revs.

You're acting like a pair of geeky tts. Now shake hands and say sorry.

What with TheLearner vomiting up a pile of stale insults elsewhere (and attracting the attention of the big K), and you two waving your e-penises at each other...

Merry ing Christmas.

[RoadRailer]

I thought this was PH not /.

Signal to noise ratio has dropped in here a lot of late.

Must be all those pesky windows users. :|

[thinfourth2]

Should you buy a macbook?

Okay a macbook is £400 more expensive then a bottom of the line laptop but that is like comparing a lada with a Volkswagen. Also the bottom end macs come with a few nice packages on them

I am what i would call an average computer user and i found OS X easy enough to pick up and a damn site easier to use then vista. So if you are an average person that just wants a computer to work then i think a mac is a good choice.

However if you are a computing super genius like our friend revs that knows everything about windows and you are perfectly happy routing around in registries, dealing with irq thingies etc then go for an equivalent windows machine.

If you aren't and you are happy to take the risk then go for the mac if you don't like OS X then stick windoze on it But what ever you do don't go down PC world and buy the cheapest thing you can lay your hands on.

LDNrevs said:

[If I want to delve inside the machine or use the vast quantity of both great and shitty freeware / development progs out there then a Windows PC it is.. its just simpleton fanboys who will say otherwise

Hate to tell you this but underneath the ever so shiny stuff of OS X is a nice little unix operating system which is actually pretty capable of being tinkered with

Also hate to say there is loads and loads of shareware/freeware for macs

And when you roll out the fanboy insult i normally finds it comes from those that know how to keep windoze on its feet and running. I don't have these skills nor do i wish to learn them and i found windoze an utter pile of unreliable poo which would regularly spit the dummy all over the place and need restarting about 3 or 4 times a day. Using macs i don't find this.

However guess you aren't too hot at finding faults in a steam turbine so i can with equal rights call you simpleton.

[Noger]

cyberface said:

Getting a Windows laptop with an equal level of usable, full-featured software as a basic Macbook requires, IMO, more than £400. You will have to pay more, and therefore the value argument is diluted somewhat.

Hmmm, as my math teacher used to scribble in the margin of my formbook "Show your working" I tried to above, and I still maintain that there are FREE Windows applications such as Picasa that are as good as bundled Mac stuff. Perhaps not as integrated, or covering the full spectrum, but there nonetheless.

What am I spending my £400 on ?

[cyberface]

RoadRailer said:

I thought this was PH not /.

Signal to noise ratio has dropped in here a lot of late.

Must be all those pesky windows users. :|

The ironic thing is that my original advice was that the OP should consider other alternatives based on what software he wants to run / needs to purchase - vs. what comes with the bundled package. In other words, a balanced view without rabidly stating 'just get a Mac'.

And if you look back through all the years of posts where I've tried to help people out on this ing forum with Mac problems I've also been clear that the right tool is needed for the job, and OS X is not always the right choice.

But just like ing slashdot we get pricks like LDNrevs jumping down my throat accusing me of being a blinkered fanboy when I actually offered balanced advice.

[LDNrevs]

The irony is I own the most expensive Macbook there is... so no bias here.. I merely pointed out that Cyberface used language such as 'M$' and 'Windows shit box' which makes him a fanboy in my eyes..... and fanboys are by their very nature 'simpletons'. Cyber, just face it...... you're an educated com nerd who slips into fanboyism on the odd occasion. Wish I hadn't hit such a nerve since being called a ing moron and a prick would suggest you're a little upset. Calm down eh!

[Noger]

thinfourth2 said:

Also the bottom end macs come with a few nice packages on them .

Names. Costs. Comparisions. Or you are just guessing (which you are, be honest).

thinfourth2 said:

However if you are a computing super genius like our friend revs that knows everything about windows and you are perfectly happy routing around in registries, dealing with irq thingies etc then go for an equivalent windows machine.
.

Yeah. But all a bit Windows 98 ? Haven't seen an IRQ for a decade. Why would I ?

thinfourth2 said:

Hate to tell you this but underneath the ever so shiny stuff of OS X is a nice little unix operating system which is actually pretty capable of being tinkered with

Perhaps he was talking about hardware ?

thinfourth2 said:

Also hate to say there is loads and loads of shareware/freeware for macs

There will be more for the PC. Simple hardware numbers will tell you that. Not all of it good of course, larger market = more rubbish. But also more good stuff. But anyway, since a Mac comes, as standard, with every piece of software you could ever require ever, why do you need this ? On one hand we are told that the bundled software is immense and fulsome. And then that there is loads of Freeware. Eh ? Why DO you need it if iLife runs your life ?

thinfourth2 said:

And when you roll out the fanboy insult i normally finds it comes from those that know how to keep windoze on its feet and running. I don't have these skills nor do i wish to learn them and i found windoze an utter pile of unreliable poo which would regularly spit the dummy all over the place and need restarting about 3 or 4 times a day. Using macs i don't find this.

Funny. I use a Windows machine 12 hours a day 7 days a week. Haven't seen a BSOD for years. Don't have to restart ever. It works fine. Can't say I love the experience, but it is stable, and has been so for years. XP is very very stable. Vista also, and as it reports every little glitch in a rating system, I can prove it too.

You are simply trotting out hackneyed old cliches. Perhaps you had a bad experience, but the idea that every Window machine crashes every other minute is simply codswallop of the highest wallop.

C'mon. Don't overstretch yourself. As you said, for most people running a Mac is sensible choice. A good one even. So why do you have to go to SUCH lengths to prove your choice to yourself ? Is spending £800 on a nerdy computer (which won't attract the opposite sex or immediately get you a pay rise) really that big a thing to you ?

I do so "get" the evangelism thing. My laptop fits in my jacket pocket, I can operate it with my finger, and does a lot of rather neat things. But it isn't as much fun as a car ! Despite that I tend to be enthusiastic about the hardware I like, but withing reason.

One assumes people would be at each others throats about Imprezzas vs Evos, or BMW vs Audi or somesuch. But how does "how fast does teh internet work" get sooo much angst generated ?

EFGA

Edited by Noger on Sunday 16th December 20:33

[Leithen]

Yes you should.

[thinfourth2]

Noger said:

thinfourth2 said:

And when you roll out the fanboy insult i normally finds it comes from those that know how to keep windoze on its feet and running. I don't have these skills nor do i wish to learn them and i found windoze an utter pile of unreliable poo which would regularly spit the dummy all over the place and need restarting about 3 or 4 times a day. Using macs i don't find this.

Funny. I use a Windows machine 12 hours a day 7 days a week. Haven't seen a BSOD for years. Don't have to restart ever. It works fine. Can't say I love the experience, but it is stable, and has been so for years. XP is very very stable. Vista also, and as it reports every little glitch in a rating system, I can prove it too.

You are simply trotting out hackneyed old cliches. Perhaps you had a bad experience, but the idea that every Window machine crashes every other minute is simply codswallop of the highest wallop.

I use a few windows machine at work also.

The ones that have had lots stripped out of them and have lots of work to make them stable and have no way of accessing CDs or flash drives run like a dream and i should hope so as they are the ones that keep the lights on

The ones that sit in the office and any bugger can use them and get no maintenance throw more tantrums then a 5year old in a toy shop

I in my own experience have found windows machines that aren't maintained and have been used by numptys like me are about as stable a jelly bridge. I never maintain my mac apart from deleting crap when the hard disc gets full runs fine.

[JustinP1]

Burgmeister said:

I need a new laptop and i fancy buying a macbook purely because they look cool. The thing that puzzles me though is the price. Why are they so damn expensive? are they really worth £800? they seem to lag behind any windows running laptop in performance specs.

Now i have never used a mac and so nothing of how they work. are they hard to learn? im not buying a book, i will self teach but will it be annoying?

or should i buy another laptop running windows for the same money?

its a minefield

To circumnavigate some of the arguing about particular points, Ill get back to the OP's question.

My personal experience is that I used Macs for audio work for about 7 years. I spent 5 years of that just using them for a single software package and never really tried 'using' them.

Then, about two years ago my HP laptop which I used for literally everything else - Internet, email, Word, Excel etc went down and was going to take weeks to repair.

At that time I was forced to use my Apple laptop for all of these things. Fast forward a few weeks later, by the time my laptop was replaced it was already on ebay and a Macbook Pro was on order, and due to arrive.

All I will say is that the only thing which is not just more enjoyable and easier to use - including the operating system itself are Windows games. However, the only difference is that I spend 30 seconds extra rebooting to Windows with Boot Camp and it works as a PC.

If you can, just try it. I am pretty sure a few weeks later you will know you will have made the right decision. Yes, they are more expensive, but 'out of the box' they do a hell of a lot more. I do audio, video work and run my whole business from the same laptop and the only software I have paid for is Mac Office - basically MS Office for the mac for £100 and Logic Audio - however for most semi-pro audio users the bundled Garageband is great.

What has not been said before which negates some of the extra start price is the second hand value. A Mac laptop that I got as an end of line bargain for £500 a few years ago, 4 years later of it working perfectly I still got almost £300 for...

[LDNrevs]

JustinP1 said:

Burgmeister said:

I need a new laptop and i fancy buying a macbook purely because they look cool. The thing that puzzles me though is the price. Why are they so damn expensive? are they really worth £800? they seem to lag behind any windows running laptop in performance specs.

Now i have never used a mac and so nothing of how they work. are they hard to learn? im not buying a book, i will self teach but will it be annoying?

or should i buy another laptop running windows for the same money?

its a minefield

To circumnavigate some of the arguing about particular points, Ill get back to the OP's question.

My personal experience is that I used Macs for audio work for about 7 years. I spent 5 years of that just using them for a single software package and never really tried 'using' them.

Then, about two years ago my HP laptop which I used for literally everything else - Internet, email, Word, Excel etc went down and was going to take weeks to repair.

At that time I was forced to use my Apple laptop for all of these things. Fast forward a few weeks later, by the time my laptop was replaced it was already on ebay and a Macbook Pro was on order, and due to arrive.

All I will say is that the only thing which is not just more enjoyable and easier to use - including the operating system itself are Windows games. However, the only difference is that I spend 30 seconds extra rebooting to Windows with Boot Camp and it works as a PC.

If you can, just try it. I am pretty sure a few weeks later you will know you will have made the right decision. Yes, they are more expensive, but 'out of the box' they do a hell of a lot more. I do audio, video work and run my whole business from the same laptop and the only software I have paid for is Mac Office - basically MS Office for the mac for £100 and Logic Audio - however for most semi-pro audio users the bundled Garageband is great.

All fair points but.. semi pro auio users on Garageband; you are taking the pish aren't you!? Garageband is for hobbyists at best..

[page3]

Noger said:

What am I spending my £400 on ?

Thoughtful design. The fact a bunch of people have actually thought about their users rather than just slinging a load of hardware components together. There are Windows boxes properly designed too, and they'll cost the same as a Mac.