Police RTC....motorcycle pursuit....
Discussion
Motorbike crash in police pursuit
Two people have been injured following a police pursuit in Greater Manchester on Friday night.
Police were attempting to stop a Honda motorbike in Hindley Green, Wigan.
The rider failed to pull over and sped around a left hand bend on Leigh Road before colliding with a Vauxhall Corsa coming the other way, police said.
The 21-year-old rider from Leigh suffered a broken ankle and his 13-year-old pillion passenger suffered a suspected broken leg.
Both rider and passenger were taken to Wigan Royal Infirmary for treatment and are expected to be questioned on Saturday.
Nobody else was injured and Greater Manchester Police are appealing for witnesses.
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Another 'incident' which will be used in the campaign to withdraw the police powers to pursue fleeing vehicles...
Streetcop said:
Motorbike crash in police pursuit
Two people have been injured following a police pursuit in Greater Manchester on Friday night.
Police were attempting to stop a Honda motorbike in Hindley Green, Wigan.
The rider failed to pull over and sped around a left hand bend on Leigh Road before colliding with a Vauxhall Corsa coming the other way, police said.
The 21-year-old rider from Leigh suffered a broken ankle and his 13-year-old pillion passenger suffered a suspected broken leg.
Both rider and passenger were taken to Wigan Royal Infirmary for treatment and are expected to be questioned on Saturday.
Nobody else was injured and Greater Manchester Police are appealing for witnesses.
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Another 'incident' which will be used in the campaign to withdraw the police powers to pursue fleeing vehicles...
Could I humbly suggest Street (me 'umble ?) that a good way of stopping the campaign is for *everyone* to take a rational view of Police actions.
At the moment, the media are saying the Police are to blame for *everything*, but the Police say they're to blame for *nothing*.
Common sense would suggest both are talking rubbish.
If you (Police Force) don't police yourselves properly, eventually someone else will, and it'll be draconian.
Streetcop said:
If you (Police Force) don't police yourselves properly, eventually someone else will, and it'll be draconian.
With the advent of Professional Standards Departments, the independant police complaints commission etc etc..the police have never been POLICED as much..
Yes but these people are tickers and stampers. They pervade every aspect of public life like a terminal cancer. Can't you lot plant some drugs on them and fit them up for a few armed robberies? Do us all a fovour and get the idiots out of our hair.
Streetcop said:
If you (Police Force) don't police yourselves properly, eventually someone else will, and it'll be draconian.
With the advent of Professional Standards Departments, the independant police complaints commission etc etc..the police have never been POLICED as much..
There is a viewpoint - and there are some very good examples of non-action - that the Police investigate everything, but some more than others, and it is the degree of effort and of course money that goes into the investigation that determines the result.
Remember the bloke who kicked the restrained guy did so quite deliberately (and this is something I do know something about).
He is what you don't want in the force. He should have been made an example of, not protected.
As the bloke who was kicked said, if I and four mates held a copper on the floor and kicked his head in on video, we'd all have been locked up (and quite rightly).
Meanwhile, some poor junior is hammered for being a bit hard with the baton..... which is just farcical.
Your "investigation" system would appear to be a shambles.
autismuk said:
He is what you don't want in the force. He should have been made an example of, not protected.
autismuk said:
Your "investigation" system would appear to be a shambles.
Looking in from outside..you might think that way..
Some of us, know otherwise...
If the police service
can make an example of an officer to show how 'above board' we all are; let me tell you; It will... As for comparison with offences; you clip someone's ear who has broken into your car and you'll get a caution (at the most)..probably nothing. The police officer who does it; will get prosecuted and will more than likely serve time in prison...
nonegreen said:
Yes but these people are tickers and stampers. They pervade every aspect of public life like a terminal cancer. Can't you lot plant some drugs on them and fit them up for a few armed robberies? Do us all a fovour and get the idiots out of our hair.
Absolutely, more moronic bureaucrats. What you want is a sensible, simple, disciplinary system run by coppers. Weed out the few - the very very few bad coppers, and give the decent majority a bit of leeway.
Cops are human beings (honest ;-)) and will make mistakes sometimes. There's a whale of difference between an honest error of judgement and deliberate fiddling.
Simple examples.
The cop who was recently charged with heavy batoning - should have had a bollocking from his Senior Officer (if the complaint was right) about self control etc.
The cop who deliberately hid evidence to get innocent men convicted in the GMP - should be locked up.
(I know someone (now released from jail) who was the victim of a similar blatant evidence-hiding fix, the cop in question got internal disciplinary action only, pathetic)
Streetcop said:
autismuk...
The current policing of the police is the best that it's ever been. Fact.
Christ..not long ago if you went into a police station to complain about a police officer; you'd get roughed up and 'advised'..(so I hear..)
So an improvement from criminal to barely adequate?
>> Edited by MilnerR on Sunday 6th February 15:49
MilnerR said:
So an improvement from criminal to barely adequate?
Some might say..
What exactly is 'barely adequate'...ie: if you have a complaint against the police nowadays, it WILL be listened to and WILL be acted upon. If proved the officer WILL be disciplined. If not, nothing will happen.
Streetcop said:
the police have never been POLICED as much..
Apparently not nearly enough if the media are to be believed. Seems that occifers in a certain plod station have been using police "resources" <aka> computers and internet access to play "pass the porn" while on duty.
Not exactly what we pay em for....
Streetcop said:
If the police service
As for comparison with offences; you clip someone's ear who has broken into your car and you'll get a caution (at the most)..probably nothing. The police officer who does it; will get prosecuted and will more than likely serve time in prison...
Ah, that's the problem. "Making an example". The poor BiB you mentioned in another thread is one of those.
It's too variable. That's the point. It's not that nothing is done ; it's that there is absolutely no sanity.
A Policeman who clips a kid around the ear should get a bollocking. A Policeman who kicks a guy restrained on the floor should be sacked and imprisoned.
But it seems that it's the other way round !
I have had no dealings with police complaints procedure (i had recourse to a number of years ago but the officers in question used the rough up and advise technique and i decided life was too short), so i can't really comment apart from the snippets that appear in the press. It would seem that its set up to cover senior officers from being accused of negligence or corruption. To appear to be tough on police misconduct without being very fair to the public or the BiB, hence barely adequate.
imho
>> Edited by MilnerR on Sunday 6th February 16:00
imho
>> Edited by MilnerR on Sunday 6th February 16:00
Back to the topic;
This is what a BiB recently wrote on a BiB chat room;
I’m not really a driver. I don’t particularly like driving, but careering through the town centre at 60mph is quite exciting. Some police officers take the whole business of driving very seriously though, they go on courses so they can drive really quickly to catch suspects who are “making off” in vehicles.
Unfortunately for them, ACPO has decided that we are crashing too often and so they have introduced tight guidelines about how and when pursuits can take place.
Pursuits will only be allowed under the following circumstances:
1) Only suitably trained officers in suitable vehicles (ie: class 1 drivers in T5's and Omegas) are involved, dog vans are forbidden!!.
2) There are at least 3 such units in a division / territory to allow for swift use of T-Pac or stopstick. Cross county runs to help are not acceptable.
3) The weather is good.
4) The pursuit is on open road and not heading towards an urban or residential area.
What are the chances of these criteria actually being met at the time a pursuit actually starts?
However, it doesn’t stop there, ACPO are now moving towards a policy of absolutely no pursuits at all, in any circumstances, so nervous are they of the media. So if you’ve just stolen a car, or if you just don’t feel like stopping for the police because you’ve just committed some other crime, or if you’re so drunk you don’t know what you’re doing, drive on into the sunset because it’s just too dangerous for us to do anything about it.
This is what a BiB recently wrote on a BiB chat room;
I’m not really a driver. I don’t particularly like driving, but careering through the town centre at 60mph is quite exciting. Some police officers take the whole business of driving very seriously though, they go on courses so they can drive really quickly to catch suspects who are “making off” in vehicles.
Unfortunately for them, ACPO has decided that we are crashing too often and so they have introduced tight guidelines about how and when pursuits can take place.
Pursuits will only be allowed under the following circumstances:
1) Only suitably trained officers in suitable vehicles (ie: class 1 drivers in T5's and Omegas) are involved, dog vans are forbidden!!.
2) There are at least 3 such units in a division / territory to allow for swift use of T-Pac or stopstick. Cross county runs to help are not acceptable.
3) The weather is good.
4) The pursuit is on open road and not heading towards an urban or residential area.
What are the chances of these criteria actually being met at the time a pursuit actually starts?
However, it doesn’t stop there, ACPO are now moving towards a policy of absolutely no pursuits at all, in any circumstances, so nervous are they of the media. So if you’ve just stolen a car, or if you just don’t feel like stopping for the police because you’ve just committed some other crime, or if you’re so drunk you don’t know what you’re doing, drive on into the sunset because it’s just too dangerous for us to do anything about it.
Streetcop said:
Back to the topic;
This is what a BiB recently wrote on a BiB chat room;
I’m not really a driver. I don’t particularly like driving, but careering through the town centre at 60mph is quite exciting. Some police officers take the whole business of driving very seriously though, they go on courses so they can drive really quickly to catch suspects who are “making off” in vehicles.
Unfortunately for them, ACPO has decided that we are crashing too often and so they have introduced tight guidelines about how and when pursuits can take place.
Street, could you please frame up ACPO at the same time as framing up the investigators
My view is that there are two problems.
Firstly, there are a few bad apples in the force, just as there are in any other area of life. I can't say I've met the good ones yet but I'm happy enough to accept that my impression of the force hasn't been representative.
The Force should get rid of those bad apples and make sure that all officers follow a set of guidelines - I know they're supposed to now but not all of them do.
Secondly, the Force needs to be separated from politics. All the time the top plods pander to the govt and implement Bliar's mad schemes, the public will not support the police.
The police should be independant, be seen to be independant and shold be open too - no secrets.
Until these happen the Force will be in decline - not in numbers but in the level of respect and cooperation it receives from the public and without these, it is nothing and will never succeed.
Firstly, there are a few bad apples in the force, just as there are in any other area of life. I can't say I've met the good ones yet but I'm happy enough to accept that my impression of the force hasn't been representative.
The Force should get rid of those bad apples and make sure that all officers follow a set of guidelines - I know they're supposed to now but not all of them do.
Secondly, the Force needs to be separated from politics. All the time the top plods pander to the govt and implement Bliar's mad schemes, the public will not support the police.
The police should be independant, be seen to be independant and shold be open too - no secrets.
Until these happen the Force will be in decline - not in numbers but in the level of respect and cooperation it receives from the public and without these, it is nothing and will never succeed.
autismuk said:
Might be getting threads confused. Someone suggested your internal investigations team should be got rid of. Suggest the same with ACPO.
The 'internal affairs' or Professional Standards Departments NEED to exist to give the public confidence and ensure that the 'bad apples' are dealt with.
However, the PSDs seem more interested in looking for officers who have submitted reports late, or have left their patrol cars unlocked in the car park, or who have applied handcuffs too tight..rather than really tackling anything serious..(if there is in fact anything serious to tackle)
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