Doing the brakes myself - need advice
Discussion
Well I am about to attempt a Brake upgrade on my 93L Chimaera. Having never done anything like this before I am looking for advice from anyone who has attempted this sort of thing.
I have just purchased a new set of Disks (GD082&GD086) and Pads (DP2415&DP2617), Both EBC bits.
I have an idea of how to do it, I just want to know what to look out for especially in the caliper area. How do I prepair them for what is obviously a thicker disk and pads. I know I need a caliper spreader (I'll pick that up tonight). But how do I clean up the caliper pistons, which must be thick with brake dust and crud? What cleaning stuff should I use? Are there any special tools I should get? How long should I allow?
General comments please
Daniel
I have just purchased a new set of Disks (GD082&GD086) and Pads (DP2415&DP2617), Both EBC bits.
I have an idea of how to do it, I just want to know what to look out for especially in the caliper area. How do I prepair them for what is obviously a thicker disk and pads. I know I need a caliper spreader (I'll pick that up tonight). But how do I clean up the caliper pistons, which must be thick with brake dust and crud? What cleaning stuff should I use? Are there any special tools I should get? How long should I allow?
General comments please
Daniel
I am not sure what you mean by a caliper 'spreader', but if the disks are thicker you will need to split the calipers and put in spacers of the correct size. These need to be for your particular calipers to ensure correct fitting and no fluid leaks. Given the importance of brakes I recommend a specialist does the work, it is not an area of the car to risk mistakes.
quote:
I just want to know what to look out for especially in the caliper area. How do I prepair them for what is obviously a thicker disk and pads. I know I need a caliper spreader (I'll pick that up tonight). But how do I clean up the caliper pistons, which must be thick with brake dust and crud? What cleaning stuff should I use? Are there any special tools I should get? How long should I allow?
If you're simply replacing worn out pads and discs with new ones the original size all you need to do is clean the calipers (brake cleaner helps), push back the piston (Ford tool required to wind in the rear calipers, fronts just push in) and refit everything. Allow half an hour per corner the first time but you'll probably do it in half that once you've got the hang of it. Bleeding is optional but recommended.
If you're talking about fitting bigger diameter and/or thickness rotors, this is a different kettle of fish altogether and not a job to be tackled lightly.
Cheers,
Peter Humphries (and a green V8S)
Will need to undertake a similar job myself soon enough. Done plenty of these in the past, but so that I can steel myself - I take it that the disks don't have any supplementary fixings, i.e. it's a rubber hammer job once the wheel and caliper are off. There's no hub nut surprises out there?
No, Manek is absolutely right. The rotor is clamped between the wheel and the hub, it is also trapped by the fixed part of the caliper. You definitely don't have to undo the big 'nut' in the middle of the wheel (it isn't a nut, it is to locate the hub while you undo the nut on the inside, something you definitely don't want to do).
With the wheel off the rotor is loose, but still trapped by the caliper. If you want to replace the rotor too you need to take the whole caliper off by undoing the two bolts attaching it to the upright - they're behind the caliper and a bit awkward to get at.
If you don't want to replace the rotor you can save quite a lot of time by splitting the caliper at the sliders and leaving the fixed 'bridge' attached to the upright.
Hope this makes sense,
Peter Humphries (and a green V8S)
With the wheel off the rotor is loose, but still trapped by the caliper. If you want to replace the rotor too you need to take the whole caliper off by undoing the two bolts attaching it to the upright - they're behind the caliper and a bit awkward to get at.
If you don't want to replace the rotor you can save quite a lot of time by splitting the caliper at the sliders and leaving the fixed 'bridge' attached to the upright.
Hope this makes sense,
Peter Humphries (and a green V8S)
The discs don't just fall off when you remove the caliper! the mount/slide bracket most be removed first,use good tools because the cap bolts are very tight(thread locked)and little room with the rears.Watch for displaced brake fluid when pushing the pistons back, if your going to bleed them anyway crack a bleed nipple when moving the pistons and vent excess in to a jar .Use a light coat of copper slip on the pad backs,piston edges and caliper slider also use Dot 4/5.1 fluid to bleed the system.Torque settings for the caliper bracket to upright are 43-44ft-lbs,good luck.
Once the two allen bolts attaching the caliper assembly to the hub upright are removed, the caliper assembly can be pulled away and the disc will be free. It is fixed in place only by virtue of being clamped between hub and wheel, the caliper stops the disc from falling off when the wheel is removed.
Now here's a funny thing. Having replaced my wishbones and bushes, I am busy putting my front end back together. I have 2 problems, one related to this posting. Firstly, having attached upright to wishbones, roll bar and steering arm, I now find that offering up the calipers to the disc (temporarily clamped to the hub with 2 wheel nuts) there is a gap of about 8mm between hub mounting and caliper. As I tighten the caliper bolts to close the gap the caliper body clamps onto the disc. I don't remember there being any spacer, so what have I done wrong?
Second problem. I can't tighten the lock nut on the bottom UV joint. The nut is on as far as the nyloc insert, but now the whole joint spins with it and there is no way to clamp it. I have tried jacking up underneath the bottom wishbone to force the joint into the hub housing to create enough friction to allow the nut to turn (it worked for the steering arm joint) - but it still turns. I've applied nut lock liberally to the joint faces last night, and will try again tonight when its had time to set. Hopefully this will do the job, but if not, any ideas anyone?
Now here's a funny thing. Having replaced my wishbones and bushes, I am busy putting my front end back together. I have 2 problems, one related to this posting. Firstly, having attached upright to wishbones, roll bar and steering arm, I now find that offering up the calipers to the disc (temporarily clamped to the hub with 2 wheel nuts) there is a gap of about 8mm between hub mounting and caliper. As I tighten the caliper bolts to close the gap the caliper body clamps onto the disc. I don't remember there being any spacer, so what have I done wrong?
Second problem. I can't tighten the lock nut on the bottom UV joint. The nut is on as far as the nyloc insert, but now the whole joint spins with it and there is no way to clamp it. I have tried jacking up underneath the bottom wishbone to force the joint into the hub housing to create enough friction to allow the nut to turn (it worked for the steering arm joint) - but it still turns. I've applied nut lock liberally to the joint faces last night, and will try again tonight when its had time to set. Hopefully this will do the job, but if not, any ideas anyone?
quote:
Now here's a funny thing. Having replaced my wishbones and bushes, I am busy putting my front end back together. I have 2 problems, one related to this posting. Firstly, having attached upright to wishbones, roll bar and steering arm, I now find that offering up the calipers to the disc (temporarily clamped to the hub with 2 wheel nuts) there is a gap of about 8mm between hub mounting and caliper. As I tighten the caliper bolts to close the gap the caliper body clamps onto the disc. I don't remember there being any spacer, so what have I done wrong?
The caliper is in two parts - the fixed frame which you are bolting to the upright, and the cylinder/bridge which is attached to the frame with two slides. Which of these two is fouling on the disc? Could be the sliders have twisted and jammed while you had it off the car? If you offer up the caliper with the disc removed, you should be able to slide the floating part sideways so that it lines up with where the disc would be. If it won't line up, could it be you're trying to fit the calipers to the upright from the wrong side (i.e. inboard of the upright rather than outboard)?
quote:
Second problem. I can't tighten the lock nut on the bottom UV joint. The nut is on as far as the nyloc insert, but now the whole joint spins with it and there is no way to clamp it. I have tried jacking up underneath the bottom wishbone to force the joint into the hub housing to create enough friction to allow the nut to turn (it worked for the steering arm joint) - but it still turns. I've applied nut lock liberally to the joint faces last night, and will try again tonight when its had time to set. Hopefully this will do the job, but if not, any ideas anyone?
Clamping them together is the right approach. Small preload and gentle tapping with a mallet to jam them together should be enough unless the Nyloc is *really* tight?
Philshort
When I changed the discs on my '95 500, I NEARLY forgot 2 washers that I hadn't noticed on taking the calipers off.
They were between the caliper mounting bracket and the caliper itself, NOT under the bolt head. This took up the extra space I seemed to have between the disc and the hub when I offered up the caliper. Hope this helps!
Additionally, I didn't have the special tool for the rear caliper pistons. Using the arms of a set of pliers and a bit of pressure does do it, along with some 'tapping'
- eventually!
When I changed the discs on my '95 500, I NEARLY forgot 2 washers that I hadn't noticed on taking the calipers off.
They were between the caliper mounting bracket and the caliper itself, NOT under the bolt head. This took up the extra space I seemed to have between the disc and the hub when I offered up the caliper. Hope this helps!
Additionally, I didn't have the special tool for the rear caliper pistons. Using the arms of a set of pliers and a bit of pressure does do it, along with some 'tapping'
- eventually!Its the part with the pins, which bolts to the upright, which is fouling the disc. No problem, the car is off to Peninsula to get Nitrons fitted, the suspension aligned, and braided hoses fitted. They'll have to fit the calipers first! The rubber hoses are clamped tight, and theres a note on the steering wheel - "NO BRAKES!"
I think I made a rod for my own back with the ball joints by scrupulously cleaning the housing and lubricating with CopaSlip before assembly. Not too much of a surprise then that the joint won't stay still! I may have to pop the joint again and dry it all off.
Good news is I have all 4 wheels on again for the first time in 12 months, she rolled out into the sunlight today, and fired up with a jump start from the trusty Audi. What a glorious noise! It's going to seem a long time till May 21st (when Peninsula collect).
I think I made a rod for my own back with the ball joints by scrupulously cleaning the housing and lubricating with CopaSlip before assembly. Not too much of a surprise then that the joint won't stay still! I may have to pop the joint again and dry it all off.
Good news is I have all 4 wheels on again for the first time in 12 months, she rolled out into the sunlight today, and fired up with a jump start from the trusty Audi. What a glorious noise! It's going to seem a long time till May 21st (when Peninsula collect).
ianwayne
That would explain it! All I need do now is find the washers!
Cheers mate!
Actually, I did find a couple of really thick washers this afternoon when I moved the car out of the garage. Only two of them though, so I'll have to fiddle about with normal washers to get the right thickness. At least I have some so I know what the right thickness is!
>> Edited by philshort on Sunday 14th April 00:07
That would explain it! All I need do now is find the washers!
Cheers mate!
Actually, I did find a couple of really thick washers this afternoon when I moved the car out of the garage. Only two of them though, so I'll have to fiddle about with normal washers to get the right thickness. At least I have some so I know what the right thickness is!
>> Edited by philshort on Sunday 14th April 00:07
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