Discussion
Feel a bit pathetic posting this but I'm on an undeniable slide and I need to reverse it.
First of all I'm hardworking, brought up that way, when we bought our house 10 years ago I did 12x7 to get it ready. At work I go the extra mile to pre empt problems, get annoyed at those who do the minimum, I'll spend longer on a first fit to make the second fit easier/smoother. I've lost count of the number of people who, after a big refurb, have taken the time to thank me and point out they noticed how my work went seamlessly wheras others' frequently didn't. If I told you I'd be there at 8am it was so, if a problem presents itself I'm already trying to fix it when others are all preoccupied losing their heads. So I'm not the d
head tradesman people often vocalize about. I'm not some ineffectual melt who needs mummy to kiss it better.
But for the last couple or so of years I've been declining.. Much of It silly things - admins never been a strong point but I've been ignoring calls, not replying to messages or emails for yonks or even at all, failing to even order materials in time. Little things that all seem foreboding. Punctuality sliding. Self sabotaging - Its like I'm becoming the idiot tradesman profile.
On weekends I can waste days pissing on sites like this when there's quotes and invoices to sort... I'm not even enjoying it that much, I'd get more satisfaction reading one of a pile of books I have but don't, I just kind of stagnate... And then I'm annoyed at myself.
Its not just work stuff there's a million jobs from silly such as hanging pictures to large that just sit there ominously.
I've tried talking to a shrink (inclined to depression), meditating (can't), sheduling (ignored) setting an alarm as a get-up (get up and still procrastinate)or a start point (ignored, 10 more minutes etc)
On some days I can just make a start and get a load done. But they seem less and less frequent. I'm sure its just a focus your head thing but it feels like some kind of cognitive decline.
What's wrong with me and how do I reverse it? This goes back way before 2020 BTW although I don't think that's helped. Thanks for reading.
Eta 43 M and reasonably fit and healthy.
First of all I'm hardworking, brought up that way, when we bought our house 10 years ago I did 12x7 to get it ready. At work I go the extra mile to pre empt problems, get annoyed at those who do the minimum, I'll spend longer on a first fit to make the second fit easier/smoother. I've lost count of the number of people who, after a big refurb, have taken the time to thank me and point out they noticed how my work went seamlessly wheras others' frequently didn't. If I told you I'd be there at 8am it was so, if a problem presents itself I'm already trying to fix it when others are all preoccupied losing their heads. So I'm not the d
head tradesman people often vocalize about. I'm not some ineffectual melt who needs mummy to kiss it better.But for the last couple or so of years I've been declining.. Much of It silly things - admins never been a strong point but I've been ignoring calls, not replying to messages or emails for yonks or even at all, failing to even order materials in time. Little things that all seem foreboding. Punctuality sliding. Self sabotaging - Its like I'm becoming the idiot tradesman profile.
On weekends I can waste days pissing on sites like this when there's quotes and invoices to sort... I'm not even enjoying it that much, I'd get more satisfaction reading one of a pile of books I have but don't, I just kind of stagnate... And then I'm annoyed at myself.
Its not just work stuff there's a million jobs from silly such as hanging pictures to large that just sit there ominously.
I've tried talking to a shrink (inclined to depression), meditating (can't), sheduling (ignored) setting an alarm as a get-up (get up and still procrastinate)or a start point (ignored, 10 more minutes etc)
On some days I can just make a start and get a load done. But they seem less and less frequent. I'm sure its just a focus your head thing but it feels like some kind of cognitive decline.
What's wrong with me and how do I reverse it? This goes back way before 2020 BTW although I don't think that's helped. Thanks for reading.
Eta 43 M and reasonably fit and healthy.
Thank you for sharing.
The first thing to point out is... you've noticed a decline in 'positive' behaviours and have begun the first steps to rectify it. That's the hardest and biggest step.
We can't diagnose exactly what is happening with you, but it is a fairly common thing to happen. Sadly, there are numerous things that a) could be causing this and b) things you can change in your routine to make things better.
It sounds like you may be feeling lost / lacking purpose. It is a very common thing to happen and there's a load of self help available online as it's something that affects a lot of people.
My immediate thought was depression as well - you are describing several behaviours that sound similar to someone currently depressed - I see you have sought / are seeking counselling in hope to rectify this.
As for some self help tactics to make things better for yourself....
I would start small and build upon whatever you have already achieved. Sounds like you are capable of earning a living and providing the essentials you need to survive.
Instead of trying to change everything, all at once, pick something relatively small, like answering every email every day and see how you get on.
I would also substitute time on websites like this with reading. The subject matter is not really important, but it's a very therapeutic and positive behaviour and usually, I find helps calm the mind.
The first thing to point out is... you've noticed a decline in 'positive' behaviours and have begun the first steps to rectify it. That's the hardest and biggest step.
We can't diagnose exactly what is happening with you, but it is a fairly common thing to happen. Sadly, there are numerous things that a) could be causing this and b) things you can change in your routine to make things better.
It sounds like you may be feeling lost / lacking purpose. It is a very common thing to happen and there's a load of self help available online as it's something that affects a lot of people.
My immediate thought was depression as well - you are describing several behaviours that sound similar to someone currently depressed - I see you have sought / are seeking counselling in hope to rectify this.
As for some self help tactics to make things better for yourself....
I would start small and build upon whatever you have already achieved. Sounds like you are capable of earning a living and providing the essentials you need to survive.
Instead of trying to change everything, all at once, pick something relatively small, like answering every email every day and see how you get on.
I would also substitute time on websites like this with reading. The subject matter is not really important, but it's a very therapeutic and positive behaviour and usually, I find helps calm the mind.
Thanks for replying.
I've seen several different therapists over the years - generally weve made progress then it just kind of stagnates. I realise there's classic mental health symptoms in the above post and I realise its is a head problem, but to be honest I don't actually feel that far down right now, certainly been worse, if anything this issue is what's making me feel worse although I guess they feed each other.
I've seen several different therapists over the years - generally weve made progress then it just kind of stagnates. I realise there's classic mental health symptoms in the above post and I realise its is a head problem, but to be honest I don't actually feel that far down right now, certainly been worse, if anything this issue is what's making me feel worse although I guess they feed each other.
I've nothing to offer, but I feel much the same as the OP. I've worked my arse off for the last 30 years, I've done a lot of things I'm proud of, and I've always enjoyed interaction with customers. Lately, I just can't be bothered. I don't reply to customer emails, I procrastinate, I avoid answering the phone. Even customers I know and like working for, I reluctantly respond to and even then I'm unenthusiastic about the work they want me to do. I think I'd rather give up work than see my reputation deteriorate, but I'm at least 10 years from being financially able to even consider that.
Covid hasn't affected business to a significant degree. It's fked the rest of my life to the extent that I go to work, come home, go to work, come home and that's it. I miss my friends, I miss going to watch rugby, I miss going away for weekends. I love my wife with all my heart, but we're spending far more time together than ever before, and I'm so fking low all the time, it's no fun for her either.
As I said, I've nothing to offer, but you're not alone, OP.
Covid hasn't affected business to a significant degree. It's f
ked the rest of my life to the extent that I go to work, come home, go to work, come home and that's it. I miss my friends, I miss going to watch rugby, I miss going away for weekends. I love my wife with all my heart, but we're spending far more time together than ever before, and I'm so fking low all the time, it's no fun for her either.As I said, I've nothing to offer, but you're not alone, OP.
Alrey87 said:
At your age there’s a VERY high chance of this being low testosterone. Get a testosterone and esteogen blood test from medichecks and report back your results if you are dedicated to fixing this. The NHS won’t even suggest it as an option.
Thanks for this. I was not aware you could get this online. Can relate to the original post and a similar age so have ordered the test to see if anything comes back.Lifeisalemon said:
Alrey87 said:
At your age there’s a VERY high chance of this being low testosterone. Get a testosterone and esteogen blood test from medichecks and report back your results if you are dedicated to fixing this. The NHS won’t even suggest it as an option.
Thanks for this. I was not aware you could get this online. Can relate to the original post and a similar age so have ordered the test to see if anything comes back.Was 'diagnosed' with Chronic Fatigue Syndrome a few years back - very mild in my case seeing what other sufferers seem to go through - but despite it being real it does still seem to be a bucket that once everything else is discounted you are put into
As another poster said, recognising it is a big step - no idea what advice I can give apart from being a sounding board as I'm trying to get myself out of it too.
In the meantime the testosterone test seems like an avenue I might pursue....
CFS is the usual mis-diagnosis given to low T patients. It took me years to figure this out not being in an ‘at risk’ age group. Common signs:
Fatigue
Too tired to do anything after work
Low libido
Depression
Loss of interest in hobbies / life
Lack of drive / determination
Brain fog (feels like cloudy thinking, fuzzy head)
Frequent urination
Upper back / trapezius pain
Worth getting the test if a lot of this sounds familiar. No point asking for the medichecks doctors comment with your results - they will just say you are in or outside of the normal range which tells you nothing. Feel free to PM me for an informed opinion on results.
Fatigue
Too tired to do anything after work
Low libido
Depression
Loss of interest in hobbies / life
Lack of drive / determination
Brain fog (feels like cloudy thinking, fuzzy head)
Frequent urination
Upper back / trapezius pain
Worth getting the test if a lot of this sounds familiar. No point asking for the medichecks doctors comment with your results - they will just say you are in or outside of the normal range which tells you nothing. Feel free to PM me for an informed opinion on results.
Well I can relate to this. I am fit healthy at 37 in good shape. I've had fatigue for a long time but its been worse the last 2 years and is substantially affecting my life. About 3 months ago I decided I had to work it out.
I had food allergy tests, and a series of blood tests to check thyroid, testosterone, vitamins etc. My testosterone is high but so is my shbg, my vitamin b was low too. I've made some changes but these didn't point to anything substantial enough.
I decided to get a new garmin watch (I do triathlon) to better track my sleep and I have discovered that my blood oxygen saturation is dropping way down during the night. I've been filming my sleep and can't see anything particularly obvious so I think I have some kind of sleep apnea which I am working through at present. This explains an awful lot for me and totally makes sense with much I observe of myself.
I am more anxious and depressive orientated than average and have worked hard on that in the last 15 years on that but perhaps the sleep is the root of it all.
I hope that gives you some food for thought, good luck. Happy to answer any questions if it helps.
Adding i agree with the above. Taking matters into your own hands will move this along, the doctors don't want to know (normal times let alone now)
I had food allergy tests, and a series of blood tests to check thyroid, testosterone, vitamins etc. My testosterone is high but so is my shbg, my vitamin b was low too. I've made some changes but these didn't point to anything substantial enough.
I decided to get a new garmin watch (I do triathlon) to better track my sleep and I have discovered that my blood oxygen saturation is dropping way down during the night. I've been filming my sleep and can't see anything particularly obvious so I think I have some kind of sleep apnea which I am working through at present. This explains an awful lot for me and totally makes sense with much I observe of myself.
I am more anxious and depressive orientated than average and have worked hard on that in the last 15 years on that but perhaps the sleep is the root of it all.
I hope that gives you some food for thought, good luck. Happy to answer any questions if it helps.
Adding i agree with the above. Taking matters into your own hands will move this along, the doctors don't want to know (normal times let alone now)
Edited by White-Noise on Monday 4th January 19:14
A blood test may be worth pursuing. I was suffering terrible lethargy, despite being fit and healthy. I MTB, run, play football, P90x and that kinda of thing, then suddenly found myself ran down, listless and just couldn't be bothered.
Blood tests showed my B12 levels had dropped through the floor. Had a course of jabs and I have abooster every 3 month now, and I can feel it when i'm due.
Blood tests showed my B12 levels had dropped through the floor. Had a course of jabs and I have abooster every 3 month now, and I can feel it when i'm due.
Thanks for all replies. I may well try that - I had a blood test some time which the mrs informs me that testosterone was "on the low side but no concern", which could just be the nhs (clapclapclap) way of saying "you won't die from it today so jog on"
What exactly should I ask for and what should I do with it?
Been a low couple of days - yesterday couldn't even summon the go to get out the van for 20 mins to start job. But did. Got home early and did some sums for some quotes and felt a little positive, like I'd troughed, didn't have anything sheduled for today so rather than go to work decided to consign today as a paperwork catch up. Set alarm for 8, got up, did nothing but piss around till 2, went up to the office, got as far as entering an email address, then pissed around for 2 more hours, then eventually struggled out maybe an hours actual work/send on some quotes.
Dunno what the matter is. I've got about 2 weeks worth of work in the book, a hole in my potential diary as a builder I'm in deep with isn't looking great, I've got several quotes I've already been chased on I only need to spend an hour sorting, couple of good clients plus a potentially very good new one, and I'm dicking them around. I just can't sit down, focus and do a simple stupid little task.
Makes no sense whatsoever. I think its at least partly common garden variety depression that just hasn't hit me with the despondency it has in the past, the sheer amount of finger wagging going on right now just grinding you down.
But anyway, glad my thread seems to be of some use.
What exactly should I ask for and what should I do with it?
Been a low couple of days - yesterday couldn't even summon the go to get out the van for 20 mins to start job. But did. Got home early and did some sums for some quotes and felt a little positive, like I'd troughed, didn't have anything sheduled for today so rather than go to work decided to consign today as a paperwork catch up. Set alarm for 8, got up, did nothing but piss around till 2, went up to the office, got as far as entering an email address, then pissed around for 2 more hours, then eventually struggled out maybe an hours actual work/send on some quotes.
Dunno what the matter is. I've got about 2 weeks worth of work in the book, a hole in my potential diary as a builder I'm in deep with isn't looking great, I've got several quotes I've already been chased on I only need to spend an hour sorting, couple of good clients plus a potentially very good new one, and I'm dicking them around. I just can't sit down, focus and do a simple stupid little task.
Makes no sense whatsoever. I think its at least partly common garden variety depression that just hasn't hit me with the despondency it has in the past, the sheer amount of finger wagging going on right now just grinding you down.
But anyway, glad my thread seems to be of some use.
Sounds like you have finally reached your mid life crisis.
I had similar and walked away from a very well paid job with a high degree of responsibility and started a completely new career of self employment.
Oh and I bought myself a TVR V8S followed by a Griffith 500
.
Never looked back.
Sometimes all you need to reinvigorate yourself is a lifestyle change.
I had similar and walked away from a very well paid job with a high degree of responsibility and started a completely new career of self employment.
Oh and I bought myself a TVR V8S followed by a Griffith 500
.Never looked back.
Sometimes all you need to reinvigorate yourself is a lifestyle change.
Having now been educated looking at low Testosterone 'symptoms' you may be on to something. Trouble is if it is low how do you increase it to eradicate symptoms?
You can get a test through the post but anything further suggests expert medical advice/guidance. Supplements are on the sports banned list.
You can get a test through the post but anything further suggests expert medical advice/guidance. Supplements are on the sports banned list.
Armitage.Shanks said:
Having now been educated looking at low Testosterone 'symptoms' you may be on to something. Trouble is if it is low how do you increase it to eradicate symptoms?
You can get a test through the post but anything further suggests expert medical advice/guidance. Supplements are on the sports banned list.
Generally assuming you aren’t too overweight and you exercise and eat semi healthily, then the only way to increase it is through testosterone replacement therapy (trt) this needs to be done via a private clinic as the nhs are worse than clueless. The Americans are about 30 years ahead of us in this field but we do have a couple of world class clinics in the uk. This doesn’t mean taking large doses to get jacked, it means injecting the amount required to normalise your levels. It will change your life if it’s something you require. You can get a test through the post but anything further suggests expert medical advice/guidance. Supplements are on the sports banned list.
The normal range runs from something like 9-29 nmol/l the bottom half of that will probably mean you have the levels of an 80yr old but the nhs think that’s ok if you’re 30 as it’s in range.
I will include some links, this doctor is probably the best in the world and Uk based. Nothing I’m affiliated with but I have a personal history of about 7-8 years research into the field and can absolutely vouch for the legitimacy of this clinic above all others. This doctor will personally call you if you email him your blood test results and advise you on the best way to proceed.
https://themenshealthclinic.co.uk/testosterone-ref...
https://themenshealthclinic.co.uk/microdosing-trt-...
https://themenshealthclinic.co.uk/ive-stopped-my-a...
Alrey87 said:
At your age there’s a VERY high chance of this being low testosterone. Get a testosterone and esteogen blood test from medichecks and report back your results if you are dedicated to fixing this. The NHS won’t even suggest it as an option.
Testosterone came back 20.5. Several other potentials (thyroid, lft, vits B, D) all ok (take D supps anyway after low score years ago)only alert proper was elevated serum ferritin with advice to go dry+retest but TBF have been caning the booze recently, have taken steps to reduce considerably.
But may have made a mini breakthrough of sorts, Shrink recons I have low blood CO2 levels (after testing by asking me to fully breath out and hold breath - healthy adult should manage 45+ secs, I'm gasping after 20) which in crude terms means I'm permanently in a low level form of hyperventilating. It actually makes perfect sense - I have a resting heartrate of high 70's (healthy & not o/w fairly fit 42) and really struggle to relax and switch off. very easily distracted, fairly certain I have AD. Have tried meditation/ guided med and just found it near impossible. Shrink say alcohol abuse makes sense as I'm sedating myself and thats the only escape I get, my relationship with alcohol is often not pssed enough/not pssed enough/not pssed enough/not pssed enough/spannered, just like that it switches. Actually a lot of drugs and things have a binary nothing/All effect on me, shrink said to try nootropics alpha-brain and in particular brain-zyme as these have had positive effects in some people particularly those with AD, max dose, zilch, absolutely no discernible effect at all, also why I'm not keen on pills, which have also produced the same experience.
Maybe this is something which fancy pills ("Brainzyme") cannot "fix". It could be a complicated mix of life circumstances, mental and physical health matters, aging etc.
You have done the right thing and asked for help, seen therapists etc. That is a good way, you will need a lot of time and willpower.
Good luck!
You have done the right thing and asked for help, seen therapists etc. That is a good way, you will need a lot of time and willpower.
Good luck!
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