Police raids and battering rams
Discussion
NeMiSiS said:
I have seen a door frame spreader used, it is almost silent. It uses a small portable drill to wind a threaded bar attached to two jaws, this spreads the door frame and clears the locks.
I've never seen the Police use it though.
We stopped using the spreader as the teeth dig into the frames and are almost impossible to remove quickly so you have a barrier that you have to hurdle or limbo to gain entry. We also had a suitcase ram that put an airbag through the door in a tenth of a second, after an officer had a near miss when it came backwards it was also binned. I've never seen the Police use it though.
Rabbit, Crows Foot, Hooligan Bar, Tear Down, Disruptor or Enforcer, most work well in dynamic entry, silent entries are also dealt with quite easily with other bits of kit..
We taught our County Fire service how to MOE as they were only using sledge hammers and axes. They do it properly and safely now.
NinjaPower said:
I worked in housing, as you can imagine with sort of people that sometimes get housed in Social Housing, Police raids on our properties were a monthly/weekly occourance.
The rule of thumb was that if drugs or other illegal goings on were found and arrests were made, then fair enough the Police rightly broke the door down and we passed the bill for the damage to the resident of the property.
But if a house was raided and nothing was found and no one was arrested for anything, we sent the bill for the door to the Police and they usually paid it surprisingly, as it was seen that they damaged someone's property for no good reason.
As a landlord myself, and further to my earlier posts, this is the second time that the police have instituted “a smashed down a door” strategy, to gain a quick entry to an empty property. On both occasions the young officer’s excitement overruled any common sense. The rule of thumb was that if drugs or other illegal goings on were found and arrests were made, then fair enough the Police rightly broke the door down and we passed the bill for the damage to the resident of the property.
But if a house was raided and nothing was found and no one was arrested for anything, we sent the bill for the door to the Police and they usually paid it surprisingly, as it was seen that they damaged someone's property for no good reason.
Robbo101 said:
Wings, why do you expect your claim to be settled ? Do you expect the Police to wait around for several hours, making polite (& time consuming enquiries) with all & sundry as to the wherabouts of the missing person ? And all the time the party concerned is lying behind a door suffering the effects of a cardiac arrest ?
Whilst I fully appreciate that its inconvenient in the extreme to have your house damaged in this way, the alternative is that the Police do undertake exhaustive enquiries & during the process, the individual dies. The Police then receive a 7 figure claim from the deceaseds dependants &/or estate, the Officers concerned are subject to an internal disciplanary enquiry by there Proffesional Standards Dept & the IPCC & more imortantly a person who could have been saved had a forced entry been made, is now dead. Its very easy to be wise with the benefit f hindsight, though sadly this is not something that is available to the Officers.
A fairly extreme example I agree, but its far from unique & in todays risk adverse Society, its not something the Police want to take a chance on.
Oh & so as to avoid the possibilty of this occuring again, if your tenant is going to be out of the property for any length of time, it might be advantagous for them to tell the BiB of this so so they have a record.
We used to go on our hols for 6 weeks every summer in the '70s, and I can remember my dad ringing the local police station to let them know we would not be there for 'the duration' but Betty from No.21 had a key and would be checking up on the place every few days...Whilst I fully appreciate that its inconvenient in the extreme to have your house damaged in this way, the alternative is that the Police do undertake exhaustive enquiries & during the process, the individual dies. The Police then receive a 7 figure claim from the deceaseds dependants &/or estate, the Officers concerned are subject to an internal disciplanary enquiry by there Proffesional Standards Dept & the IPCC & more imortantly a person who could have been saved had a forced entry been made, is now dead. Its very easy to be wise with the benefit f hindsight, though sadly this is not something that is available to the Officers.
A fairly extreme example I agree, but its far from unique & in todays risk adverse Society, its not something the Police want to take a chance on.
Oh & so as to avoid the possibilty of this occuring again, if your tenant is going to be out of the property for any length of time, it might be advantagous for them to tell the BiB of this so so they have a record.
I doubt very much this happens nowadays! My mum still lives in the same house, and said local police station (to her house - her "local police station" is 5 miles away in a different town nowadays) closed probably 20 years ago - after several years as a "counter open 2 hours a week satellite police station" - and accessibility has got steadily worse since
. Current proposals are that the "area" police station (3 miles away, and currently open 24/7) will be open "office hours only" and the current 3 other stations that are open "office hours" will shut. As above, the "local police station" for my mum's village is now 5 miles away (and will soon shut for access to the punters).
Ditto where I currently live; at the moment, 3 police stations are open "office hours" and the "main" one is open 24/7 - proposed is the "main" one opens "office hours only" and the other three will close to the public.
This will improve service, apparently, with comments about Argos and the persons-in-blue making home visits in response to telephone calls (or so the propoganda in the local press says).
Just the story of police stations in two adjacent greater madchester towns, you understand...
Ringing the non-emergency number to ask for the local control room, so I can tell them I'm going away, doesn't have the same confidence-building connotations to me nowadays. I'd rather ask my neighbours to keep an eye out
.BonzoG said:
On the intro to 'Cop Squad' on Sky last night, they showed a police officer using a chain saw to rather conclusively create a hole in a door.
I never saw past the intro, but I liked his style. Certainly saved faffing about with locks and battering rams and suchlike.
iv seen it used aswell.I never saw past the intro, but I liked his style. Certainly saved faffing about with locks and battering rams and suchlike.
its a chainsaw with a guard covering most of the blade so theres only about the last 4 inches exposed.
they saw the door from top to bottom and walk in.
Mr Sparkle said:
Most doors now days open inwards, but what about the solid outwards opening kind? I would have thought they would be quite ineffective against these? In the police shows I have only seen their use on the UPVC doors.
The bosher is only one part of the kit (assuming the other parts aren't broken or missing, with no budget to replace - an all too common reality) and there are ways of opening outward opening doors.
Deva Link said:
Danesgate said:
I have yet to see the more rapid entry methods shown
Dutch Police - watch the video:http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-12...
Edited by Deva Link on Tuesday 9th August 22:17
Mr Sparkle said:
Most doors now days open inwards, but what about the solid outwards opening kind? I would have thought they would be quite ineffective against these? In the police shows I have only seen their use on the UPVC doors.
Hooli Bar and Sledgehammer. Usually works a treat.Just don't tread on one if it's not been lay down correctly!
dudleybloke said:
iv seen it used aswell.
its a chainsaw with a guard covering most of the blade so theres only about the last 4 inches exposed.
they saw the door from top to bottom and walk in.
Seems a bit of a stupid thing to use, they'd be far better of with a portable TCT saw blade, you'd be in within seconds.its a chainsaw with a guard covering most of the blade so theres only about the last 4 inches exposed.
they saw the door from top to bottom and walk in.
Or just mount the bloody door ram on the front of the squad cars...
PhillipM said:
dudleybloke said:
iv seen it used aswell.
its a chainsaw with a guard covering most of the blade so theres only about the last 4 inches exposed.
they saw the door from top to bottom and walk in.
Seems a bit of a stupid thing to use, they'd be far better of with a portable TCT saw blade, you'd be in within seconds.its a chainsaw with a guard covering most of the blade so theres only about the last 4 inches exposed.
they saw the door from top to bottom and walk in.
Or just mount the bloody door ram on the front of the squad cars...
GC8 said:
After concerns about beads, and bump keys, I upgraded my outer door with a pair of 500+ kilo holding force elctro-magnetic locks.
Its now as hard to get into as the vault in Nakatomi Plaza...
Bump keys are over hyped. You have to be quite skilled and it's not silent. Its now as hard to get into as the vault in Nakatomi Plaza...
I'm just waiting for the daily mail to run a story on this.
If you're worried about them you can simply put anti bump oil in the lock, as the bumping is the pins bouncing and the oil stops this.
Besides. You door maybe secure but I bet there's a window that's insecure by comparison.
...or I could buy anti-bump replacement Euro-locks; but Ive seen an expensive Euro-lock cylinder drilled in 20 seconds and the door opened.
I appreciate what youre saying about windows (and of course, by strengthening the doors enough you make the windows the weakest link); but that is not the case in my particular circumstance.
I appreciate what youre saying about windows (and of course, by strengthening the doors enough you make the windows the weakest link); but that is not the case in my particular circumstance.
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