Question for the true expert: 560sec
Discussion
My quest to find the best possible 560 sec continues.
So far it took me twice to Germany and to a few places in the uk..
I am clear in my head that it will be a lhd.
I figured that there are some great cars in america but it seems that they are just 238bhp over there.
European versions were either 279bhp with catalytic converters or 300bhp without.
The ideal version would obviously be the latter.
I think i would be happy with the 279bhp too and found two great cars of these so far.
My question is the following: if you have the american 238bhp or cat 279bhp, what changes do you need to make to those to get the full house 300bhp??
I can only assume that very few people will have the response to this question.... I live in hope!
So far it took me twice to Germany and to a few places in the uk..
I am clear in my head that it will be a lhd.
I figured that there are some great cars in america but it seems that they are just 238bhp over there.
European versions were either 279bhp with catalytic converters or 300bhp without.
The ideal version would obviously be the latter.
I think i would be happy with the 279bhp too and found two great cars of these so far.
My question is the following: if you have the american 238bhp or cat 279bhp, what changes do you need to make to those to get the full house 300bhp??
I can only assume that very few people will have the response to this question.... I live in hope!
Edited by erics on Sunday 23 November 01:01
I can't help with the specific question, but here's a super low mileage UK RHD example, albeit pricey:
http://www.hexagonmodernclassics.com/car_sales/Mer...
Darren
http://www.hexagonmodernclassics.com/car_sales/Mer...
Darren
A lot of it is the exhaust. European cars have what is called a "tri-Y" manifold whereas US cars have what is called a "log" manifold. Euro cats are not the same as US cats, either. I suspect there are different cams in US cars and it maybe that the fuel computer is different, too.
The short answer is, "not a lot, but enough to be a real pain to do a conversion". I haven't come across anyone converting a US motor to Euro spec: the common route is to swap one for the other.
The full fat 300bhp version is essentially a Euro-tune without a catalyst.
The short answer is, "not a lot, but enough to be a real pain to do a conversion". I haven't come across anyone converting a US motor to Euro spec: the common route is to swap one for the other.
The full fat 300bhp version is essentially a Euro-tune without a catalyst.
Excellent guys!
Yes i did read somewhere that us cars had a lower compression ratio. Did not realise they had different pistons, cams etc.
So to cut a long story short: if i buy that euro-catted car i found (279 bhp) and i simply remove the center section of the exhaust, i will get the full 300bhp? When i looked underneath the car, it looked like there was a lambda sensor in there. Probably means dashboard light on?
Yes i did read somewhere that us cars had a lower compression ratio. Did not realise they had different pistons, cams etc.
So to cut a long story short: if i buy that euro-catted car i found (279 bhp) and i simply remove the center section of the exhaust, i will get the full 300bhp? When i looked underneath the car, it looked like there was a lambda sensor in there. Probably means dashboard light on?
Exactly. You could have KAT, RÜF or ECE. RÜF stands for Rückrüstfahrzeug or Retrospective Fit Car.
This very long Benzworld thread explains (in usual forum confusion manner) the differences. Essentially, before September 1987, only ECE cars have 10.0:1 compression ratio and 300bhp; whereas post-September 1987, all European cars have 10.0:1 compression ratio , KAT cars have 279bhp and RÜF cars have 300bhp. The difference between KAT and RÜF is the catalysor and no more.
http://www.benzworld.org/forums/w126-s-se-sec-sel-...
This very long Benzworld thread explains (in usual forum confusion manner) the differences. Essentially, before September 1987, only ECE cars have 10.0:1 compression ratio and 300bhp; whereas post-September 1987, all European cars have 10.0:1 compression ratio , KAT cars have 279bhp and RÜF cars have 300bhp. The difference between KAT and RÜF is the catalysor and no more.
http://www.benzworld.org/forums/w126-s-se-sec-sel-...
I'd expect it to be RÜF. I'm at work and away from my library, but my recollection is that only West German cars were KAT as standard until well after 1990. Certainly, UK cars were not equipped with a catalyser until about late-1992 and I think the same was true for most all export markets except the US.
Whilst I understand your desire for maximum performance I can't imagine there will be a huge difference between a 280 and 300 BHP car - having driven an example of the former I remember being very impressed with the mid-range shove and overall refinement. It didn't have anywhere near brutality of my current car, a c55 AMG, but it was a very class act - whatever version you choose I can't imagine you'll be disappointed - happy hunting
I know where the perfect 560 is for sale over here, 2 owner, low mile and over maintained by the best German ex merc factory mechanic in the country. Unfortunately their asking £18k, which is hasn't and won't make. I'm waiting another few weeks then going in with a low cash offer and try pick it up.
irish boy said:
I know where the perfect 560 is for sale over here, 2 owner, low mile and over maintained by the best German ex merc factory mechanic in the country. Unfortunately their asking £18k, which is hasn't and won't make. I'm waiting another few weeks then going in with a low cash offer and try pick it up.
Better you don't tell me where then.. Eric,
A friend of mine visited http://www.sturm-automobile.de in Dusseldorf today. He spent three hours viewing the stock and talking with the proprietor. He said he has never seen anything like it nor met anyone so fastidious about his Mercedes. He said the place is very inauspicious but once inside it makes Ironside's look like a scrapyard. He has a very late model SEC with 20,000km on it. He doesn't want to sell it. But everyone has a price. If he won't sell that one, he might be able to find you a good one. Speaks perfect English.
Anyway, good luck with the search.
JR
A friend of mine visited http://www.sturm-automobile.de in Dusseldorf today. He spent three hours viewing the stock and talking with the proprietor. He said he has never seen anything like it nor met anyone so fastidious about his Mercedes. He said the place is very inauspicious but once inside it makes Ironside's look like a scrapyard. He has a very late model SEC with 20,000km on it. He doesn't want to sell it. But everyone has a price. If he won't sell that one, he might be able to find you a good one. Speaks perfect English.
Anyway, good luck with the search.
JR
drmark said:
Thaïs looks a cracker
http://www.avantgardecars.co.uk/viewcar/MERCEDES%2...
Please don't post links like that.......it's absolutely gorgeous, that colour combo, beautiful!http://www.avantgardecars.co.uk/viewcar/MERCEDES%2...
r129sl said:
Eric,
A friend of mine visited http://www.sturm-automobile.de in Dusseldorf today. He spent three hours viewing the stock and talking with the proprietor. He said he has never seen anything like it nor met anyone so fastidious about his Mercedes. He said the place is very inauspicious but once inside it makes Ironside's look like a scrapyard. He has a very late model SEC with 20,000km on it. He doesn't want to sell it. But everyone has a price. If he won't sell that one, he might be able to find you a good one. Speaks perfect English.
Anyway, good luck with the search.
JR
Good call, will call him. Tyvm.A friend of mine visited http://www.sturm-automobile.de in Dusseldorf today. He spent three hours viewing the stock and talking with the proprietor. He said he has never seen anything like it nor met anyone so fastidious about his Mercedes. He said the place is very inauspicious but once inside it makes Ironside's look like a scrapyard. He has a very late model SEC with 20,000km on it. He doesn't want to sell it. But everyone has a price. If he won't sell that one, he might be able to find you a good one. Speaks perfect English.
Anyway, good luck with the search.
JR
drmark said:
Thaïs looks a cracker
http://www.avantgardecars.co.uk/viewcar/MERCEDES%2...
Nice car, but only a 500 and really don't like surf blue.http://www.avantgardecars.co.uk/viewcar/MERCEDES%2...
The whole idea of getting a sec is to get the big engine and power. Otherwise not much point in my mind.
Gassing Station | Mercedes | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff