Selling house - FENSA cert?
Discussion
We're putting our house on the market soon.
About 5 years ago we had our porch converted from old single pane windows and glass front door to double glazed units and UPVC door. Mrs She Said convinced me to get her friends husband to do the work who is a general builder / handyman. He did an ok job, the windows and doors all fitted well and dont leak.
He didnt supply a FENSA cert as he isnt registered. I imagine this is about to come back and bite me in the arse. My understanding is I can get the local council building control to come out and inspect. How much of a ballache is it. Is he going to tell me to rip it all out and get it done again with a FENSA certificate?
As it's a porch would it be exempt? (there is no internal door between porch and house).
About 5 years ago we had our porch converted from old single pane windows and glass front door to double glazed units and UPVC door. Mrs She Said convinced me to get her friends husband to do the work who is a general builder / handyman. He did an ok job, the windows and doors all fitted well and dont leak.
He didnt supply a FENSA cert as he isnt registered. I imagine this is about to come back and bite me in the arse. My understanding is I can get the local council building control to come out and inspect. How much of a ballache is it. Is he going to tell me to rip it all out and get it done again with a FENSA certificate?
As it's a porch would it be exempt? (there is no internal door between porch and house).
interstellar said:
I would imagine the cheaper option will be if it comes up for your solicitor to get indemnity insurance but I would wait and see if it comes up first.
This. Just going through selling a property and the FENSA issue came up on some windows I had fitted.Solution: Indemnity policy at £45
Thats What She Said said:
He didnt supply a FENSA cert as he isnt registered. I imagine this is about to come back and bite me in the arse. My understanding is I can get the local council building control to come out and inspect. How much of a ballache is it. Is he going to tell me to rip it all out and get it done again with a FENSA certificate?
It shouldn’t be assuming the work was done right at the time.The windows will be checked against the regulations that were in force at the time the works were carried out.
If everything checks out such as u-values, safety glass and background ventilation then it’ll be no more than a 15minute inspection.
Thats What She Said said:
As it's a porch would it be exempt? (there is no internal door between porch and house).
If there’s not an exterior door between the porch and the house then it won’t be exempt.Thats What She Said said:
We're putting our house on the market soon.
About 5 years ago we had our porch converted from old single pane windows and glass front door to double glazed units and UPVC door. Mrs She Said convinced me to get her friends husband to do the work who is a general builder / handyman. He did an ok job, the windows and doors all fitted well and dont leak.
He didnt supply a FENSA cert as he isnt registered. I imagine this is about to come back and bite me in the arse. My understanding is I can get the local council building control to come out and inspect. How much of a ballache is it. Is he going to tell me to rip it all out and get it done again with a FENSA certificate?
As it's a porch would it be exempt? (there is no internal door between porch and house).
You could do a "Post Office". Claim it's legit, deny all knowledge, you "don't remember" and, only if pressed, offer an indemnity policy (you probably won't be).About 5 years ago we had our porch converted from old single pane windows and glass front door to double glazed units and UPVC door. Mrs She Said convinced me to get her friends husband to do the work who is a general builder / handyman. He did an ok job, the windows and doors all fitted well and dont leak.
He didnt supply a FENSA cert as he isnt registered. I imagine this is about to come back and bite me in the arse. My understanding is I can get the local council building control to come out and inspect. How much of a ballache is it. Is he going to tell me to rip it all out and get it done again with a FENSA certificate?
As it's a porch would it be exempt? (there is no internal door between porch and house).
My son bought his first house last year.
Thet had indemnification for windows, a door, a conservatory and a fireplace. Owners basically said they had nothing.
He used a very good solicitor who helped him get the indemnity off the seller, a reduced purchase price , and then explained to him Fensa was and still is an unenforceable requirement.
This is because it is purely a set of regulations that applies at the time of fitting. So if you fit a window, with the current glass applicable at that time , for thermal efficiency, as an example, you don't require a certificate. You do have to fit the right glass, or perhaps have trickle vents if it was today, but you don't need a certificate, you just need to comply with the regulations at that point in time .
There is a whole set of requirements, glass type being just an example.
Thet had indemnification for windows, a door, a conservatory and a fireplace. Owners basically said they had nothing.
He used a very good solicitor who helped him get the indemnity off the seller, a reduced purchase price , and then explained to him Fensa was and still is an unenforceable requirement.
This is because it is purely a set of regulations that applies at the time of fitting. So if you fit a window, with the current glass applicable at that time , for thermal efficiency, as an example, you don't require a certificate. You do have to fit the right glass, or perhaps have trickle vents if it was today, but you don't need a certificate, you just need to comply with the regulations at that point in time .
There is a whole set of requirements, glass type being just an example.
Edited by cliffords on Friday 1st March 08:46
When I sold my last house in 2007 id; recently had lots of windows replaced by a mate who fits windows as a side job. On my sellers pack that I had to fill in it asked me about any FENSA certificates, I just stated I hadn't got any. Told each viewer that I didn't have any certificates and if they were important to them then please don't buy this house as there aren't any. Wasn't a problem for any of them.
princeperch said:
I've never been asked for them in the past 2 properties I've sold and it wasn't an issue with either.
This. The OP is worrying over nothing. The last house I sold had zero certificates for anything, and neither did my parents house when they sold theirs a few years ago.
The buyers (on both the houses) started asking for proof and certificates of all sorts of things. Gas Safe certificate, when was the boiler last serviced, what rating were the windows, when were the electrics last tested, does it need rewired.... and on it went. We politely but firmly told them to either buy the house as it stood, or go and buy something else. They stopped asking questions and bought the house.
Mont Blanc said:
This. The OP is worrying over nothing.
The last house I sold had zero certificates for anything, and neither did my parents house when they sold theirs a few years ago.
The buyers (on both the houses) started asking for proof and certificates of all sorts of things. Gas Safe certificate, when was the boiler last serviced, what rating were the windows, when were the electrics last tested, does it need rewired.... and on it went. We politely but firmly told them to either buy the house as it stood, or go and buy something else. They stopped asking questions and bought the house.
Exactly, my buyers of my previous house asked for everything. I had most of it but not all the cert for one of the new windows. Basically said you can survey it again but if you don't like it buy something else. The last house I sold had zero certificates for anything, and neither did my parents house when they sold theirs a few years ago.
The buyers (on both the houses) started asking for proof and certificates of all sorts of things. Gas Safe certificate, when was the boiler last serviced, what rating were the windows, when were the electrics last tested, does it need rewired.... and on it went. We politely but firmly told them to either buy the house as it stood, or go and buy something else. They stopped asking questions and bought the house.
No one ever asked about the obviously rotting mouldy twisted wooden windows that urgently needed replacing, or the 1970s fuses/wiring, but obsessed with a 6 month old pvc window in excellent condition.
Get the paperwork in order.
Whether you feel it is necessary isn't the point, plenty of buyers' will want to see them or have an Indemnity Policy to cover all works. Do you want to significantly delay or lose a sale for such small sums?
You should have or obtain, Electrical Installation Condition Report , Gas Safety Cert and service of boiler within last year, approvals for any works or indemnity policies to cover them. Get this done by the time the house goes on the market.
Both of my house sales required all of the above. The first was delayed by over a month as a result, the second I was prepared and the entire sale took 5 weeks.
Whether you feel it is necessary isn't the point, plenty of buyers' will want to see them or have an Indemnity Policy to cover all works. Do you want to significantly delay or lose a sale for such small sums?
You should have or obtain, Electrical Installation Condition Report , Gas Safety Cert and service of boiler within last year, approvals for any works or indemnity policies to cover them. Get this done by the time the house goes on the market.
Both of my house sales required all of the above. The first was delayed by over a month as a result, the second I was prepared and the entire sale took 5 weeks.
Solicitors seem to love indemnity policies but they really do seem like money down the drain. Often it's easier just to agree to one to avoid holding up a transaction, and it feels like that's what the whole business relies on – no one sane is going to risk scuppering a chain for the sake of a £40-120 policy.
M11rph said:
Get the paperwork in order.
Whether you feel it is necessary isn't the point, plenty of buyers' will want to see them or have an Indemnity Policy to cover all works. Do you want to significantly delay or lose a sale for such small sums?
You should have or obtain, Electrical Installation Condition Report , Gas Safety Cert and service of boiler within last year, approvals for any works or indemnity policies to cover them. Get this done by the time the house goes on the market.
Both of my house sales required all of the above. The first was delayed by over a month as a result, the second I was prepared and the entire sale took 5 weeks.
Personally, and this is just my view, I wouldn't do any of that on principle.Whether you feel it is necessary isn't the point, plenty of buyers' will want to see them or have an Indemnity Policy to cover all works. Do you want to significantly delay or lose a sale for such small sums?
You should have or obtain, Electrical Installation Condition Report , Gas Safety Cert and service of boiler within last year, approvals for any works or indemnity policies to cover them. Get this done by the time the house goes on the market.
Both of my house sales required all of the above. The first was delayed by over a month as a result, the second I was prepared and the entire sale took 5 weeks.
When you buy a house, you are buying a plot of land. One that happens to have a pile of bricks on it. All that happens once you buy it is on you, and you should be prepared for maintenance, repairs, improvements, and so on.
People stretch themselves so thin financially when buying a house these days, that they are treating it like buying a used car from a main dealership. They want it inspected, repaired, and warrantied like there is no tomorrow. They are terrified that stuff might be wrong with it, and that they won't have the money for repairs.
The upshot of this is that that buyers are becoming ever more aggressive at demanding that every last square inch is inspected, certified, warrantied, checked, and indemnified.
Buyers need to get back to accepting that the house they are buying may need work here and there. Because it's a house, and thats what happens with houses, they deteriorate.
As several of us have said, if someone wants a house, they will buy it. Even after you have refused to get the boiler served before they buy it.
cliffords said:
This is because it is purely a set of regulations that applies at the time of fitting. So if you fit a window, with the current glass applicable at that time , for thermal efficiency, as an example, you don't require a certificate. You do have to fit the right glass, or perhaps have trickle vents if it was today, but you don't need a certificate, you just need to comply with the regulations at that point in time .
There is a whole set of requirements, glass type being just an example.
I’d suggest you read section 35 of the building act - offence of contravening the building regulations.There is a whole set of requirements, glass type being just an example.
This is why indemnity policy exist and there is the procedure for making a retrospective application for approval.
These regulations are enforceable and non submission of an application required under regulation 16 is in itself also an offence.
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