ACPO an "unaccountable club"
Discussion
davepoth said:
For example, FoI requests cannot be made on ACPO. Considering how deeply they are involved with formulating Police policy at government level, that troubles me.
I think ACPO are now included within FoI so you can now request info.For me the conflict comes with commercial activity, as a private company they don't have to go to tender for business, so I can just imagine all that business for police forces being shoved though as 'ACPO-led' - no doubt to consultancy firms run by ex police or something like that.
I've done business with ACPO, as recently as January and over a number of years, they definitely disguise themselves as government run, no doubt about it.
I think NPIA was the nearest government run organisation that we had to ACPO, but NPIA died a death because it has no powers of mandate.
IroningMan said:
A national police service would eliminate the need for ACPO and its commercial interests at a stroke.
And save a mint, too.
I'm not sure that is entirely true. There would still have to be local commanders, of ACPO level, and they would form their own club. There would still need to be local ACPO style officers for gold.And save a mint, too.
In my experience the norm for an amalgamation is an increase in the number of supervisors.
Deva Link said:
mph1977 said:
..where's the 'for profit' in that ?
The people who work for it do pretty well out if it.And not being a 'proper' public body means they escape much of the scutiny that would normally apply to such an organisation.
Rovinghawk said:
mph1977 said:
ACPO is company no. 03344583
"Company Type: PRI/LBG/NSC (Private, Limited by guarantee, no share capital, use of 'Limited' exemption)
Nature of Business (SIC):
94120 - Activities of professional membership organizations"
where's the 'for profit' in that ?
"Company Type: PRI/LBG/NSC (Private, Limited by guarantee, no share capital, use of 'Limited' exemption)
Nature of Business (SIC):
94120 - Activities of professional membership organizations"
where's the 'for profit' in that ?
Apparently it doesn't have profits; it has an 'annual surplus'.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1145581/Bo...
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/law-and-ord...
mph1977 said:
ACPO has not charitable outputs and therefore can't register as a charity, Company limited by guarantee status is often used by charities to give the organisation a legal 'person'
ACPO Ltd. having the same business registration as some charities is a very long way from being a charity itself.mph1977 said:
a lot of the whinges about ACPOs company status are from those ignorant of the need for a organisation to be / have 'corporate person'
Please tell us ignorati why there is a need.Edited by Rovinghawk on Sunday 19th May 21:51
davepoth said:
Deva Link said:
The people who work for it do pretty well out if it.
And not being a 'proper' public body means they escape much of the scutiny that would normally apply to such an organisation.
For example, FoI requests cannot be made on ACPO. Considering how deeply they are involved with formulating Police policy at government level, that troubles me.And not being a 'proper' public body means they escape much of the scutiny that would normally apply to such an organisation.
ACPO don;t actually set anything ...
would you rather ACPO were a pointless quango bloated with snivel serpents ? or a secret cabal ?
company limited by guarantee is the best compromise
as for the poster referring to 'ACPO plc' please come back when you understand the basic types of company structure and the differences between Ltd and PLC, as all you are doing is demonstrating your utter ignorance ...
at least you aren't putting lies in the local newspaper i suppose ( as has been seen by a number of volunteers in a well known charity undertaking substantial reform of structures to address it;s 8 million GBP / year loss - where people who have lost their little fiefdom or feel it at threat are making all sorts of outlandish claims in the local press ...
no moving your used for 3 hours a week ambulance 5 miles down the road where it will be used more often ( as well as the three hours a week you use it ) is not a 'betrayal' of the community, neither is suggesting that an ex WW1 army hut which lies empty for 162 hours a week is not a suitable use of charitable funds when there are several other , newer DDA compliant community use halls in that town )
mph1977 said:
Mr Roving of the family Hawk claiming ignorance on the importance of the 'legal person' ... well my, my . i thought the entire freewibbler creed is based around the fact that the 'legal person' whether that of an actual person or of a body corporate is the thing that engages in contracts and deals in the 'admiralty courts'
WTF are you on about?Would you be so kind as to explain your earlier comment I queried?
RH
Rovinghawk said:
mph1977 said:
Mr Roving of the family Hawk claiming ignorance on the importance of the 'legal person' ... well my, my . i thought the entire freewibbler creed is based around the fact that the 'legal person' whether that of an actual person or of a body corporate is the thing that engages in contracts and deals in the 'admiralty courts'
WTF are you on about?Would you be so kind as to explain your earlier comment I queried?
RH
http://bookshop.blackwell.co.uk/extracts/978019954...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legal_personality
, but 'legal persona'? Surely a company formed in any way is a legal person?mph1977 said:
but anything fro mthe Home Office, ODPM , territorial or special police forces can be FoId ...
ACPO don;t actually set anything ...
would you rather ACPO were a pointless quango bloated with snivel serpents ? or a secret cabal ?
company limited by guarantee is the best compromise
as for the poster referring to 'ACPO plc' please come back when you understand the basic types of company structure and the differences between Ltd and PLC, as all you are doing is demonstrating your utter ignorance ...
at least you aren't putting lies in the local newspaper i suppose ( as has been seen by a number of volunteers in a well known charity undertaking substantial reform of structures to address it;s 8 million GBP / year loss - where people who have lost their little fiefdom or feel it at threat are making all sorts of outlandish claims in the local press ...
no moving your used for 3 hours a week ambulance 5 miles down the road where it will be used more often ( as well as the three hours a week you use it ) is not a 'betrayal' of the community, neither is suggesting that an ex WW1 army hut which lies empty for 162 hours a week is not a suitable use of charitable funds when there are several other , newer DDA compliant community use halls in that town )
Says here ACPO is a plc? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Association_of_Chief_...ACPO don;t actually set anything ...
would you rather ACPO were a pointless quango bloated with snivel serpents ? or a secret cabal ?
company limited by guarantee is the best compromise
as for the poster referring to 'ACPO plc' please come back when you understand the basic types of company structure and the differences between Ltd and PLC, as all you are doing is demonstrating your utter ignorance ...
at least you aren't putting lies in the local newspaper i suppose ( as has been seen by a number of volunteers in a well known charity undertaking substantial reform of structures to address it;s 8 million GBP / year loss - where people who have lost their little fiefdom or feel it at threat are making all sorts of outlandish claims in the local press ...
no moving your used for 3 hours a week ambulance 5 miles down the road where it will be used more often ( as well as the three hours a week you use it ) is not a 'betrayal' of the community, neither is suggesting that an ex WW1 army hut which lies empty for 162 hours a week is not a suitable use of charitable funds when there are several other , newer DDA compliant community use halls in that town )
Blatant racketeers!
Stick 'em in pokey with all the rest of the Scam Camera Parasites (and Big Bubba!)!
Stick 'em in pokey with all the rest of the Scam Camera Parasites (and Big Bubba!)!
premio said:
Says here ACPO is a plc? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Association_of_Chief_...
plc = private limited company in this case, not public.Some good bedtime reading:
http://www.theftprotect.co.uk/library/justice/The%...
http://www.theftprotect.co.uk/library/justice/The%...
mph1977 said:
as for the poster referring to 'ACPO plc' please come back when you understand the basic types of company structure and the differences between Ltd and PLC, as all you are doing is demonstrating your utter ignorance ...
There's never a whoosh parrot when you need it!
GC8 said:
Mill Wheel said:
Not everyone at ACPO is a senior policeman!
However I accept the bit about them serving their own interests... especially the RSS division!
Their so called expert who wrote the speed meter handbook has shown at times to be a bit less expert than he claims, lies about his other (failed) business interests, and his membership of a professional body!
I wonder if Ken McDonald is even aware of that little bed of thorns yet?
Is this the sad little weasel of a man that I think it is? I had been told that he worked for a SCP, but now understand that it is this self-serving shower of b*stards.However I accept the bit about them serving their own interests... especially the RSS division!
Their so called expert who wrote the speed meter handbook has shown at times to be a bit less expert than he claims, lies about his other (failed) business interests, and his membership of a professional body!
I wonder if Ken McDonald is even aware of that little bed of thorns yet?
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